urbanSTL

Debaliviere91 wrote: ↑

Mar 28, 2025

dbInSouthCity wrote:

urban_dilettante wrote: ↑

Mar 28, 2025

gosh, the father of the incumbent pushing conspiracy theories against the competing candidate in the final stretch of the campaign? who could have predicted?

I wrote that. Virvus is just giving me credit for my writing. And it’s true. It’s based on talks with dozens of media, businesses and elected leaders

It’s not a conspiracy, but it is just a hypothesis. There’s no evidence that Clayco is going to get a contract they shouldn’t in terms of the airport. It shouldn’t be surprising at all that a company like Clayco would get at least a part of that contract.

When it’s awarded, if it looks like Clayco got preferential treatment to the detriment of our airport or our finances, Cara will never get a vote from me. It’s as simple as that. It’s really not a factor in deciding who to vote for on April 8th. There’s a reason this isn’t gaining traction with voters.

None for that is relevant to the essence of the post, the point is Clark isn’t all the sudden interested in being a good civic partner to
The city and the region. The point he wants Clayco to get the airport and thinks that if Jones is mayor that she would try to block that, which is ridiculous if you read the ordinance on selection process

dbInSouthCity wrote:

Debaliviere91 wrote: ↑

Mar 28, 2025

dbInSouthCity wrote: I wrote that. Virvus is just giving me credit for my writing. And it’s true. It’s based on talks with dozens of media, businesses and elected leaders

It’s not a conspiracy, but it is just a hypothesis. There’s no evidence that Clayco is going to get a contract they shouldn’t in terms of the airport. It shouldn’t be surprising at all that a company like Clayco would get at least a part of that contract.

When it’s awarded, if it looks like Clayco got preferential treatment to the detriment of our airport or our finances, Cara will never get a vote from me. It’s as simple as that. It’s really not a factor in deciding who to vote for on April 8th. There’s a reason this isn’t gaining traction with voters.

None for that is relevant to the essence of the post, the point is Clark isn’t all the sudden interested in being a good civic partner to
The city and the region. The point he wants Clayco to get the airport and thinks that if Jones is mayor that she would try to block that, which is ridiculous if you read the ordinance on selection process

I agree. I’ve been saying all along Bob Clark isn’t a relevant factor in terms of your April 8th decision.

As the billionaire class watches the president of the United States literally shill for Tesler on the White House lawn, they realize this is the moment they’ve been working toward since 1980. Bob is striking while the iron is hot.

I hope it completely backfires and that he comes down with an incurable case of the hiccups.

JaneJacobsGhost wrote:As the billionaire class watches the president of the United States literally shill for Tesler on the White House lawn, they realize this is the moment they’ve been working toward since 1980. Bob is striking while the iron is hot.

I hope it completely backfires and that he comes down with an incurable case of the hiccups.

This has nothing to do with Trump or Tesla.

It’s Tesler

Debaliviere91 wrote: ↑

Mar 28, 2025

dbInSouthCity wrote:

Debaliviere91 wrote: ↑

Mar 28, 2025

It’s not a conspiracy, but it is just a hypothesis. There’s no evidence that Clayco is going to get a contract they shouldn’t in terms of the airport. It shouldn’t be surprising at all that a company like Clayco would get at least a part of that contract.

When it’s awarded, if it looks like Clayco got preferential treatment to the detriment of our airport or our finances, Cara will never get a vote from me. It’s as simple as that. It’s really not a factor in deciding who to vote for on April 8th. There’s a reason this isn’t gaining traction with voters.

None for that is relevant to the essence of the post, the point is Clark isn’t all the sudden interested in being a good civic partner to
The city and the region. The point he wants Clayco to get the airport and thinks that if Jones is mayor that she would try to block that, which is ridiculous if you read the ordinance on selection process

I agree. I’ve been saying all along Bob Clark isn’t a relevant factor in terms of your April 8th decision.

