Ouch, a horrible building that replaced historic ones, incentives given to a company that leaves for far flung office park, the city and regional orgs had been touting the leasing in this building as sign of a downtown comeback, the pictures of the boarded windows that circulated at this building from last summer constantly, another crowd of people gone from our dead gateway mall and dead downtown…something about this building and it’s named tenant leaving just feels like a big knockout punch for everyone to see the fall of our downtown and the poor decisions that led to it. Starting to feel like the slow momentum and ambition building in downtown 2023-early this year has gone away and we are stuck with more empty office space, less activity, a half shut down national park, development proposals dead. We need a big transformative plan announced for downtown ASAP. I’m not seeing any cohesive direction. Renderings of millenium, an ever evasive BPV, and two street projects (one of which took years to break ground) is just not enough to instill faith in the public that our great city won’t just be empty rubble for generations down the road
How many of the companies whose have gone into the Peabody moved from outside the city? It seems like all that happens is companies moving buildings in the city and some leaving. No new comes coming in, or at least not in large numbers. At some point GSL or someone needs to find a way to get a big win.Auggie wrote: ↑Nov 07, 2025The building they're moving to is 1245 JJ Kelley Memorial Drive which is owned by Edward Jones and is overall 227,000 square feet. The Post-Dispatch article says they will take up 2 floors, which is ~65,000 square feet according to Loop Net.CommonFire224 wrote: ↑Nov 07, 2025First off How many employees downtown does Peabody have? ( I can only find total global workforce online) Second hasn't Peabody been slowly declining and downsizing workers for years now?addxb2 wrote: ↑Nov 07, 2025The reality is that corporate workers who are willing to work in downtowns left STL years ago. STL is left with corporate workers named Cindy and Chad and they prefer a suburban office building closer to their homes in Chesterfield. They’re ten years from retirement and their kids visit once a year.
As for cooperate workers all the corporate leadership is basically all boomers and native Gen-xers (which in stl are basically boomers in mindset) I don't think we will see any corporate leadership that wants to be in downtown let alone Clayton born before the year 1984 who are native to the stl region. I also think the future of downtown has always been residential with smaller tech focused businesses found by millennials and older zoomers With some of these ventures may have not been founded yet. The best thing the city can do to help downtown is get the RXB and chemical building on the solid path to redevelopment ASAP. However long term i think the future is bright.
Their 2016 lease agreement was for 152,000 square feet of Peabody Plaza, but it's a safe bet that their new 2022 lease was a significant decline from that number, especially considering how many more more companies moved to Peabody Plaza after that new lease.
It is still a big loss, but it is also true that Peabody did already downsize significantly. It's not gonna have the affect as US Bank or Stifel leaving, for example. The best way to mitigate this loss would be for a company to quickly take up the space Peabody is vacating, and I think that's not super unrealistic considering how well Peabody Plaza has done at attracting tenants.
From what I remember, they were mostly intra-city moves, with a law firm or two coming from outside the city.jshank83 wrote: ↑Nov 07, 2025How many of the companies whose have gone into the Peabody moved from outside the city? It seems like all that happens is companies moving buildings in the city and some leaving. No new comes coming in, or at least not in large numbers. At some point GSL or someone needs to find a way to get a big win.Auggie wrote: ↑Nov 07, 2025The building they're moving to is 1245 JJ Kelley Memorial Drive which is owned by Edward Jones and is overall 227,000 square feet. The Post-Dispatch article says they will take up 2 floors, which is ~65,000 square feet according to Loop Net.CommonFire224 wrote: ↑Nov 07, 2025First off How many employees downtown does Peabody have? ( I can only find total global workforce online) Second hasn't Peabody been slowly declining and downsizing workers for years now?
As for cooperate workers all the corporate leadership is basically all boomers and native Gen-xers (which in stl are basically boomers in mindset) I don't think we will see any corporate leadership that wants to be in downtown let alone Clayton born before the year 1984 who are native to the stl region. I also think the future of downtown has always been residential with smaller tech focused businesses found by millennials and older zoomers With some of these ventures may have not been founded yet. The best thing the city can do to help downtown is get the RXB and chemical building on the solid path to redevelopment ASAP. However long term i think the future is bright.
Their 2016 lease agreement was for 152,000 square feet of Peabody Plaza, but it's a safe bet that their new 2022 lease was a significant decline from that number, especially considering how many more more companies moved to Peabody Plaza after that new lease.
It is still a big loss, but it is also true that Peabody did already downsize significantly. It's not gonna have the affect as US Bank or Stifel leaving, for example. The best way to mitigate this loss would be for a company to quickly take up the space Peabody is vacating, and I think that's not super unrealistic considering how well Peabody Plaza has done at attracting tenants.
