Is the Dubliner and Paperdolls signage still there? And if so, will it remain?Kingb4 wrote: ↑Jul 22, 2021There is a tenant-- relocating and expanding pretty significantly. I'm not authorized to disclose much more right now, but I'm pretty sure people will be excited about it.GoHarvOrGoHome wrote: ↑Jul 21, 2021Looks like the old Dubliner space is getting a gut job. Don’t think they have found a tenant though.
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I thought it was when I went to a Cardinals game the other night.dweebe wrote: ↑Jul 22, 2021Yes I know it’s a crappy national chain: but is the TGIFridays toast?
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For some reason I think I saw a “temporarily closed” but those sometimes drop the temporarily
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Dapper Gents will be moving to Ladue sometime in the next few months. Hopefully the ownership that is refreshing that building is able to get something valuable in that space.
Maybe it was noted earlier in this thread, but Great Clips by Schnucks is no longer there.
I didn't even like that place all that much, but the number of places for a man to get a $20 or less cut in 20 or fewer minutes is rapidly diminishing. Everything is upscale and takes 45 minutes.
I didn't even like that place all that much, but the number of places for a man to get a $20 or less cut in 20 or fewer minutes is rapidly diminishing. Everything is upscale and takes 45 minutes.
Can I recommend Tim's Barbershop in Soulard, then? It's right across Russell from Hammerstone's. Tim's is the place for a $10 haircut and $4 beard trim... and it won't take long. I use him in between my widely-spaced visits to my "real" barber...one of those "upscale" jobbers.eee123 wrote: ↑Jul 26, 2021Maybe it was noted earlier in this thread, but Great Clips by Schnucks is no longer there.
I didn't even like that place all that much, but the number of places for a man to get a $20 or less cut in 20 or fewer minutes is rapidly diminishing. Everything is upscale and takes 45 minutes.
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+1 for Tim's, but there are no frills.
Lately I've been recommending Cutters and Co in the basement of Chase Park Plaza. Still under $20 but they do a really nice job and you get a free beer with your cut and validate parking which is nice. Krueza is the my gal.
Lately I've been recommending Cutters and Co in the basement of Chase Park Plaza. Still under $20 but they do a really nice job and you get a free beer with your cut and validate parking which is nice. Krueza is the my gal.
My evaluation of downtown throughout and now after returning to the office: it's hopeless. Don't know what to say, but nothing that's been done has worked. I've been working downtown for 25 years and it's never been so dejected, lawless, and miserable as it is now. The pedestrian experience was, and remains, unforgivable. Random metal plates, vehicles, filthy puddles, and devices block crumbling, decaying sidewalks - often for years at a time. Entire buildings site empty and condemned - no different than the 90s. Garages have paper "condemned" signs with sticks of lumber attempting to prevent the collapse of the structures onto the ground below. Out of town visitors nervously fast-walk past empty storefronts and boarded up windows. Cars regularly plow through red lights (when the lights work) or go the wrong way on the streets. I haven't seen a city police officer walking downtown in nearly five years; lately I haven't even seen the private officers driving either. Washington Avenue is a mess; the cachet is long gone, replaced by gunshots and people in cars harassing pedestrians. Metro and its stations remained unsecured by security; gunshots follow arguments across the street to the shady hotel. Stairways and sidewalks reek of urine and feces.
But hey, we've got Ballpark Village.
But hey, we've got Ballpark Village.
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And yet new apartments continue to be built and tenants continue to move in. Why? Because it’s not nearly as bad as you’re making out to be.
I've never understood how such a burgeoning downtown couldn't support something so basic as a full pharmacy, and why so many restaurants shutter at 1pm. You're right, someone sure doesn't think so. But something doesn't add up; I imagine it's due to subsidy. When was the last building built or renovated without credits and other assistance? Who's actually moving in?BellaVilla wrote: ↑Jul 26, 2021And yet new apartments continue to be built and tenants continue to move in. Why? Because it’s not nearly as bad as you’re making out to be.
Yep, had several friends in from out of town this weekend and we had a blast downtown. We heard no gunshots, saw no urine or feces, and despite walking several miles we weren’t harassed by anyone from a car.BellaVilla wrote: ↑Jul 26, 2021And yet new apartments continue to be built and tenants continue to move in. Why? Because it’s not nearly as bad as you’re making out to be.
