I was late but missed that. I did like that Cara doesn't appear to be anti green line, but she wants a more robust route. Definitely some heated points on stage, or at least more than I expected.Baltimore Jack wrote: ↑Mar 19, 2025I'm the mayoral debate tonight Jones said there were zero instances of vehicular death on St. Louis roadways in 2024.
Umm
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Jones clarified that she meant there were zero cyclist deaths in 2024 in a Facebook post.
It really sounded like she said zero deaths caused by motor vehicles last year which was quite something to hear.
It really sounded like she said zero deaths caused by motor vehicles last year which was quite something to hear.
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One thing that's becoming really clear from these debates is just how unqualified Spencer is. It is so easy to say you'll do this and that but there is no substance to how this and that will be accomplished.
Lol, good one, db! Cara came across as smart, pragmatic and capable. Because she is. Cara mopped the floor last night..dbInSouthCity wrote: ↑Mar 19, 2025One thing that's becoming really clear from these debates is just how unqualified Spencer is. It is so easy to say you'll do this and that but there is no substance to how this and that will be accomplished.
Is that why you and no one else can form a comprehensive argument in favor of Spencer that explains what exactly she will do to solve these issues she says she will solve?stlgasm wrote: ↑Mar 19, 2025Lol, good one, db! Cara came across as smart, pragmatic and capable. Because she is. Cara mopped the floor last night..dbInSouthCity wrote: ↑Mar 19, 2025One thing that's becoming really clear from these debates is just how unqualified Spencer is. It is so easy to say you'll do this and that but there is no substance to how this and that will be accomplished.
^It's Tishaura's job to form a comprehensive argument on why she should be re-elected, and she has failed to deliver that message. Hence her shocking upset in the primary.
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One of the quick round questions asked when the last time each took public transit.
Mayor Jones said last year. Spencer last week.
Honestly both campaigns have dropped the ball in failing to campaign on Metro rail or Metro Bus.
That's something you see in other cities. Why not here?
Mayor Jones said last year. Spencer last week.
Honestly both campaigns have dropped the ball in failing to campaign on Metro rail or Metro Bus.
That's something you see in other cities. Why not here?
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HAHAHA! Can't tell if you're being serious or not, Denis. I watched the debate last night and let's just say it is absolutely no mystery why Cara Spencer destroyed TJ in the primary. It was pretty embarrassing to watch, actually. Do you actually think ANYONE watching objectively thought Tishaura did what she needed to do last night?dbInSouthCity wrote: ↑Mar 19, 2025One thing that's becoming really clear from these debates is just how unqualified Spencer is. It is so easy to say you'll do this and that but there is no substance to how this and that will be accomplished.
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This isnt about who won the dabate, the debate is irrelevant, only thing left is will Spencer win 60-40 or 55-45. this is about the ability to govern or in this case the lack of, and that's clear to anyone who's paid attention to her over the last decade. It will largely depend on who she hires, and all signs point to the same orbit as Krewson. Even Nancy Rice may make a comeback and be part of City gov in a 5th different decade.jivecitystl wrote: ↑Mar 19, 2025HAHAHA! Can't tell if you're being serious or not, Denis. I watched the debate last night and let's just say it is absolutely no mystery why Cara Spencer destroyed TJ in the primary. It was pretty embarrassing to watch, actually. Do you actually think ANYONE watching objectively thought Tishaura did what she needed to do last night?dbInSouthCity wrote: ↑Mar 19, 2025One thing that's becoming really clear from these debates is just how unqualified Spencer is. It is so easy to say you'll do this and that but there is no substance to how this and that will be accomplished.
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...it was a pretty meh debate on both sides y'all 
Now... Mayor Jones has a uphill battle and she probably didn't do enough, but a debate isn't going to magically do that overnight anyway...
Now... Mayor Jones has a uphill battle and she probably didn't do enough, but a debate isn't going to magically do that overnight anyway...
