urbanSTL

$2.5 Million isn't too much. Wonder if we could get an express option for $2.5 Million more ($5 Million total). I'd take the train much more between STL and Kc if an express option was offered. Cut down on the travel time.

It’s peanuts! They can find this small sum very easily and get that 2nd train running again. But no express, please. This line lives off all those interior stops. It really knits our state together in a great way.

Are there any statistics about what proportion of riders are STL-KC direct?

MarkHaversham wrote: ↑

Feb 05, 2022

Are there any statistics about what proportion of riders are STL-KC direct?

Stats from 2019 available here: https://www.railpassengers.org/site/assets/files/3463/56.pdf

• STL-KC and Kirkwood-KC are the first and second most popular station pairings.
• Around 50% of trips are between the St. Louis Metro (Gateway Center & Kirkwood) and KC Metro (Union Station, Independence, Lee's Summit).

If I am riding west (usually to Jefferson City) I board at Kirkwood, just a much more pleasant experience than downtown and of course half an hour less on the train.

High Speed Rail Alliance - New Trains in the Midwest

https://hsrail.org/blog/new-trains-midw ... 5e33f6446f

Points Guy review of the new rolling stock
Everything is better except the less comfortable seats compared to the new seats Amtrak installed 5 years ago

Will the Lincoln Service feature full business class cars? Or will it be the same cafe/business split car?

I love business class, but more inventory would be great, since it's not really worth 3x as much as coach.

But only coach class train cars will be delivered for the time being, with new business class cars put into service later in 2022 and new café cars in 2023.

Ive always found business class to be a great deal. usually I pay like $20 more per one way

New electric train in Russia and the air filtering system is something else. Watch with english sub titles
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ER3P9_ZyvC0&t=41s
We in Amerika won’t see anything like any time soon

Article on Tennessee group pushing for expanding statewide Amtrak service and how it might tie in with Amtrak's push to expand.   Really doesn't take much imagination to connect some dots but extending River Runner to Carbondale and building upon Amtrak wishes to take service from Atlanta to Nasheville and extend to IL/St.  Louis giving St. Louis some great connectivity to Memphis & New Orleans to the south and Nasheville & Atlanta to the Southeast.   Of course in my cynical mind that goes against IL and Amtrak powers to be to keep Chicago as hub for all things Midwest

https://www.trains.com/trn/news-reviews ... k-service/

The challenge is that there isn't an active direct Class I route between Nashville and St. Louis. CSXT has a route heading west from Nashville that dips south at McKenzie, TN (with a short spur route heading NW that ends at Dresden, TN... more on this in a second) to Memphis and then a route heading north to Evansville that pretty much continues straight north before finally connecting to a UP line just south of Watseka, IL.  

Amtrak or whoever owns the ROW between Dresden, TN and Fulton, KY would need to connect the gap between the CN and CSXT lines so that any route could head west from Nashville, connect to the CN N/S line at Fulton, and cross the river at Cairo, IL. 

dredger wrote: ↑

Feb 25, 2022

Article on Tennessee group pushing for expanding statewide Amtrak service and how it might tie in with Amtrak's push to expand.   Really doesn't take much imagination to connect some dots but extending River Runner to Carbondale and building upon Amtrak wishes to take service from Atlanta to Nasheville and extend to IL/St.  Louis giving St. Louis some great connectivity to Memphis & New Orleans to the south and Nasheville & Atlanta to the Southeast.   Of course in my cynical mind that goes against IL and Amtrak powers to be to keep Chicago as hub for all things Midwest

https://www.trains.com/trn/news-reviews ... k-service/

Hard to see this getting much support outside of Chattanooga and Nashville, which roundly rejected a 2018 transit initiative by a 64-36 vote.

Laife Fulk wrote: ↑

Feb 25, 2022

The challenge is that there isn't an active direct Class I route between Nashville and St. Louis. CSXT has a route heading west from Nashville that dips south at McKenzie, TN (with a short spur route heading NW that ends at Dresden, TN... more on this in a second) to Memphis and then a route heading north to Evansville that pretty much continues straight north before finally connecting to a UP line just south of Watseka, IL.  

Amtrak or whoever owns the ROW between Dresden, TN and Fulton, KY would need to connect the gap between the CN and CSXT lines so that any route could head west from Nashville, connect to the CN N/S line at Fulton, and cross the river at Cairo, IL. 

About twelve miles of track between Dawson and Nortonville Kentucky would connect CSX to a large class II called the Paducah and Louisville. And while they're a class II, they do seem to have good track. The parent company, P&L transportation, operates three railroads with about five hundred combined miles of track in a half dozen states. Alternately, you could head west on CSX's old NC&StL to McKenzie Tennessee. The line to Dresden is a branch now, operated by some short line or other. But, it'd just be a few miles in need of upgrading and then sixteen miles of new track across some very flat former NC&StL right of way would get you to Fulton Kentucky and you're on your way via CN's old IC. You could connect with the City of New Orleans there and continue on to St. Louis via Duquoin. That has the potential to be a real high speed route, even.

