Is that an apt characterization? What about KC?
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^I'm sure KC will dispute such a thing heavily. But . . . I still enjoy it. 
In fairness, I'd say we're about even, but Arthur Bryant's is really remarkably tasty.
In fairness, I'd say we're about even, but Arthur Bryant's is really remarkably tasty.- 1,291
^^ I mean, technically they're talking solely about barbecue (as in the act of grilling food), not necessarily 'BBQ'. St. Louis has always been pretty much the mecca of grilling meat - at one point (not sure if it's still the case), STL consumed more BBQ sauce per capita than anywhere else in the country. Also has been named the #1 grilling city in the country by (I believe) Weber at least once.
Will also die on the hill that KC BBQ is incredibly overrated.
Will also die on the hill that KC BBQ is incredibly overrated.
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^I'm not sure I'd make a distinction between "BBQ" and "barbecue." So far as I can tell one is merely a contraction of the other. There are certainly a lot of folks that would take issue with the idea that barbecue is synonymous with "grilling" and would dismiss St. Louis barbecue based on that assumption; that our barbecue is just grilled meat. The History Guy did an interesting little video on barbecue a few years back which noted the term entered Spanish from an indigenous American word used in the Caribbean and perhaps on the Florida coast for a style of cooking meat on wooden frameworks over a pit fire. If I understand correctly, there's archeological evidence of similar techniques used at Cahokia on a massive scale, and it seems not unlikely that the Mississippians would have at the least disseminated it throughout their territory, which would have included the Florida coast. So I like to imagine it really is originally a St. Louis thing. (And it just might be.) Would be instructive to see what the practice is called in the Natchez language, since they are apparently the last surviving Mississippians.
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Even so, I still prefer St. Louis BBQ to KC's any day, so St. Louis can stand on either merit.
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I'm from KC and live in STL now, and I'm a big-time barbecue lover.
I've got to give it to KC by a hair. The gap isn't as large as KC or magazine articles would tell you.
St. Louis holds its own in the meat department. You can find a rack or ribs here that is just as good as any in KC. Heck, believe it or not, I've had Salt + Smoke ribs and Joe's KC Barbecue ribs in the same week, and S + S was easily better. I was so shocked I tried that same thing again... and S + S was easily better again.
And it's not even like Salt + Smoke is the best in St. Louis.
Where I think KC barbecue differentiates itself is in the sides. St. Louis barbecue restaurants are typically really generic and boring about their sides.
I've got to give it to KC by a hair. The gap isn't as large as KC or magazine articles would tell you.
St. Louis holds its own in the meat department. You can find a rack or ribs here that is just as good as any in KC. Heck, believe it or not, I've had Salt + Smoke ribs and Joe's KC Barbecue ribs in the same week, and S + S was easily better. I was so shocked I tried that same thing again... and S + S was easily better again.
And it's not even like Salt + Smoke is the best in St. Louis.
Where I think KC barbecue differentiates itself is in the sides. St. Louis barbecue restaurants are typically really generic and boring about their sides.
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I really think we should brand the KC->STL barbecue as some sort of "MOBBQ mecca" or "I70 tour de BBQ", etc. and find a way to pool the media to be 1st in BBQ
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^^Seems like an easy fix for STL BBQ joints. Go to KC, try the sides and try to add or improve upon them. I agree on your analysis. I've had both many times. You'd think we are serving fried spam over here in STL if you talk to a KC BBQ aficionado. The thing I love most about STL BBQ is the fact that I can eat it without any BBQ sauce. The smoky taste is so good, BBQ sauce is an afterthought. When I've had KC BBQ, the sauce is a big part of the plate.
pattimagee wrote: ↑Apr 19, 2022I really think we should brand the KC->STL barbecue as some sort of "MOBBQ mecca" or "I70 tour de BBQ", etc. and find a way to pool the media to be 1st in BBQ
The problem with that is the fact that KC is so arrogant about their BBQ and hateful towards anything St. Louis. KC wouldn’t want anything to do with that IMO.
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KC people like to think that all barbecue stinks outside of KC.
I swear to you, there are TONS of KC people who will tell you KC has the best BBQ in the nation... without having actually tasted BBQ anywhere else.
The same with KC. I've told people that St. Louis can hold its own and even match KC for meat, and you'd think I insulted their mother. Of course, they couldn't name a single BBQ restaurant in St. Louis.
