6,123
Life MemberLife Member
6,123

PostJul 16, 2021#4426

Absolutely fantastic stuff GC! We saw Spanos jet into town a while back, as I recall. I haven't been keeping close enough tabs to see if K&!#nke has himself, but . . . I bet you're right about most all of that. Take it to trial. Drop some serious punitive hurt on some very powerful a$$hats.

In response to your unspoken batsignal challenge . . . 



My own take on a personalized batsignal just for you.



You the (Bat)man GC!

(Thanks to Daniel Shwen on the Wikimedia Commons for the skyline shot.)

1,680
Totally AddictedTotally Addicted
1,680

PostJul 16, 2021#4427

Thank you for explaining this in layman's terms.  What a story.

2,929
Life MemberLife Member
2,929

PostJul 16, 2021#4428

ibleedlou wrote:
Jul 15, 2021
gone corporate wrote:
Jul 15, 2021
addxb2 wrote:
Jul 13, 2021
Can someone send up the bat signal for GoneCorporate? I’d love to know their thoughts… They have a way of making me feel confident.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Couldn't resist using this picture now that there's the proper opportunity. Thanks for that... 

Well, I’ve been following this case like a hawk, and this entire NFL drama since word first leaked in January 2014 of Stank Kroenke buying land in Inglewood. I was out of town on vacation when Randy Karraker posted his tweets. I have to say that I was open-jawed amazed at what he wrote, then danced around a bit when I read of the bench order. Seriously, I danced a bit at this…
 
It remains quite possible that this case will not settle and therefore will continue all the way to trial.
Punitive Damages are absolutely in play.
 
Quick notes:

1.      The attorneys are working on a contingency basis and have fronted all the costs of the suit. No public or tax dollars have been used in any of this suit. Plus, it’s Bob Blitz’s law firm; he was the second half of the STL Task Force, along with Bob Peacock, to keep the Rams in STL. His firm’s been prepping this case with the same work notes they wrote in their efforts to keep the team here. They have incredible independence and autonomy in this suit. Since the beginning, they have stated that they want a judgment in open court, not a settlement. Even as they’re not beholden to the citizenry, public support for a judgment over a settlement is also high.

2.      IANAL… Missouri law states that Circuit Judge Christopher McGraugh’s bench order could only have been issued if the courts were presented with “clear and convincing evidence” that the plaintiffs were “intentionally harmed” from fraudulent actions committed by the defendants. Now, I’ve had hopes that the STL attorneys had some strong arguments they could make, but the fact that Judge McGraugh saw enough evidence in a pre-trial hearing to make this order has blown me away at how strong our case really is. Side note: I have a very high personal opinion of Judge McGraugh and his qualifications.

3.      The bench order means the financials for the named entities and individuals could be entered into the public record. The NFL has got to be beyond terrified of this. The only anecdotal financials of the NFL come from the Green Bay Packers’ annual financial statements, which are limited in size and scope. What this order will mean is that all financials and net worth assessments must be presented for the League and the Rams, as well as for Stank Kroenke (personally and professionally) and the other named owners, with the potential for other owners to be enjoined into this disclosure with that 10-day filing deadline given Monday. Think about it: some of the richest men/families/private businesses in America will have to provide full accountings of their net worth and financials to a court room, which will then have them available as part of the public record should it go to trial. How scared do you think Jerry Jones is right now? How about the League as it’s on the receiving end of future concussion-related settlements from former players?

4.      Financial data is in addition to the already submitted historical phone, text, and email records of the NFL, its franchises, and its franchise owners.

5.      Funniest part of this case… Bob Kraft is among the owners named by the court to provide his full financials as a part of this case… Remember a few years ago, when he was accused of attending the wrong type of massage parlor in south Florida, then had to figure a way out of it? Looks like this court order could compel him to provide ALL of that payout info... in addition to the previously submitted phone and text records! How scared do you think HE is right now?!?!?!

6.      Roger Goodell admitted in his deposition that the League’s relocation guidelines are mandatory and must be followed. The evidence is admittedly clear that the Rams’ relocation did not follow these relocation guidelines. That’s a hell of a lot of the case just right there.

7.      The Rams, LLC recognized loans from the NFL for the construction of the Inglewood stadium more than double the $300MM STL sought (and was chastised for seeking) from the NFL’s G4 loan program. I think they were around $700MM but could be mistaken. Exact financing will be a part of any disclosure.

8.     The Big Variable: The NFL entered into a new long-term media rights deal subsequent to construction of the SoFi Stadium in Inglewood, and the Rams’ & Chargers' relocation to Inglewood. (and the Raiders to Las Vegas, which is comparably incidental at best). Games will be broadcast on ABC; NBC; CBS; Fox; ESPN; Amazon; the NFL Network; and AT&T/DirecTV. Prior to this new contract, the League’s media rights deal was estimated at around $30BB… Starting in 2023, the new ten-year contract is valued at $100BB, as it now recognizes that 2 teams are now based in the LA metro area. 

ONE HUNDRED BILLION DOLLARS!!!