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Yeah, I just think you have a warped sense of reality if you actually think Tishaura Jones said or did anything at all last night to demonstrate that she would be the better choice in this election. Say whatever you want about Cara's experience or performance or intentions or affiliations-- she came across as the more qualified and competent and composed candidate. I agree debates don't mean much but you'd think the incumbent would be able to rise to the occasion to convey a sense of confidence and competence, but that was not the case at all. I don't know who would have watched that tango last night and come away saying, "Mayor Jones is the obvious choice!"dbInSouthCity wrote: ↑Mar 19, 2025This isnt about who won the dabate, the debate is irrelevant, only thing left is will Spencer win 60-40 or 55-45. this is about the ability to govern or in this case the lack of, and that's clear to anyone who's paid attention to her over the last decade. It will largely depend on who she hires, and all signs point to the same orbit as Krewson. Even Nancy Rice may make a comeback and be part of City gov in a 5th different decade.jivecitystl wrote: ↑Mar 19, 2025HAHAHA! Can't tell if you're being serious or not, Denis. I watched the debate last night and let's just say it is absolutely no mystery why Cara Spencer destroyed TJ in the primary. It was pretty embarrassing to watch, actually. Do you actually think ANYONE watching objectively thought Tishaura did what she needed to do last night?dbInSouthCity wrote: ↑Mar 19, 2025One thing that's becoming really clear from these debates is just how unqualified Spencer is. It is so easy to say you'll do this and that but there is no substance to how this and that will be accomplished.
Ah yes, being 1 federal grant away from MetroLink expansion is definitely the same as using conservative language like "boondoggle".Baltimore Jack wrote: ↑Mar 19, 2025One of the quick round questions asked when the last time each took public transit.
Mayor Jones said last year. Spencer last week.
Honestly both campaigns have dropped the ball in failing to campaign on Metro rail or Metro Bus.
That's something you see in other cities. Why not here?
When Jones entered office, the Green Line was a complete fever dream and had been relegated to become a American style BRT.
The gaslighting is insane
If Spencer is so obvious, what exactly will she do differently to attract companies back downtown?jivecitystl wrote: ↑Mar 19, 2025Yeah, I just think you have a warped sense of reality if you actually think Tishaura Jones said or did anything at all last night to demonstrate that she would be the better choice in this election. Say whatever you want about Cara's experience or performance or intentions or affiliations-- she came across as the more qualified and competent and composed candidate. I agree debates don't mean much but you'd think the incumbent would be able to rise to the occasion to convey a sense of confidence and competence, but that was not the case at all. I don't know who would have watched that tango last night and come away saying, "Mayor Jones is the obvious choice!"dbInSouthCity wrote: ↑Mar 19, 2025This isnt about who won the dabate, the debate is irrelevant, only thing left is will Spencer win 60-40 or 55-45. this is about the ability to govern or in this case the lack of, and that's clear to anyone who's paid attention to her over the last decade. It will largely depend on who she hires, and all signs point to the same orbit as Krewson. Even Nancy Rice may make a comeback and be part of City gov in a 5th different decade.jivecitystl wrote: ↑Mar 19, 2025HAHAHA! Can't tell if you're being serious or not, Denis. I watched the debate last night and let's just say it is absolutely no mystery why Cara Spencer destroyed TJ in the primary. It was pretty embarrassing to watch, actually. Do you actually think ANYONE watching objectively thought Tishaura did what she needed to do last night?
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Oh Auggie, you're such a broken record. I understand why it would be frustrating to accept that the overwhelming majority of St. Louis voters disagree with your opinion on this race.
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Honestly a lot of people here are really bad at debating this. I’ll acknowledge the forum in which it’s taking place is a part of that.
There are a few Spencer supporters here who don’t understand that her winning the election or winning the polling now isn’t in itself an adequate defense of her as a candidate. You can’t just respond with, “well she’s winning, so there.”
Auggie, you’re often guilty of confusing your personal opinion with a “fact based, comprehensive argument.” Like many people, you also seem to be regularly misusing the term gaslighting.
There are a few Spencer supporters here who don’t understand that her winning the election or winning the polling now isn’t in itself an adequate defense of her as a candidate. You can’t just respond with, “well she’s winning, so there.”
Auggie, you’re often guilty of confusing your personal opinion with a “fact based, comprehensive argument.” Like many people, you also seem to be regularly misusing the term gaslighting.
Oh jivecitystl, if only you could answer the question. But you can't. Just like how none of you can provide a comprehensive argument to support your beliefs. Such a broken record.jivecitystl wrote: ↑Mar 19, 2025Oh Auggie, you're such a broken record. I understand why it would be frustrating to accept that the overwhelming majority of St. Louis voters disagree with your opinion on this race.