But that is step 1 to fixing the problem, getting companies to find new offices downtown as opposed to leaving. If downtown had a Class A 450k sf tower like Centene C built in the last 10 years, I bet it would have retained a company like Fleishman Hilliard, Bank of America, or attracted a company like Emerson. I think lack of quality office space has been as big of an issue as the perception of crime. Right now, companies care way more about having a good office than having cheap space. Downtown has cheap space, but very little modern new space.
I think Thompson Coburn obviously wants to stay downtown, but they want a new modern building which does not currently exist. And it will be unfortunate if downtown is unable to deliver that in the time they're willing to wait. Peabody seems like a different story to me though, since where they're moving is not new or modern.
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Thompson Coburn is strongly looking at Clayton
New GSL CEO has been meeting with various stakeholders and reporters this week and the common feedback from those meetings is pretty bleak
New GSL CEO has been meeting with various stakeholders and reporters this week and the common feedback from those meetings is pretty bleak
Which Class A space in Clayton is large enough for them? They have almost 200,000 sq ft downtown. Is there room in the Centene Towers?dbInSouthCity wrote:Thompson Coburn is strongly looking at Clayton
New GSL CEO has been meeting with various stakeholders and reporters this week and the common feedback from those meetings is pretty bleak
None of the Centene buildings have enough space for them, nor does Forsyth Pointe, probably in part why they are still downtown and why it's so important that either BPV or Millennium is able to accommodate them.NHampton wrote: ↑Nov 08, 2025Which Class A space in Clayton is large enough for them? They have almost 200,000 sq ft downtown. Is there room in the Centene Towers?dbInSouthCity wrote:Thompson Coburn is strongly looking at Clayton
New GSL CEO has been meeting with various stakeholders and reporters this week and the common feedback from those meetings is pretty bleak
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It seems like they want out of downtown regardless
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I disagree. They wouldn't have re-upped at US Bank if they were dead set on leaving, they would have been ready to move by the time their lease was up, like others. I think if 200k sf of modern space was available for them downtown, they would take it and stay.PlatinumBlues wrote: ↑Nov 08, 2025It seems like they want out of downtown regardless
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November 15-21, a 11,000 attendee supercomputing conference will be held at the Convention Center in Downtown.
sc25.supercomputing.org
sc25.supercomputing.org
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He’s just not a very bright guy or what’s the concern?dbInSouthCity wrote:Thompson Coburn is strongly looking at Clayton
New GSL CEO has been meeting with various stakeholders and reporters this week and the common feedback from those meetings is pretty bleak
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No experience in large regions, fired from Birmingham, out of his depth based on a reporters convo with him yesterday. I met with well known downtown biz owner who is on GSLs executive committee, so you know people that would be in the known and he wasn’t even sure how this guy got hired.
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There is still plenty of space for new office in Clayton. If TC committed, a developer could likely get a new project off the ground.
GSL is a joke that doesn’t even have buy in from its largest stakeholder
Bad news aside, I agree, and am glad we at least won't have to call this the Peabody building anymore.PeterXCV wrote: ↑Nov 07, 2025Peabody should go out of business as far as I'm concerned, their coal mining projects have destroyed environments and communities across the country, not to even mention the greenhouse gas emissions. I mean I'd rather have an evil company downtown than in Des Peres but I sincerely hope to see them close their doors within my lifetime.
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US Bank building is doing some refresh of common areas, garage and adding a cafe but TC is still out of there by 2028-2029
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It’s BPV or Clayton for Thompson Coburn. Cordish/Cardinals probably would need to announce the next project getting off the ground pretty soon though
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My office moved from downtown to Earth City. Teammates complained about having to pay to park, the 1% earnings tax. It is depressing to hear yet another move to the county. I am afraid if we want to see this reverse, we are going to have to address the things that impact workers money. I have defended it for years, but I am about to give up.
Reality is that Americans are just mindf*cked. Not having to work in Earth City is worth 1% of my salary. There is just no winning strategy when a very large % of people, especially St. Louisans, think American suburbia is like the pinnacle of society. Maybe if we stopped subsidizing it, but suburbs control politics so that'll never happen.MikeKinSTL wrote: ↑Nov 08, 2025My office moved from downtown to Earth City. Teammates complained about having to pay to park, the 1% earnings tax. It is depressing to hear yet another move to the county. I am afraid if we want to see this reverse, we are going to have to address the things that impact workers money. I have defended it for years, but I am about to give up.