It’s not; as I said above 8th is just going through the motions of a Spencer win. This is about the explanation of Clark’s sudden interest, the heavy lean in into to the race and what comes next

jivecitystl wrote: ↑

Mar 28, 2025

dbInSouthCity wrote: ↑

Mar 28, 2025

FTW would be explaining how as Mayor Spencer will do differently in any of those and the reason nobody is willing to do that is because there is no plan



Let’s look at downtown  

Spending in the Downtown STL zip codes in 2024 was $1,810,000,000 vs $1,787,000,000 in 2023,

1.3% increase despite Cardinals drawing 500,000 less fans.

Clayton,MO
2023: $467,000,000
2024: $464,000,000
Change: -0.64%

Chesterfield, MO
2023: $1,745,000,000
2024: $1,719,00,000
Change: -1.50%

St.charles county
2023: $8,960,000,000
2024: $8,980,000,000

+0.22%

Across the state; downtown KC

2024: $604,000,000
2023: $590,000,000

Saint Louis City finished 2023 with 12,398  businesses and 2024 with 12,988, for a gain of 590.

Well the problematic missteps that stldotage outlined on page 55 of this thread apply to the current administration. Wonder if all the Jones supporters would line up to defend Cara Spencer if the tables were turned?  Like if Cara Spencer were the incumbent mayor with an identical track record as Tishaura Jones, and Tishaura Jones were the challenger with an identical track record to Cara Spencer. Who would earn your vote? 

Are you kidding me?

Absolutely Spencer. And if the facts tell me that Spencer has been a good mayor come 2029, I will be supporting her. I don't vote on my arbitrary feelings, I look at the data and the facts and allow those to guide me.

Auggie wrote: ↑

Mar 28, 2025

jivecitystl wrote: ↑

Mar 28, 2025

dbInSouthCity wrote: ↑

Mar 28, 2025

FTW would be explaining how as Mayor Spencer will do differently in any of those and the reason nobody is willing to do that is because there is no plan



Let’s look at downtown  

Spending in the Downtown STL zip codes in 2024 was $1,810,000,000 vs $1,787,000,000 in 2023,

1.3% increase despite Cardinals drawing 500,000 less fans.

Clayton,MO
2023: $467,000,000
2024: $464,000,000
Change: -0.64%

Chesterfield, MO
2023: $1,745,000,000
2024: $1,719,00,000
Change: -1.50%

St.charles county
2023: $8,960,000,000
2024: $8,980,000,000

+0.22%

Across the state; downtown KC

2024: $604,000,000
2023: $590,000,000

Saint Louis City finished 2023 with 12,398  businesses and 2024 with 12,988, for a gain of 590.

Well the problematic missteps that stldotage outlined on page 55 of this thread apply to the current administration. Wonder if all the Jones supporters would line up to defend Cara Spencer if the tables were turned?  Like if Cara Spencer were the incumbent mayor with an identical track record as Tishaura Jones, and Tishaura Jones were the challenger with an identical track record to Cara Spencer. Who would earn your vote? 

Are you kidding me?

Absolutely Spencer. And if the facts tell me that Spencer has been a good mayor come 2029, I will be supporting her. I don't vote on my arbitrary feelings, I look at the data and the facts and allow those to guide me.

Based on Jones's primary performance, you are in the minority.

jivecitystl wrote: ↑

Mar 28, 2025

Auggie wrote: ↑

Mar 28, 2025

jivecitystl wrote: ↑

Mar 28, 2025

Well the problematic missteps that stldotage outlined on page 55 of this thread apply to the current administration. Wonder if all the Jones supporters would line up to defend Cara Spencer if the tables were turned?  Like if Cara Spencer were the incumbent mayor with an identical track record as Tishaura Jones, and Tishaura Jones were the challenger with an identical track record to Cara Spencer. Who would earn your vote? 

Are you kidding me?

Absolutely Spencer. And if the facts tell me that Spencer has been a good mayor come 2029, I will be supporting her. I don't vote on my arbitrary feelings, I look at the data and the facts and allow those to guide me.

Based on Jones's primary performance, you are in the minority.