I watched two of the debates. Cara was attentive, provided reasonable responses, has legislative knowledge, and looks excited even when being forced into a position of defense.
Jones looks as if she hates being anywhere, including the debate stage. She looks entirely defeated. If stamina is an appropriate measure of who to vote for, Jones doesn’t appear to have any.
Jones looks as if she hates being anywhere, including the debate stage. She looks entirely defeated. If stamina is an appropriate measure of who to vote for, Jones doesn’t appear to have any.
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I actually have expounded at length throughout this thread about why I think Cara Spencer is a better candidate for mayor than Tishaura Jones. Not my problem you choose to ignore it or don't think it rises to your own subjective standards of what constitutes a "good reason". Persuading you to agree with me is pretty low on my list of goals.Auggie wrote: ↑Mar 19, 2025Oh jivecitystl, if only you could answer the question. But you can't. Just like how none of you can provide a comprehensive argument to support your beliefs. Such a broken record.jivecitystl wrote: ↑Mar 19, 2025Oh Auggie, you're such a broken record. I understand why it would be frustrating to accept that the overwhelming majority of St. Louis voters disagree with your opinion on this race.
Again, I have been a small business owner in the City of St. Louis for more than 15 years-- I have paid close attention to this and all citywide races for more than 22 years and my personal and professional experience inform my opinions. A strong and popular incumbent would not be facing this kind of challenge from the same challenger she beat handily the first time around. Therefore, it is fair to conclude that Tishaura Jones has fallen far short of convincing St. Louis that she is the better candidate in this race. Period. Not sure how you would even manufacture an argument against that fact.
jivecitystl wrote:Not my problem you choose to ignore it or don't think it rises to your own subjective standards of what constitutes a "good reason". Persuading you to agree with me is pretty low on my list of goals.
Bookmark it.
It’s a fair critique. Her political advisers failed her. I certainly don’t want decisions made purely for face value politics but it’s occasionally felt as if Jones completely forgot she had to be reelected.jivecitystl wrote: A strong and popular incumbent would not be facing this kind of challenge from the same challenger she beat handily the first time around. Therefore, it is fair to conclude that Tishaura Jones has fallen far short of convincing St. Louis that she is the better candidate in this race. Period. Not sure how you would even manufacture an argument against that fact.
You can have 100 great ideas but if you don’t have messaging, you’ll be stopped at #50.
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It was a 4 point race last timejivecitystl wrote: ↑Mar 19, 2025I actually have expounded at length throughout this thread about why I think Cara Spencer is a better candidate for mayor than Tishaura Jones. Not my problem you choose to ignore it or don't think it rises to your own subjective standards of what constitutes a "good reason". Persuading you to agree with me is pretty low on my list of goals.Auggie wrote: ↑Mar 19, 2025Oh jivecitystl, if only you could answer the question. But you can't. Just like how none of you can provide a comprehensive argument to support your beliefs. Such a broken record.jivecitystl wrote: ↑Mar 19, 2025Oh Auggie, you're such a broken record. I understand why it would be frustrating to accept that the overwhelming majority of St. Louis voters disagree with your opinion on this race.
Again, I have been a small business owner in the City of St. Louis for more than 15 years-- I have paid close attention to this and all citywide races for more than 22 years and my personal and professional experience inform my opinions. A strong and popular incumbent would not be facing this kind of challenge from the same challenger she beat handily the first time around. Therefore, it is fair to conclude that Tishaura Jones has fallen far short of convincing St. Louis that she is the better candidate in this race. Period. Not sure how you would even manufacture an argument against that fact.
There is nothing in the city that hasn’t improved since 2021, with the exception of permit review, though efforts are actively underway to address that. The biggest challenge Mayor Jones faces is not necessarily dissatisfaction with city services but rather the loss of her progressive base. As the Post-Dispatch article aptly describes, this shift is largely due to broader policy decisions, such as police raises and other key issues, rather than day-to-day governance.
Additionally, Jones has been somewhat unlucky in that many voters, both locally and nationally, have effectively erased the memory of COVID-19 and its lasting impacts (trumps total butcher job of handling Covid had no impact in 2024 election). People now expect conditions to return to the way they were in 2019, regardless of the significant improvements made between 2021 and 2025. Unfortunately, that level of normalcy is still a long way off, making it difficult for the current administration to receive full credit for its progress and it will make it very hard for Spencer to deliver on all things she’s promised
I don’t know yet what type of role I’ll take over the next 4 years; be difficult or helpful. I’ve had a lot of chats with media over the last few months about this race and what comes next, should be interesting to say the least.