No one is saying downtown doesn’t have struggles but the shitloads of people I saw everywhere this weekend certainly doesn’t scream some of the stuff youse are talking about here.
Granted, the people I saw downtown were most likely tourists and don’t have the rampant negativity and cynicism that your average St. Louisan does…probably worth taking that into consideration.
I had a business meeting today with a guy that moved here 9 months ago from New York. He loves it here. Talk to certain natives tho and you’d think we lived in literally the world’s worst place…LOL.
Shitloads of people, really? I went downtown Sunday between about 2-4pm and it was the usual ghost town. Must have missed them.
Dang these crappy, cynical negative Nancies who make this stuff up.
Dang these crappy, cynical negative Nancies who make this stuff up.
ST. LOUIS — A new resident of One Cardinal Way, a luxury apartment complex near Busch Stadium, recently recorded a scene playing out in the streets below that appeared straight off a Hollywood movie set. Squealing cars performed a series of doughnuts before a barrage of gunfire was unleashed — nearly 30 shots during a 34-second recording — as other cars raced along South Broadway late at night.
Two days later, a teenage girl from De Soto was in a pickup cruising with friends along Washington Avenue well after midnight. She died when a speeding car ran a red light and collided with the pickup near Washington and 10th Street. Hours later, Mayor Lyda Krewson, mentioning the girl’s death, vowed to change traffic patterns to curtail speeders whose actions “torment” residents.
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The speeding cars and reckless behavior were part of an especially bad week for the city’s downtown — all part of a difficult summer for the area that saw crime surge to an alarming degree. Episodes of violent crime spiked in June and July, reaching record or near-record levels. In June alone, police logged 114 assaults downtown, higher than the last eight Junes combined for the neighborhood. And there were more robberies in June and July downtown than any year in the 16 years that St. Louis crime has been categorized by neighborhood. All of this comes as homicides citywide climb over the number this time last year.
Downtown, three people were shot and wounded this summer while visiting Citygarden, a sculpture park on Market Street. A woman along Olive Street was carjacked at gunpoint by two boys, ages 12 and 13. Those crimes were among the robberies and aggravated assaults that multiplied in the neighborhood as the city struggled with the coronavirus pandemic and civil unrest following the death of a Black man in Minneapolis police custody.
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Residents who spoke with the Post-Dispatch described how downtown transforms on weekend nights, between about 10 p.m. and 4 a.m. Cruisers come with roaring engines and deafening music. There are people drinking in cars, on top of cars, partying on open parking lots, and displaying or firing guns. Some property owners claim police are hard to find or do little to intervene. The sound of gunfire is becoming more common, they say.
.....
On a recent weekend, social media videos show large crowds gathering outside on Washington Avenue in the early hours of a Sunday morning as bars were closing. Shots were fired and social media videos showed people dancing in the street and several standing and jumping on top of a SLMPD vehicle.
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So, things get weird around between 2-4 am? That really sucks but also does not corroborate your earlier description. I'm getting a serious Karens of St. Charles vibe from your posts. Please, take your dribble to the Post Dispatch comments section. Also, what were you doing downtown between 2 and 4 am? Burn outs and target practice? 
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walker wrote: ↑Jul 26, 2021Can I recommend Tim's Barbershop in Soulard, then? It's right across Russell from Hammerstone's. Tim's is the place for a $10 haircut and $4 beard trim... and it won't take long. I use him in between my widely-spaced visits to my "real" barber...one of those "upscale" jobbers.eee123 wrote: ↑Jul 26, 2021Maybe it was noted earlier in this thread, but Great Clips by Schnucks is no longer there.
I didn't even like that place all that much, but the number of places for a man to get a $20 or less cut in 20 or fewer minutes is rapidly diminishing. Everything is upscale and takes 45 minutes.
Thank you both! I'll file that away. (And maybe ask for recs in a more Carondelet-like thread to see if anyone other than Ragsdale's is marginally closer.)GoHarvOrGoHome wrote:+1 for Tim's, but there are no frills.