Based on primary turnout, everyone was in a super minority

JaneJacobsGhost wrote: ↑

Mar 28, 2025

jivecitystl wrote: ↑

Mar 28, 2025

JaneJacobsGhost wrote: ↑

Mar 28, 2025

Yes, if Spencer and Jones were switched we would be defending Spencer. The difference is that we wouldn’t have to because if roles were reversed, Spencer would be cursing into a reelection.

Lol, I doubt it!!  Do you recall that Tishaura Jones ran against Cara Spencer for mayor in the last election and WON?  Unfortunately she did not deliver for STL, When an incumbent fails to win reelection, just blame the voters- it's so much easier than trying to excuse or explain away your underwhelming performance!

Jones did not deliver for St Louis other than (1) dramatically reducing crime, particularly homicides, (2) successfully introducing community policing and community focused public safety measures that have been extremely successful (3) fixing the 911 problem and securing the money to build an integrated 911 call center, (4) moving important DT vacancies closer to development than they’ve been in 20 years.

(5) Increased building permit values in North City despite a nationwide downturn, (6) approved $300M+ into lane reductions, bike infrastructure, and traffic calming measures, (7) helped get the Green Line 1 federal grand short from becoming reality, (8) reformed how incentives work to ensure that developers aren't getting 100% tax breaks for decades, (9) has used ARPA funds for progressive policies such as UBI, home ownership loans, and to incentivize downtown retail, (10) plans to use Rams money to fund new benefits to help retain and attract city workers to improve city services.

Auggie wrote: ↑

Mar 28, 2025

JaneJacobsGhost wrote: ↑

Mar 28, 2025

jivecitystl wrote: ↑

Mar 28, 2025

Lol, I doubt it!!  Do you recall that Tishaura Jones ran against Cara Spencer for mayor in the last election and WON?  Unfortunately she did not deliver for STL, When an incumbent fails to win reelection, just blame the voters- it's so much easier than trying to excuse or explain away your underwhelming performance!

Jones did not deliver for St Louis other than (1) dramatically reducing crime, particularly homicides, (2) successfully introducing community policing and community focused public safety measures that have been extremely successful (3) fixing the 911 problem and securing the money to build an integrated 911 call center, (4) moving important DT vacancies closer to development than they’ve been in 20 years.

(5) Increased building permit values in North City despite a nationwide downturn, (6) approved $300M+ into lane reductions, bike infrastructure, and traffic calming measures, (7) helped get the Green Line 1 federal grand short from becoming reality, (8) reformed how incentives work to ensure that developers aren't getting 100% tax breaks for decades, (9) has used ARPA funds for progressive policies such as UBI, home ownership loans, and to incentivize downtown retail, (10) plans to use Rams money to fund new benefits to help retain and attract city workers to improve city services.

If all of these wonderful accomplishments have failed to move the masses to Team TJ, then maybe you'd at least agree that her PR apparatus/campaign management has been pretty abysmal from the start.  If the Jones administration has been so effective, why is she such a hard sell this time around?  Not just among the high turnout/whiter wards either-- the increased voter apathy in North Side wards cannot be ignored.  Not voting sends a very strong message about public sentiment as well.  Could it be that maybe people who live, work and visit the city every day are just kind of over of being told that everything is awesome and getting so much better when it isn't?   

jivecitystl wrote: ↑

Mar 28, 2025

Auggie wrote: ↑

Mar 28, 2025

JaneJacobsGhost wrote: ↑

Mar 28, 2025

Jones did not deliver for St Louis other than (1) dramatically reducing crime, particularly homicides, (2) successfully introducing community policing and community focused public safety measures that have been extremely successful (3) fixing the 911 problem and securing the money to build an integrated 911 call center, (4) moving important DT vacancies closer to development than they’ve been in 20 years.

(5) Increased building permit values in North City despite a nationwide downturn, (6) approved $300M+ into lane reductions, bike infrastructure, and traffic calming measures, (7) helped get the Green Line 1 federal grand short from becoming reality, (8) reformed how incentives work to ensure that developers aren't getting 100% tax breaks for decades, (9) has used ARPA funds for progressive policies such as UBI, home ownership loans, and to incentivize downtown retail, (10) plans to use Rams money to fund new benefits to help retain and attract city workers to improve city services.