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Complaining about a 1% tax is like complaining about a booger being stuck in your nose & why doesn’t a company pay for employees parking anyways? Honestly I’m thinking there’s nothing wrong with downtown it’s people that are the issue.. I work downtown & enjoy it minus the bums it’s not any different from any downtown in America… This whole thing with downtown is dangerous is highly over played & a scape goat to get out . Yes things sadly & horribly do go wrong but that can happen anywhere. I’ll just say this downtown isn’t anymore dangerous than Trump running this country which is far more dangerous… I truly do hope TC stays downtown however my chances of getting hit by a car are far more greater than them staying downtown… I’m surprised the city still hasn’t woke up & try to be aggressive with new development at least give people hope & a reason to stay. & honestly I don’t know why any of us are still clinging to BPV3 ever getting off the ground at this point I’m just not convinced it’s in the best interest of the Cardinals moving forward with it. Correct me if I’m wrong I need more than false hope. I need more than false hope with all of downtown. In all I really do appreciate those developers that are trying to make a difference & still believe in downtown…
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it’s not any different from any downtown in America
#BREAKING The Tampa Police Department said four people are dead and many more are injured after a speeding car plowed through over a dozen people in Ybor early this morning.
#BREAKING The Tampa Police Department said four people are dead and many more are injured after a speeding car plowed through over a dozen people in Ybor early this morning.
The point about our downtown not being different from others is true, especially in a relative sense. When I lived and worked in Indianapolis, I experienced the exact same rhetoric about downtown Indy as downtown STL, even with Indy being a merged city and suburban counties paying into their convention center and stadium.PlatinumBlues wrote: ↑Nov 08, 2025Complaining about a 1% tax is like complaining about a booger being stuck in your nose & why doesn’t a company pay for employees parking anyways? Honestly I’m thinking there’s nothing wrong with downtown it’s people that are the issue.. I work downtown & enjoy it minus the bums it’s not any different from any downtown in America… This whole thing with downtown is dangerous is highly over played & a scape goat to get out . Yes things sadly & horribly do go wrong but that can happen anywhere. I’ll just say this downtown isn’t anymore dangerous than Trump running this country which is far more dangerous… I truly do hope TC stays downtown however my chances of getting hit by a car are far more greater than them staying downtown… I’m surprised the city still hasn’t woke up & try to be aggressive with new development at least give people hope & a reason to stay. & honestly I don’t know why any of us are still clinging to BPV3 ever getting off the ground at this point I’m just not convinced it’s in the best interest of the Cardinals moving forward with it. Correct me if I’m wrong I need more than false hope. I need more than false hope with all of downtown. In all I really do appreciate those developers that are trying to make a difference & still believe in downtown…
Reality is that downtown STL could have Indy's occupancy, activity, and regional support, and you'd still have all the usual people saying it is a crime ridden hell hole that no one goes to. There might be no fixing that, which also means the city needs to go down alternative paths to success other than trying to appease stupid people who will never change their minds. Often, these people also live a government subsidized life, subsidized dense urban areas like STL City and Clayton.
Would Cordish new development a couple blocks over from BPV and front row seats to Arch be another candidate? Believe development is in place, demo permit issued? and seems like a perfect anchor tenant for a new Class A office tower to go along with residential & hotels rooms.Auggie wrote: ↑Nov 08, 2025I disagree. They wouldn't have re-upped at US Bank if they were dead set on leaving, they would have been ready to move by the time their lease was up, like others. I think if 200k sf of modern space was available for them downtown, they would take it and stay.PlatinumBlues wrote: ↑Nov 08, 2025It seems like they want out of downtown regardless
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Of course, DeWitt can make it happen yesterday with ready made pad to build on and incentives in place. Just have to be willing to take a little less profit up front and speculative on the 100-200k feet of space.
First, I have no more information than the average dude. I am just speculating off of how TC has acted compared to other companies that have left and reasons why they say they've left. I think the smoking gun for TC is that they re-upped to stay at US Bank, I think with hopes that either BPV or Millennium will become available for them in the near to mid term. But like DB says, they will be gone by the end of the decade if a new modern building isn't available.dredger wrote: ↑Nov 08, 2025Would Cordish new development a couple blocks over from BPV and front row seats to Arch be another candidate? Believe development is in place, demo permit issued? and seems like a perfect anchor tenant for a new Class A office tower to go along with residential & hotels rooms.Auggie wrote: ↑Nov 08, 2025I disagree. They wouldn't have re-upped at US Bank if they were dead set on leaving, they would have been ready to move by the time their lease was up, like others. I think if 200k sf of modern space was available for them downtown, they would take it and stay.PlatinumBlues wrote: ↑Nov 08, 2025It seems like they want out of downtown regardless
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Of course, DeWitt can make it happen yesterday with ready made pad to build on and incentives in place. Just have to be willing to take a little less profit up front and speculative on the 100-200k feet of space.
My speculative guess is that they would move to the Millennium site should that actually be moving forward. I think a requirement for any new office will be for a main tenant to sign a letter of intent. TC is probably a primary candidate for that since it's well known that they're looking for new office space.
With that being said, even with a demolition permit, the Millennium proposal is absolutely not set in stone and could absolutely get canceled. They have a very long way to go before they're read to actually begin construction. I think TC is aware of that and is willing to see it out for now.
The Cardinals alone cannot finance these types of projects. They're just one of many investors and it has clearly been a struggle to get major investor support, which is why Phase 3 has not happened.