Lately I've been recommending Cutters and Co in the basement of Chase Park Plaza. Still under $20 but they do a really nice job and you get a free beer with your cut and validate parking which is nice. Krueza is the my gal.
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None of what you're describing is unique to Downtown STL.bprop wrote: ↑Jul 26, 2021My evaluation of downtown throughout and now after returning to the office: it's hopeless. Don't know what to say, but nothing that's been done has worked. I've been working downtown for 25 years and it's never been so dejected, lawless, and miserable as it is now. The pedestrian experience was, and remains, unforgivable. Random metal plates, vehicles, filthy puddles, and devices block crumbling, decaying sidewalks - often for years at a time. Entire buildings site empty and condemned - no different than the 90s. Garages have paper "condemned" signs with sticks of lumber attempting to prevent the collapse of the structures onto the ground below. Out of town visitors nervously fast-walk past empty storefronts and boarded up windows. Cars regularly plow through red lights (when the lights work) or go the wrong way on the streets. I haven't seen a city police officer walking downtown in nearly five years; lately I haven't even seen the private officers driving either. Washington Avenue is a mess; the cachet is long gone, replaced by gunshots and people in cars harassing pedestrians. Metro and its stations remained unsecured by security; gunshots follow arguments across the street to the shady hotel. Stairways and sidewalks reek of urine and feces.
But hey, we've got Ballpark Village.
He said 2-4PM, to be fair. Not that I believe it's that dead during that timeframe, in any case.BellaVilla wrote:So, things get weird around between 2-4 am? That really sucks but also does not corroborate your earlier description. I'm getting a serious Karens of St. Charles vibe from your posts. Please, take your dribble to the Post Dispatch comments section. Also, what were you doing downtown between 2 and 4 am? Burn outs and target practice?
I'll make my comments here, as I've been supporting the city with my tax contributions for all these years and call out BS when I hear it. And yes, I was there on Sunday afternoon, not noticing the "shitloads" of people mentioned.BellaVilla wrote: ↑Jul 27, 2021So, things get weird around between 2-4 am? That really sucks but also does not corroborate your earlier description. I'm getting a serious Karens of St. Charles vibe from your posts. Please, take your dribble to the Post Dispatch comments section. Also, what were you doing downtown between 2 and 4 am? Burn outs and target practice?
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bprop, that story you posted was from August 2020 and you really should have mentioned that since you were using it to suggest downtown is hopeless today. Bad form. What would be interesting is a fair article on the changes downtown since last summer, especially as there's been more tourists back and more developments underway, etc.
I was responding to people who claim that downtown residents apparently don't see a problem, since they're moving in like crazy. Additionally, I am posting about the decline over a long period of time. I really don't see much difference between last year and this. There has been a long and steady deterioration of the environment, in my experience.STLrainbow wrote: ↑Jul 27, 2021bprop, that story you posted was from August 2020 and you really should have mentioned that since you were using it to suggest downtown is hopeless today. Bad form. What would be interesting is a fair article on the changes downtown since last summer, especially as there's been more tourists back and more developments underway, etc.
Also, the last line that I pasted was from May 2021:
https://www.kmov.com/news/videos-show-p ... 45c22.html
On a recent weekend, social media videos show large crowds gathering outside on Washington Avenue in the early hours of a Sunday morning as bars were closing. Shots were fired and social media videos showed people dancing in the street and several standing and jumping on top of a SLMPD vehicle.
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Downtown resident here- weekends area packed with tourists, hell even week days. Go to Blondies at 9:00am on Saturday and see how long it takes to be seated or Rooster or Chris'. Heck go today at 11 and see how long you wait. Union Station, City Museum and the Arch are having record breaking week after week all summer. Union Station is more busier then when it opened in 2019bprop wrote: ↑Jul 27, 2021I was responding to people who claim that downtown residents apparently don't see a problem, since they're moving in like crazy. Additionally, I am posting about the decline over a long period of time. I really don't see much difference between last year and this. There has been a long and steady deterioration of the environment, in my experience.STLrainbow wrote: ↑Jul 27, 2021bprop, that story you posted was from August 2020 and you really should have mentioned that since you were using it to suggest downtown is hopeless today. Bad form. What would be interesting is a fair article on the changes downtown since last summer, especially as there's been more tourists back and more developments underway, etc.