If all of these wonderful accomplishments have failed to move the masses to Team TJ, then maybe you'd at least agree that her PR apparatus/campaign management has been pretty abysmal from the start.  If the Jones administration has been so effective, why is she such a hard sell this time around?  Not just among the high turnout/whiter wards either-- the increased voter apathy in North Side wards cannot be ignored.  Not voting sends a very strong message about public sentiment as well.  Could it be that maybe people who live, work and visit the city every day are just kind of over of being told that everything is awesome and getting so much better when it isn't?   

Why do you always revert back to discussing turnout and elections? Maybe to distract from the fact that you literally can't argue against points made be me, JJG, or DB and you can't even make a good argument to support your own beliefs?

Lemme remind you- again- of this forum's mission:

"Members should expect mostly positive news and information to be disseminated here. This board is primarily meant to accentuate the positive regarding St. Louis as well as a place to exchange information. This is not a complaint board and not the place to post your rants. Serious users of this forum are interested in informed discussions. While everyone won't necessarily share the same opinions, we hope members will at least make an attempt to use logic and verifiable information in your posts. Lively, intelligent discussion is what we're about."

Tell us what logic and verifiable information informs your beliefs. Not some weird rant like you normally do.

Auggie wrote: ↑

Mar 28, 2025

jivecitystl wrote: ↑

Mar 28, 2025

Auggie wrote: ↑

Mar 28, 2025

(5) Increased building permit values in North City despite a nationwide downturn, (6) approved $300M+ into lane reductions, bike infrastructure, and traffic calming measures, (7) helped get the Green Line 1 federal grand short from becoming reality, (8) reformed how incentives work to ensure that developers aren't getting 100% tax breaks for decades, (9) has used ARPA funds for progressive policies such as UBI, home ownership loans, and to incentivize downtown retail, (10) plans to use Rams money to fund new benefits to help retain and attract city workers to improve city services.

If all of these wonderful accomplishments have failed to move the masses to Team TJ, then maybe you'd at least agree that her PR apparatus/campaign management has been pretty abysmal from the start.  If the Jones administration has been so effective, why is she such a hard sell this time around?  Not just among the high turnout/whiter wards either-- the increased voter apathy in North Side wards cannot be ignored.  Not voting sends a very strong message about public sentiment as well.  Could it be that maybe people who live, work and visit the city every day are just kind of over of being told that everything is awesome and getting so much better when it isn't?   

Why do you always revert back to discussing turnout and elections? Maybe to distract from the fact that you literally can't argue against points made be me, JJG, or DB and you can't even make a good argument to support your own beliefs?

Lemme remind you- again- of this forum's mission:

"Members should expect mostly positive news and information to be disseminated here. This board is primarily meant to accentuate the positive regarding St. Louis as well as a place to exchange information. This is not a complaint board and not the place to post your rants. Serious users of this forum are interested in informed discussions. While everyone won't necessarily share the same opinions, we hope members will at least make an attempt to use logic and verifiable information in your posts. Lively, intelligent discussion is what we're about."

Tell us what logic and verifiable information informs your beliefs. Not some weird rant like you normally do.

Your arguments are meaningless if the voters don't care enough to show up.  That's my point.  And the reality is that it has NOT felt like things have been going great in the City of St. Louis over the past 4 years.  Change is never certain, but it is definitely justified at this point in my opinion.  (side note, our business is STILL struggling to make up for the time/revenue lost in January after we were forced to close due to the profoundly incompetent snowstorm response).  