No, you haven't. You've gone on multiple Reddit rants that include no comprehensive or substantive argument or case being made. Just rambling.jivecitystl wrote: ↑Mar 19, 2025I actually have expounded at length throughout this thread about why I think Cara Spencer is a better candidate for mayor than Tishaura Jones. Not my problem you choose to ignore it or don't think it rises to your own subjective standards of what constitutes a "good reason". Persuading you to agree with me is pretty low on my list of goals.Auggie wrote: ↑Mar 19, 2025Oh jivecitystl, if only you could answer the question. But you can't. Just like how none of you can provide a comprehensive argument to support your beliefs. Such a broken record.jivecitystl wrote: ↑Mar 19, 2025Oh Auggie, you're such a broken record. I understand why it would be frustrating to accept that the overwhelming majority of St. Louis voters disagree with your opinion on this race.
Again, I have been a small business owner in the City of St. Louis for more than 15 years-- I have paid close attention to this and all citywide races for more than 22 years and my personal and professional experience inform my opinions. A strong and popular incumbent would not be facing this kind of challenge from the same challenger she beat handily the first time around. Therefore, it is fair to conclude that Tishaura Jones has fallen far short of convincing St. Louis that she is the better candidate in this race. Period. Not sure how you would even manufacture an argument against that fact.
The one single time you tried laying out your beliefs point by point, DB immediately responded to each point and showed why they're wrong and you never responded.
Francis Slay was mayor for 16 years. Being "strong" and "popular" doesn't mean you're good or correct. You were probably a Slay voter though, which would explain so much.
If you paid ANY attention to the trend the city has taken over the past 4 years, nearly all of it points towards improvement on multiple fronts- as I have laid out the multiple times I've provided comprehensive, detailed arguments for why Joens deserves 4 more years.
Persuading me isn't the point. You being able to support yourself and explain your own views with anything more than your completely subjective feelings is the point. If you're unable to do that, there's no reason anyone should take you seriously.
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Then don't take me seriously, why would I care? Make all the assumptions you want about my political allegiances- anything to distract from the lackluster current administration. I admire your optimism about how great the past 4 years have been for the city. Wish I shared your feelings, but good luck selling that message to the masses.Auggie wrote: ↑Mar 19, 2025No, you haven't. You've gone on multiple Reddit rants that include no comprehensive or substantive argument or case being made. Just rambling.jivecitystl wrote: ↑Mar 19, 2025I actually have expounded at length throughout this thread about why I think Cara Spencer is a better candidate for mayor than Tishaura Jones. Not my problem you choose to ignore it or don't think it rises to your own subjective standards of what constitutes a "good reason". Persuading you to agree with me is pretty low on my list of goals.Auggie wrote: ↑Mar 19, 2025
Oh jivecitystl, if only you could answer the question. But you can't. Just like how none of you can provide a comprehensive argument to support your beliefs. Such a broken record.
Again, I have been a small business owner in the City of St. Louis for more than 15 years-- I have paid close attention to this and all citywide races for more than 22 years and my personal and professional experience inform my opinions. A strong and popular incumbent would not be facing this kind of challenge from the same challenger she beat handily the first time around. Therefore, it is fair to conclude that Tishaura Jones has fallen far short of convincing St. Louis that she is the better candidate in this race. Period. Not sure how you would even manufacture an argument against that fact.
The one single time you tried laying out your beliefs point by point, DB immediately responded to each point and showed why they're wrong and you never responded.
Francis Slay was mayor for 16 years. Being "strong" and "popular" doesn't mean you're good or correct. You were probably a Slay voter though, which would explain so much.
If you paid ANY attention to the trend the city has taken over the past 4 years, nearly all of it points towards improvement on multiple fronts- as I have laid out the multiple times I've provided comprehensive, detailed arguments for why Joens deserves 4 more years.
Persuading me isn't the point. You being able to support yourself and explain your own views with anything more than your completely subjective feelings is the point. If you're unable to do that, there's no reason anyone should take you seriously.