Also, the last line that I pasted was from May 2021:
https://www.kmov.com/news/videos-show-p ... 45c22.html
On a recent weekend, social media videos show large crowds gathering outside on Washington Avenue in the early hours of a Sunday morning as bars were closing. Shots were fired and social media videos showed people dancing in the street and several standing and jumping on top of a SLMPD vehicle.
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As with most debates, the truth probably lies somewhere in between. Downtown is seeing some residential infill finally, but it's not exactly the center of development either. Rather than viewing this as a choice between "is downtown a poopy hellhole or is it thriving?", why can't we acknowledge the nuances of the situation. Yes, there are some proposals for new residential, but if crime was addressed and basic infrastructure actually maintained, wouldn't that help draw in more residents?
(Using arbitrary numbers here - not actual stats) If downtown is seeing 2% population growth year over year, why can't we acknowledge the issues and then try to get it to 6% growth? Just claiming that downtown is fine as is and that people need to get over their fears isn't going to actually change the perceptions of those who have those views. Maybe downtown is getting better or currently great in the eyes of those who live there, but if we're trying to grow and attract new residents, then we need to take into consideration the perceptions of crime of those we want to move to the city. It's like criticism of suburban development - sure, it may not be great development policy, but unless you can tap into the market demand to redirect people to what you view as being the better alternative, it's just nice message board theory on what should be.
(Using arbitrary numbers here - not actual stats) If downtown is seeing 2% population growth year over year, why can't we acknowledge the issues and then try to get it to 6% growth? Just claiming that downtown is fine as is and that people need to get over their fears isn't going to actually change the perceptions of those who have those views. Maybe downtown is getting better or currently great in the eyes of those who live there, but if we're trying to grow and attract new residents, then we need to take into consideration the perceptions of crime of those we want to move to the city. It's like criticism of suburban development - sure, it may not be great development policy, but unless you can tap into the market demand to redirect people to what you view as being the better alternative, it's just nice message board theory on what should be.
I was downtown yesterday to fix something in our loft. Grabbed lunch at Snarf's (MX), kids played at City Garden and Kiener Plaza, etc. Moving from area to area I noticed marked differences as we walked around from when we lived down there ('06-'11). Some areas have regressed (Wash Ave., overall streescape, legacy restaurant closings) others have progressed (Ballpark Village, Soldier's Memorial, various new hotels and residential.). Speaking with my tenant, she still really enjoys being down there (she's been a DT resident since '06), but noted that her comfort level has gone down, especially in the evenings as unsavory characters appear. Pointed to the recent shooting at the Shell on Tucker. She also noted the lack of critical mass with workers and that everything is much better on event days (Cardinal games, Gymnastic trials etc.)
Downtown needs people there for all reasons: residents, workers, conventions, tourists, and people seeking entertainment. We will see the number of people utilizing downtown organically go up when safety and infrastructure improve (didn't see a single policeman or police car in 2 hours milling around). Until then, for every step forward, we will take one back.
Sidenote, does anyone know why the fountains, pools and splash pad haven't been turned back on in City Garden? Is there an issue or are they taking a very conservative approach due to COVID?
Downtown needs people there for all reasons: residents, workers, conventions, tourists, and people seeking entertainment. We will see the number of people utilizing downtown organically go up when safety and infrastructure improve (didn't see a single policeman or police car in 2 hours milling around). Until then, for every step forward, we will take one back.
Sidenote, does anyone know why the fountains, pools and splash pad haven't been turned back on in City Garden? Is there an issue or are they taking a very conservative approach due to COVID?
Annex Lofts (attached to the Terra Cotta at 15th & Locust)jambo wrote: ↑Jul 27, 2021^Concerning the Shell Tucker shooting, is your loft located near that location? I am in ESL Lofts. Just curious.
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City Garden fountains have a leak requiring a $60,000 fix (the main pool/waterfall next to Kaldis*)
* going through some repairs itself, no word on opening
* going through some repairs itself, no word on opening
A lot of self full-filling prophecies in this thread. “I don’t go downtown much but one time I did it wasn’t busy”…..