Cara Spencer makes a very compelling case as a challenger to Jones, and her message is resonating with MANY more people than Tishaura's message.  You're OBSESSED with data and numbers and facts and logic, but what you fail to grasp is that effective leadership requires MUCH more than just numbers and trends, and in the vital categories that define leadership quality, Tishaura Jones has been a major letdown.  Not just to Cara Spencer supporters, but also to TJ's own base.  It might be entertaining to nitpick things we say/don't say on this forum, but you really need to ask your neighbors why they are so blind and ignorant and stupid and racist, because that's pretty much all you've accomplished here, and that track appears to be the default approach for Team TJ in general.  Has the primary not taught you a single thing?  So out of touch with public sentiment and it's so amateur!  When a strategy doesn't work, find a new strategy.  Team TJ just regurgitates the same narrative over and over and then get bitter, vindictive, petty and intimidating when the results favor the other side.  

For real, the Bob Clark obsession is mystifying.  NO ONE CARES about these "shady" affiliations with developers.  Big city mayors deal with developers all the time.  The conspiracy theories are way too convoluted to deter the average voter.   Find a new boogeyman already!

^^I mean the thread is titled "2025 St. Louis Mayor's Race"

Discussing turnout and elections is gonna happen here.

jivecitystl wrote: ↑

Mar 28, 2025

Auggie wrote: ↑

Mar 28, 2025

jivecitystl wrote: ↑

Mar 28, 2025

If all of these wonderful accomplishments have failed to move the masses to Team TJ, then maybe you'd at least agree that her PR apparatus/campaign management has been pretty abysmal from the start.  If the Jones administration has been so effective, why is she such a hard sell this time around?  Not just among the high turnout/whiter wards either-- the increased voter apathy in North Side wards cannot be ignored.  Not voting sends a very strong message about public sentiment as well.  Could it be that maybe people who live, work and visit the city every day are just kind of over of being told that everything is awesome and getting so much better when it isn't?   

Why do you always revert back to discussing turnout and elections? Maybe to distract from the fact that you literally can't argue against points made be me, JJG, or DB and you can't even make a good argument to support your own beliefs?

Lemme remind you- again- of this forum's mission:

"Members should expect mostly positive news and information to be disseminated here. This board is primarily meant to accentuate the positive regarding St. Louis as well as a place to exchange information. This is not a complaint board and not the place to post your rants. Serious users of this forum are interested in informed discussions. While everyone won't necessarily share the same opinions, we hope members will at least make an attempt to use logic and verifiable information in your posts. Lively, intelligent discussion is what we're about."

Tell us what logic and verifiable information informs your beliefs. Not some weird rant like you normally do.

Your arguments are meaningless if the voters don't care enough to show up.  That's my point.  And the reality is that it has NOT felt like things have been going great in the City of St. Louis over the past 4 years.  Change is never certain, but it is definitely justified at this point in my opinion.  Cara Spencer makes a very compelling case as a challenger to Jones, and her message is resonating with MANY more people than Tishaura's message.  You're OBSESSED with data and numbers and facts and logic, but what you fail to grasp is that effective leadership requires MUCH more than just numbers and trends, and in the vital categories that define leadership quality, Tishaura Jones has been a major letdown.  Not just to Cara Spencer supporters, but also to TJ's own base.  It might be entertaining to nitpick things we say/don't say on this forum, but you really need to ask your neighbors why they are so blind and ignorant and stupid and racist, because that's pretty much all you've accomplished here, and that track appears to be the default approach for Team TJ in general.  Has the primary not taught you a single thing?  So out of touch with public sentiment and it's so amateur!  When a strategy doesn't work, find a new strategy.  Team TJ just regurgitates the same narrative over and over and then get bitter, vindictive, petty and intimidating when the results favor the other side.  

For real, the Bob Clark obsession is mystifying.  NO ONE CARES about these "shady" affiliations with developers.  Big city mayors deal with developers all the time.  The conspiracy theories are way too convoluted to deter the average voter.   Find a new boogeyman already!

Jive, this is not a complaint board and not a place to post your rants. We expect members to use logic and verifiable information in your posts. Intelligent, lively discussion is what we are about.

Obviously I'm not gonna go over this entrie meandering rant, but the last part if just so funny.

It's such a "conspiracy theory" that an out-of-city billionaire who has never been seriously pro-city is ill-intentioned and his massive $ support for any mayoral candidate is a bad thing. Such a conspiracy.

whitherSTL wrote: ↑

Mar 28, 2025

No words.