I rode the train to Chicago and back last week. Despite riding three trains, I didn't get to ride in one of the new cars, though I saw a bunch of them in Chicago. The horizon I was in Fri night CHI-SPI shook like mad when we were hauling ass. We didn't get delayed at the crossings with other railroads between Summit and Union Station on both my inbound and outbound trips. We were delayed by a NS train just south of Springfield crossing over, something the move to 10th street won't resolve. Other delays were caused by lack of double tracking. I hope they're applying for fed funds to add more.

dredger wrote: ↑

Feb 25, 2022

Article on Tennessee group pushing for expanding statewide Amtrak service and how it might tie in with Amtrak's push to expand.   Really doesn't take much imagination to connect some dots but extending River Runner to Carbondale and building upon Amtrak wishes to take service from Atlanta to Nasheville and extend to IL/St.  Louis giving St. Louis some great connectivity to Memphis & New Orleans to the south and Nasheville & Atlanta to the Southeast.   Of course in my cynical mind that goes against IL and Amtrak powers to be to keep Chicago as hub for all things Midwest

https://www.trains.com/trn/news-reviews ... k-service/

I could see a train extending from Nashville to Clarksville and then to St. Louis.  Not sure Illinois will ever let a train through Illinois that could make St. Louis a hub.  So it would probably need to come through Kentucky and Tennessee and Missouri.

Fortunately (or unfortunately) a comprehensive train system needs far more hubs than air travel. Nobody in St. Louis would realistically take the train to all the way to Chicago on their way to Nashville. At that point just fly. Connecting STL and Carbondale is obvious in the long term. More travel options from STL leads to more St. Louisans choosing the train and considering it in their future travel mix. Leads to more people travelling STL to Chicago.

St. Louis being a hub does nothing but help Chicago IMO. Unlike air travel, trains are not a zero sum game.

I agree. I think having St. Louis become a nearby hub only helps Chicago. 
 
Additionally, considering Illinois' struggles, you would think it would only be wise to give southern Illinois residents better travel options. If you couldn't go by car or plane, a train trip to St. Louis from southern Illinois would be brutal. 

It makes too much sense for St. Louis, but also for the Amtrak system as a whole, to extend St. Louis to Carbondale and down to New Orleans. 

Extending St. Louis to Indianapolis and over to the Pittsburgh and beyond would make a lot of sense as well. A 1971 Amtrak map reveals that this used to be a travel corridor. 

Lastly, connecting St. Louis to Nashville and down to Atlanta and the south would also greatly improve the entire Amtrak system. 

shadrach wrote: ↑

Mar 02, 2022

I was hoping a revival of The National Limited would have been part of Amtrak's expansion plan.

The Infrastructure Investment and Jobs Act, section 22214:

   (a) In General.--The Secretary shall conduct a study to evaluate the
restoration of daily intercity rail passenger service along--
           (1) any Amtrak long-distance routes that, as of the date of
       enactment of this Act, were discontinued; and
           (2) any Amtrak long-distance routes that, as of the date of
       enactment of this Act, occur on a nondaily basis.

So, maybe still?

https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/PLA ... publ58.htm

It really makes a ton of sense to have better paths through the center of the country, for people traveling from, say, Denver to Atlanta. 

Currently, that trip would be hellish, or at the very least totally inefficient. 

Connecting Kansas City with Omaha and St. Louis with Carbondale/Nashville/Atlanta would change that. 

Looking at an Amtrak map drives me nuts with the all the gaping holes of inefficiency that are all over the place. And what's crazy is that St. Louis is already arguably the best city in the center of the country for traveling E/W (for the purposes of this rant, I'm calling Chicago northern). The Missouri River Runner is the only east/west track that is north of and within a few hundred miles of the Mason Dixon that will take you somewhere except Chicago.

Kansas City-Omaha
St. Louis-Nashville-Atlanta
St. Louis-Indianapolis or Cincinnati
St. Louis-Carbondale-Memphis-New Orleans
Memphis-Birmingham
Memphis-Little Rock
Oklahoma City-Wichita-Newton
Denver-Albuquerque
Cincinnati-Cleveland
Houston-Dallas

These are just some of the pathways that should already exist. 

Minneapolis should also have several more connections with the system.
 

^I'd add St. Louis-Springfield-Oklahoma City to that list. And possibly also Oklahoma City-Memphis-Nashville. That could create some real synergies. And while you're at it, maybe move some of the postal service off the highways and back onto passenger trains. Save on wear and tear to the highways, save on fuel, and help make the service more affordable, frequent, and sensible.

It'd be pretty fantastic to be able to travel to Springfield and include them in the Amtrak network. I agree. 

OKC and Tulsa would also be natural extensions of the Texas high speed rail corridor between Dallas and Houston

symphonicpoet wrote: ↑

Mar 03, 2022

^I'd add St. Louis-Springfield-Oklahoma City to that list. And possibly also Oklahoma City-Memphis-Nashville. That could create some real synergies. And while you're at it, maybe move some of the postal service off the highways and back onto passenger trains. Save on wear and tear to the highways, save on fuel, and help make the service more affordable, frequent, and sensible.

I'd love to take a train to Eureka Springs, AR. But that would probably have to be on a OKC-Little Rock-Memphis-Nashville track rather than STL-Springfield-OKC one. Still I think having a train go through the heart of the Ozarks or Ouachita Mountains would be great.