urbanSTL

dbInSouthCity wrote: ↑

Dec 16, 2025

GoHarvOrGoHome wrote: ↑

Dec 16, 2025

This is the first I've heard of the Kiener Plaza refresh, anybody know what they are doing to it?

Flattening the berm and adding pavers to the tables and chairs area

My understanding is that there will be a void created under all the existing and new paver areas so that tree roots can grow unimpeded.

Example product, though I don't think the type actually being used: https://tiletechpavers.com/products/adj ... ls-hybrid/

The impact of this type of weekend should be noted by leaders. The Arch is simultaneously on par with the Eiffel Tower and Red Rocks Amphitheater. It needs to be leveraged to this capacity four times a year minimum. 

The history of the Arch and losing much of our riverfront, which has only worsened over the decades, has always complicated the decision for me. I wish I could go back and tell them to build the Arch, but not the park. build it into the riverfront

But there is no denying it makes our city instantly recognizable and the Arch itself is a man made wonder

The pictures and videos coming out of the fair this weekend have reached far and wide and really have created some social media buzz. Still not as much as I wish but the most I’ve seen in a while. The Ludacris and Zedd concerts are everywhere, as well as the drone show and fireworks


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stlgasm wrote:

addxb2 wrote: ↑

9:04 PM - 3 days ago

The impact of this type of weekend should be noted by leaders. The Arch is simultaneously on par with the Eiffel Tower and Red Rocks Amphitheater. It needs to be leveraged to this capacity four times a year minimum. 

100%. I was in Paris two days ago, and the way the Eiffel Tower lights up at night with sparkling lights is really a sight to behold. It's mesmerizing.  The Arch is a similarly unique and defining symbol of our city-- why not get funky and creative and adventurous with the lighting?? Create a nighttime draw that invites visitors and St. Louisans to ooooh and ahhhh over our famous monument in just the same way. And beyond that, why not create nighttime tours that culminate at the riverfront for a cool nightly (or at least weekly) light show. It's a great way to activate the Archgrounds at night, not to mention inspire a lot of great photo ops and social media buzz.  The National Park Service should visit Paris for inspiration.   Talk about low-hanging fruit... the Arch has all the ingredients to be one of the most instagrammable landmarks in the country. 

Agreed, I’ve always thought the same. I think the very fact that it’s a national park holds back this kind of programming and creativity. I actually think the city and the Gateway Foundation would explore these type things but the park service is just more conservative in its vision and offerings I think


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I don't know why the National Park Service would be opposed to something like this on the Arch, but allow it on the Washington Monument.

https://www.instagram.com/reels/DTD4H1Uj0O2/

A paid weekend music festival in the fall (that actually features trending artists!) would be a good goal. You could even invest in some camping areas near the East Riverfront metro station for a more authentic feeling fest and make metro free between the Union Station and East Riverfront for the weekend.

Labor Day weekend would be dope also because Paint Louis is going on right near by. SYNERGY

In the meantime encourage people to visit the Arch after dark. It's open to 11 but nobody is there despite it being cooler than the day in both temperature and vibe. Encourage people to take nighttime strolls and picnics like under the Eiffel Tower. Have vendors out there selling beer and Champaign kits. Encourage buskers to hang out.

As far as how it's lit, I love the rotating beam of light that comes out of the Eiffel tower and that is totally something that could be installed on the Arch without hurting aesthetics. It's such a vibe looking up from anywhere in Paris at night and seeing the beam move above you in the sky. It just gives you that little extra sense of place. STL could use it.

gary kreie wrote: ↑

12:59 PM - 2 days ago

I don't know why the National Park Service would be opposed to something like this on the Arch, but allow it on the Washington Monument.

https://www.instagram.com/reels/DTD4H1Uj0O2/

It might be possible to do this with the Arch on special occasions, but I think the reflectivity of the Arch could hurt this. Washington Monument, being stone, is the better candidate for this.

A weekend festival headlined by Slayyyter (St. Louis native) would draw millions.

Chris Stritzel wrote: ↑

2:10 PM - 2 days ago

gary kreie wrote: ↑

12:59 PM - 2 days ago

I don't know why the National Park Service would be opposed to something like this on the Arch, but allow it on the Washington Monument.

https://www.instagram.com/reels/DTD4H1Uj0O2/

It might be possible to do this with the Arch on special occasions, but I think the reflectivity of the Arch could hurt this. Washington Monument, being stone, is the better candidate for this.

The best projection screens are honestly quite reflective, which is why it's called the "silver screen." Day-Lite's screens are impregnated with tiny glass beads that act as retroreflectors. They're so small you don't really notice them, but they're basically tiny little specialized mirrors. I don't think the stainless steel would really be a problem. Should actually work even better, though the fact that it's much larger and curved would make it more challenging. Anyway, I like the idea and while it would be a real challenge, I bet it could be done.

jeff707 wrote: ↑

2:48 PM - 1 day ago

I don't believe they can hold paid events on the arch grounds... I could certainly be wrong, though. 

In 2004 they did a pretty good summer long music fest on LKS with all of the seating on the arch steps. Could do something that.

I have beat this one to death on here but I really think they just picked the wrong design for the Arch grounds, they were overly concerned about "maintaining integrity" on the landscape design and not addressing connecting the grounds to the river and activating the edges. 

The fact that there is not a single outdoor cafe where you can dine and admire the Arch is beyond belief 

^What infuriates me is that there used to be several and there could be again. In the 70s and 80s the river was much more activated. There were more or less always a rotating cast of floating attractions. A lot of it floated away in the 93 flood, but not all of it. And some things were moved and made more prominent for a time. We really need to bring that back. The city operates the moorings, if I recall correctly. And when they redid Lenore K Sullivan they didn't reinstall power, sewage, and water lines to the moorings, assuming that tenants would pay for that if there were demand. Well, Arch to river needs to step up and do it. Put utilities back in to the moorings and make the slip rates reasonable and your activation should follow. The Arch is a draw, but the river is a cruel mistress. Insurance is doubtless a pain, and you'll have to close down on the regular for flooding and maybe occasionally for low water events as well. And traffic will always be a bit seasonal. An angel investor needs to step in and make at least a little bit of the cost go away before the risk will be worth it. City Arch forgot about the River and therein lies the problem.

What frustrates me about the Arch grounds is it's complete lack of amenity besides the Arch itself and the museum. The past decade has seen our peer cities invest heavily into waterfront parks adjacent to the CBD and from what I've seen they are wildly successful. Why? Because they pack as many high quality amenities as possible in. Outdoor basketball complexes, public art, climbing walls, awesome playgrounds, giant and interesting splashpads, skate ribbons, spots for food trucks with shady spots to eat.

Peer cities with newer high end, amenity dense, and POPULAR waterfront parks off the top of my head:
Detroit's Ralph C. Wilson Park
Memphis - Tom Lee Park
Omaha - Gene Lahey Mall + Riverfront Park
Chicago - Maggie Daley Park
Louisville - Waterfront Park
Tulsa - The Gathering Place

I've visited each of these parks minus Detroit (it just opened last month, I will be visiting next week) and you can tell how valuable they are to the community. Even on day with suboptimal weather these parks are well utilized and are often one of the most bustling places in the whole city. Energy matters, and these parks create good energy that spreads to it's surroundings.

Brentwood Park is the closest I've seen in the area to this level of park and the location isn't exactly prominent.