This is pretty funny considering the rivalry St. Louis and Chicago always seemed to have.

Auggie wrote: ↑

Mar 28, 2025

jivecitystl wrote: ↑

Mar 28, 2025

Auggie wrote: ↑

Mar 28, 2025

Why do you always revert back to discussing turnout and elections? Maybe to distract from the fact that you literally can't argue against points made be me, JJG, or DB and you can't even make a good argument to support your own beliefs?

Lemme remind you- again- of this forum's mission:

"Members should expect mostly positive news and information to be disseminated here. This board is primarily meant to accentuate the positive regarding St. Louis as well as a place to exchange information. This is not a complaint board and not the place to post your rants. Serious users of this forum are interested in informed discussions. While everyone won't necessarily share the same opinions, we hope members will at least make an attempt to use logic and verifiable information in your posts. Lively, intelligent discussion is what we're about."

Tell us what logic and verifiable information informs your beliefs. Not some weird rant like you normally do.

Your arguments are meaningless if the voters don't care enough to show up.  That's my point.  And the reality is that it has NOT felt like things have been going great in the City of St. Louis over the past 4 years.  Change is never certain, but it is definitely justified at this point in my opinion.  Cara Spencer makes a very compelling case as a challenger to Jones, and her message is resonating with MANY more people than Tishaura's message.  You're OBSESSED with data and numbers and facts and logic, but what you fail to grasp is that effective leadership requires MUCH more than just numbers and trends, and in the vital categories that define leadership quality, Tishaura Jones has been a major letdown.  Not just to Cara Spencer supporters, but also to TJ's own base.  It might be entertaining to nitpick things we say/don't say on this forum, but you really need to ask your neighbors why they are so blind and ignorant and stupid and racist, because that's pretty much all you've accomplished here, and that track appears to be the default approach for Team TJ in general.  Has the primary not taught you a single thing?  So out of touch with public sentiment and it's so amateur!  When a strategy doesn't work, find a new strategy.  Team TJ just regurgitates the same narrative over and over and then get bitter, vindictive, petty and intimidating when the results favor the other side.  

For real, the Bob Clark obsession is mystifying.  NO ONE CARES about these "shady" affiliations with developers.  Big city mayors deal with developers all the time.  The conspiracy theories are way too convoluted to deter the average voter.   Find a new boogeyman already!

Jive, this is not a complaint board and not a place to post your rants. We expect members to use logic and verifiable information in your posts. Intelligent, lively discussion is what we are about.

Obviously I'm not gonna go over this entrie meandering rant, but the last part if just so funny.

It's such a "conspiracy theory" that an out-of-city billionaire who has never been seriously pro-city is ill-intentioned and his massive $ support for any mayoral candidate is a bad thing. Such a conspiracy.

Haha!  Okay Auggie, you really have done a terrific job winning people over here!  I'm sure your well-thought arguments in this thread have convinced many that TJ is the obvious choice.  

Yes, go ahead and stick with the Bob Clark attacks since Spencer's association with him is soooooooooooooooo unsettling to sooooooo many people.  I'm sure the Spencer campaign thanks you for keeping that on the forefront.    

This form needs to relax! Maybe we all need to eat Nigerian food with TJ and the Chicago mayor and chill out!

whitherSTL wrote: ↑

Mar 28, 2025

No words.

I had no idea the Chicago mayor looks like Chris Rock got the munchies.

whitherSTL wrote: ↑

Mar 28, 2025

This form needs to relax! Maybe we all need to eat Nigerian food with TJ and the Chicago mayor and chill out!

We know Nigerian food is too spicy for you. It has garlic in it after all. I think you might find something good for you at Hodak’s

Mayoral and Comptroller poll

Mayoral
Cara Spencer 55%
Tishaura Jones 31%
Undecided 14%

Comptroller
Donna Baringer 42%
Darlene Green 39%
Undecided 19%

622 likely voters, March 25-27. Margin of Error +/- 4

If that poll is right Comptroller face could be a barn burner.