urbanSTL

wabash wrote:

debaliviere wrote:I can't imagine downtown has anywhere near the critical mass necessary to support a Target, even a smaller, urban version of Target. Would be nice, but we're a long way from ever getting one.

Just in terms of numbers, why does a Target work in Fairview Heights, Jennings, Florissant, or Washington, MO (Pop. 14,000) and not Downtown? Is it that downtown doesn't have the right kind of consumers? Or not enough consumers? Doesn't draw from a large enough area? Or (I'm afraid to say it) doesn't have enough parking?

Comparing a Target in a suburban location and an urban location can be tough to do because they are 2 entirely different landscapes. I look at it this way: The Metro East has 250k people living in the area and probably 200k of the 250k, are within a 20 min drive. They are able to make big purchases due to the fact they are using a vehicle to transport the goods back home.

The Target in downtown STL is a different dynamic. The daytime population in DT STL is 80k and there are 10k residents. Still less than half of the amount that reside in the Metro East. Combine population with the fact the avg purchase amount would be much lower per person, since most people will be on foot or bike. People in a downtown setting prefer not to drive to obtain goods and services when they can walk.

So basically if DT were to support a Target, we would need a daytime and resident population of about 250k. We need to focus on increasing the employment, resident, and visitor population density and then all these amenities will follow. Not vice versa.

^ I have a tough time seeing a Target downtown as it simply doesn't have the foot traffic as you see in Manhatten, Chicago and so forth. Maybe Walgreens, but Target is a whole different level. I think it is hopeful that Macy's is still making it a go downtown even after it downsized. My fear was that Macy's was downsizing only to announce in short order that downsizing didn't work and close entirely.

As far as Target itself, I think it is a matter of time before the old Federal Mogul site development goes back in play as a Target location for an increaing demographic that the city is seeing for its central corridor, a gain that allows a new Target Store to be built without significant impact on either the Hampton Ave or Brentwood Store. In addition, Old Federal Mogul location and footprint would be favorable to the Targe store format that has underground parking as you see at its Hampton Ave location. To me, that would be a far better choice then seeing McKee trying to put up a superwalmart near the New Mississippi River Bridge

I think the Target has found a an urban niche by offering underground parking with its stores. It is definitely nice on a cold rainy or snowy day to be able to park under the store.

If it works in Cincy, I can't see how it wouldn't work in St. Louis.

How is there not a CVS AND a Walgreens next to the Metro/Greyhound/Amtrak transport hub? Maybe in the new building coming to 14 & Clark?