What's the update on this one?



Is that Manchester and Hwy 109?

It's a little east of 109 along 100. It's still being built. I haven't been out that way in quite a while, so I can't comment as to how far along it is. I believe they are planning a 7-8 story hotel in the area as well.

Downtowns are successful when you have people working/living/shopping in one central area. Western suburbs were developed laterally, rather than in a central grid. Imagine all the stores in a downtown instead of being 16 blocks (4 X 4) have 16 blocks long of those stores stretched along a single major road with suburbia behind. Then throw in super big box stores, multiple gas stations, super markets etc. You have Manchester from Lindbergh west.

Downtowns in outer burbs exist, but a lot of those exurbs were built with the highway in mind, rather than their epicenter or downtown. There are old downtowns in a lot of the exurbs around St. Louis, but they aren't what they used to be because the city was consumed by sprawl, and recentered around the highway system to accomodate those moving out.

This reminds me a lot of a development in the southwest part of Columbia, Mo., but I cannot remember the name. There's a town square with retail on the first floor, offices on the second, and homes nearby.



For this development in Wildwood, does anyone know if residential is part of the plan? And if not, are there residential developments nearby (either existing or proposed) where one could walk from their home to the businesses here?



At any rate, it's better than "Beautiful Downtown Ballwin", as the folks at The Dean Team Volkswagen/Subaru say...

ThreeOneFour wrote:This reminds me a lot of a development in the southwest part of Columbia, Mo., but I cannot remember the name. There's a town square with retail on the first floor, offices on the second, and homes nearby.

I think you're referring to the Village of Cherry Hill near the intersection of Chapel Hill Rd. and Scotts Blvd.

^ That's it! Thank you! I haven't been to Columbia in awhile, so I couldn't remember the exact name or location.

I drove by this on monday, there are two "town center developments" within just a few miles right there on Manchester. Closer to Clarkson is "Ellisville Town Center" with apparently is nothing more than a Home Depot... then down by 109, just before the road goes down to 2 lanes, there is this one in Wildwood... I can't image it can be successful because the only thing noticeable to the west of this is a fire station. Other than that, until you get to gray summit, there is no noticeable development of any significance.

There are many homes surrounding Wildwood Town Center. On Manchester Road, which is just south of this development, there are many subdivisions. Right now there is a subdivision being constructed with I think 200 hundred homes that begin in the $500's. Go down highway 100 to 109 and there are also many upscale subdivisions right around Lafayette High School. Really this whole area is underserved in retail and I think the Town Center will do very well in this market.

And there is a lot of development promised (for good or bad) as you drive along Manchester, there is no shortage of "land for sale" signs - all but a garuntee that new homes will be built out there.



There are a lot of homes near there, but not that many -- yet.... this seems more of a prospect than anything else.



Wildwood has only been around since 1995, its the largest (size wise) municipality in STL county... population of 30,000+ there are a lot of people there - but they are spread out.....

ChesterfieldKid03 wrote:There are many homes surrounding Wildwood Town Center. On Manchester Road, which is just south of this development, there are many subdivisions. Right now there is a subdivision being constructed with I think 200 hundred homes that begin in the $500's. Go down highway 100 to 109 and there are also many upscale subdivisions right around Lafayette High School. Really this whole area is underserved in retail and I think the Town Center will do very well in this market.

I mean really...so what? Underserved? They chose to move out there. If you've got a half of a million dollars, you can afford to move to a lot of places. My brother bought a house in Webster for that, probably larger than the houses that are being built, and he and his family can walk to downtown Webster, the Schnucks on Elm, the Big Bend corridor west of Elm, as well as Memorial Park and the Rec Center.



This is the problem with sprawl. It's not enough to move out there, to the woods. Really, I can sort of understand that. I love the country, and there is something aestetically pleasing about living in the country. But it's not the country anymore because people move out there, then they demand that retail be right down the street for their convenience.

It's not so much the resident's of Wildwood demanding services, as it is the developers seeing that they can make money. Most of the people I know that live in Wildwood move their for the tranquility, and as you know, retail follows people.

I think what you will find, Is that there are many people who want not just a house, but land too. They don't want to be "cramped up" by city live in kirkwood, webster, south city etc. I know the wildwood lots are a 3 acre minimum. Some people prefer to more in tune with nature as well. So we need to provide the needed infrastructure for them. People need to have options as well. NOT ALL SPRAWL IS BAD GUYS!!!

bpe235 wrote: NOT ALL SPRAWL IS BAD GUYS!!!

I disagree.



And you should see the size of my brothers yard in Webster. I would hardly classify Webster as city living.

trent wrote:

bpe235 wrote: NOT ALL SPRAWL IS BAD GUYS!!!

I disagree.



And you should see the size of my brothers yard in Webster. I would hardly classify Webster as city living.

We agree to disagree.



I don't care what your brother's house is like...Thats a non issue. Webster is a whole other world than wildwood...Just as south city and clayton are different than DT... So i think it is a strong positive that our metro area offers different options for different folks. Thats all I meant. You won't ever stop sprawl. That's a fact. But we can help reverse the momentum. And that's what we are seeing happening DT.



Now lets get back on topic.

JMedwick wrote:I will throw in one comment. Bpe is right in that if folks want to live out on 3 acre lots, then so be it. Choice is choice. But, the big objection I often have is that there is no center for the area. Like ballwin. I grew up in Ballwin and other than that long ugly strip along manchester, i can't tell you where downtown ballwin is. This is the oposite of Kirkwood, which has an identifiable center. Think of it this way. I don't care if you have a 3 acre lot, but when you want Metrolink extended out too you, you need to have a clear center where the folks in your area can come and catch the train, preferably an area with a bit more density and all the shops and good stuff like that. An intersection is not a downtown.

good point

Land is a big (not only) reason. Out near where my parents live in Creve Coeur, people buy up $500,000 homes on one acre, take them down and put up a $1.5 million mcmansion. The issue I see isn't the choice of land, or more retail or anything like that. The Issue I have with sprawl is the cost to taxpayers like you and me who have to make Manchester 4 lanes all the way out there, provide schools, fire stations police, water etc to them out there.



Webster has a defined center - SO WHAT. The benefit to downtown, south city or even creve coeur (to the rest of us.. aside for life style issues) is the infrustucture is there. Thats where this ties into this topic. The infrustucture isn't out here - and they are TRYING to get a focal point. There isn't one yet - but this town center is attempting to be a focal point. In my opinion they are doing a much better job of having a focal point than other exurbs. One "town center" at the intersection of two major roads. They will have a major draw within walking distance (the new community collge).



We can't expect this to be like Downtown yet. St. Charles is just starting to get a core thats slightly more than suburban, and its been developed for years. Go to Wildwoods site, they have a master plan, they know where they want to go... I like all that except the cost to the rest of STL county in subisdizing roads and other infustructure out to them.

Wildwood does have a well used and well designed/layed out greenway paved trail between neighborhoods that can be seen along Manchester and crossing over a nice bridge over Manchester. I think this would be greater if it links with the Town Center for bicycle accessibility. Shopping and bikes? Well, bikes to get residents to the Town Center if they could build a community center/activity center for concerts and whatnot to the trail.