I swear to you, there are TONS of KC people who will tell you KC has the best BBQ in the nation... without having actually tasted BBQ anywhere else.
The same with KC. I've told people that St. Louis can hold its own and even match KC for meat, and you'd think I insulted their mother. Of course, they couldn't name a single BBQ restaurant in St. Louis.
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In the early 2000's I was surprised to hear people from out of town ask where they could get some of that great STL BBQ they heard about. I honestly wondered if they got their Missouri cities mixed up. Back then it was tough to find restaurant BBQ that was rave worthy in this town. Now we are truly in contender and our quick rise may irk some in KC.
I travel constantly around the country and STL is definitely known for it's BBQ. I meet people who look forward to their trips here to try out new spots each time. I think we have a great mix of classics, new joints, and off the beaten path options.
I think a lot of this is that "St Louis-Style Ribs" became a thing that ended up on a number of BBQ restaurant menus outside of St. Louis. That does A LOT for establishing a reputation. This is especially so in areas where Texas-style BBQ (aka beef) is predominant (and it is probably the most popular in those regions that don't have their own native style or are adjacent to one - KC/STL/Memphis/Carolina), and pork ribs just weren't super common. Also, it doesn't help that we are somewhere between KC and memphis-styles. We've got to find a good way to market and push our BBQ.Baltimore Jack wrote: ↑Apr 19, 2022In the early 2000's I was surprised to hear people from out of town ask where they could get some of that great STL BBQ they heard about. I honestly wondered if they got their Missouri cities mixed up. Back then it was tough to find restaurant BBQ that was rave worthy in this town. Now we are truly in contender and our quick rise may irk some in KC.
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Nikki Glaser's St. Louis based reality show, Welcome Home Nikki Glaser is launching soon.
Oh yeah, I meant to post that. I really wish I could be a producer on something like this just to be like "you're going to Broadway Oyster Bar today and then you're going to tour every pavilion in Tower Grove Park. Go."GoHarvOrGoHome wrote: ↑Apr 29, 2022Nikki Glaser's St. Louis based reality show, Welcome Home Nikki Glaser is launching soon.
"Reality?"GoHarvOrGoHome wrote: ↑Apr 29, 2022Nikki Glaser's St. Louis based reality show, Welcome Home Nikki Glaser is launching soon.
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I watched one of her interviews with Bally Sports Midwest last night and she said that St. Louisans will notice the places she is going around town.
Well, just in that clip they are at Steinberg skating rink in Forest ParkRockChalkSTL wrote: ↑Apr 29, 2022I watched one of her interviews with Bally Sports Midwest last night and she said that St. Louisans will notice the places she is going around town.
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It's theatre, so no. Lightly scripted situational comedy would probably be a more accurate title, but it's not as catchy. I've never cared for the term. Particularly since it's used to describe both the above sort of semi improvisational sitcom and gameshows. But it's cheap so Hollywood will keep making it. And it'll probably be better with a professional comic than with assorted wealthy children pretending to be actors.
St. Louis looked really good in the first two episodes tonight. Had a lot of great drone shots and neighborhood shots. Pretty funny show, hope it does well
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I found this line in the intro quite annoying: “But small-town living does not mean I’ve stopped hustling." What?? Not only is it inaccurate, but so cliche.
^ To be fair, she did move to Des Peres when she moved back 
I've seen her make favorable comparisons of the CWE to some NYC neighborhoods on social media before.
Overall, I think it was actually really well done. That one "small-town" comment aside, they didn't do the condescending bullsh*t most productions that come to town from the coasts do. Like that goofy Pam Hupp show on NBC. Just her and her family living life. And St. Louis does look damn good in the set up shots.
I've seen her make favorable comparisons of the CWE to some NYC neighborhoods on social media before.
Overall, I think it was actually really well done. That one "small-town" comment aside, they didn't do the condescending bullsh*t most productions that come to town from the coasts do. Like that goofy Pam Hupp show on NBC. Just her and her family living life. And St. Louis does look damn good in the set up shots.
^ No, she lives there now. Spent the first 10 months in STL with her folks at their home in Des Peres. When she realized she could basically still have her career and live in St. Louis (and that the pandemic wasn’t going to exactly go away anytime soon) she decided to get her own place.
I agree that overall it made the city look pretty good- I just wish the producers would cool it with the coastal bias. It’s so overdone. And who would characterize Des Peres as “small town” anyway? Personal gripes aside, I think Nikki Glaser is cool and St. Louis is lucky to have her.