These monies will be split among all 32 NFL franchises. They all will be personally enriched with this new media rights deal. This increase in media rights value will absolutely be recognized by the Plaintiffs when considering how the League has increased annuitized revenues triple that from before the LA relocation. It's not just their current net worth; it's their forecasted future annuitized revenue streams that are at play when the plaintiffs are assessing damages against them. If I were a plaintiff’s attorney, I’d absolutely argue for a share of this revenue stream on a go-forward basis as part of any judgment.

9.      It’s a big story in STL media but not nationally, despite the fact that these are very, very serious charges against the League and some of its biggest owners. But, it’s not on ESPN or any of the other networks that have business relationships with the NFL for twelve-figures in cash. That’s not a coincidence. It’s not in their financial interests to bite the hand that feeds them.

10.      How was the NFL so stupid as to let this happen? Simple: They never thought the case would get out of arbitration. That’s what Stank Kroenke promised them. That's why he assumed so much potential liability. That’s why he fought for this to be appealed all the way to the US Supreme Court, which denied them cert. (And remember, it was the appeal to the MO Court of Appeals which enjoined all the other NFL franchises and their ownership into the suit). They never thought this would happen. I credit hubris and a lack of foresight.

11.      It is generally believed that Stank Kroneke & Kroenke Sports Enterprises assumed all costs associated to any and all legal actions that resulted from the Rams’ relocation from STL to Inglewood, that this was a precondition to the vote to relocation. We’ll see if the courts expands that liability to other parties…

12.      Rumors began circulating in NFL media a couple days before Monday’s pre-trial hearing that the NFL was considering expanding to 34 teams, creating 2 new franchises, and that STL was the top contender for one of them. This is one hell of a coincidence, as well as rather unlikely. It also follows how certain NFL media back in 2018 threw out the idea of the Chargers relocating to STL to settle this lawsuit right when it was picking up momentum, which Bernie Miklasz subsequently thrashed in an article that, sadly, has a dead link today. Basically, Bernie argued that the League must pay for everything, give ownership to local leadership, admit their bad behavior, and apologize for everything – publicly – to STL, and then maybe, MAYBE, we’d consider it.

13.      As Shadrack mentioned, any proof of the team tanking pre-relocation would be so mind-blowingly incredible that I have a hard time thinking about it. If he “Major League”’d us… if he Black Sox’d us… that’s for the FBI and way beyond anything that I can ramble on about, other than this would truly damn the Rams and the League. I'd think anyone connected with the business of organized gambling would be furious, let alone the Justice Department. The team’s Draft history certainly doesn’t help (building a defense when the offense needs help, making a 5’8” WR their top pick, et.al., then drafting a #1 QB once in LA)… Bring on Jeff “7-9” Fisher as a “hostile witness”.

14.      There are potentially other NFL suits that can emerge from this entire mess. First, if it’s true that the fix was in the entire time that Inglewood would be built, then there’s potentially another round of fraud suits against the NFL by the Chargers and the Raiders, whose joint proposal for the Carson Stadium project was rejected for the Inglewood Stadium project. That action came after the select Owners Committee on new stadiums sided in favor of the Carson proposal by I believe 6-1 over Inglewood. The Chargers could further an argument that their current domicile in Inglewood, as Stank Kroenke’s tenants, was established by unsavory means, perhaps even leading to an argument that their brand valuation has sharply decreased in direct correlation (no tears for the Spanos family, though). Then, there exists the very real risk that there could be a push for a lawsuit by the City of Atlanta and/or the State of Georgia against the NFL and the Atlanta Hawks, whose new stadium (opened 2017) was funded with public monies through their stadium authority, the Georgia World Congress Center, in December 2014. Now, this use of hundreds of millions in public dollars was partially done with the belief that the threat remained for all teams of relocation to Los Angeles should they not receive public support for new extravagant stadium construction. If the NFL was already committed to the Inglewood proposal beginning in 2013, then the Atlanta funding came without any knowledge of this (the Rams wouldn’t be approved for relocation until 2016). I don’t know how strong their case could be, but it’d be another high profile lawsuit with underlying accusations of fraud in play.

15.      The STL case is set to be held in a STL City Courtroom in mid-January 2022, right before the Super Bowl is to be broadcast from – guess where? – Inglewood, CA, about the first week of February 2022.
 
This really is the case of a lifetime for plaintiffs’ counsel. Godspeed.
 
 
Two Questions for any attorneys on this forum...
 
A.     What are the possibilities of criminal fraud charges being filed against Demoff or Grubman? I’ve read something in the last day that this may happen here. Are there statute of limitations considerations, or would those be voided if the evidence for such charges emerge as part of this case’s discovery?

B.     I’m trying to get a good understanding of what’s possible for Punitive Damages awards for this case… Would 3x sought damages be reasonable here? That’s my optimistic working estimate. This recognizes that we have a suit on contract law involving fraud and identifiable damages, for which preliminary damages are already estimated at $1.5-2BB; including the relocation fees of 3 teams and lost general revenues; plus the new lost opportunities from the new $100BB media rights package (which I believe could go beyond my guesstimate); leading to 3x punitive damages. Can anyone reasonably provide ballpark and max estimates? 
Great insight, very thorough take. You are not an attorney yourself?
Thanks. I Am Not An Attorney (IANAL). I did go to law school for a while until I had what alcoholics call a "moment of clarity" and decided to join the financial services industry instead, where my studies in contract law have been quite helpful, but I still cannot stand tax law...

Thanks to y'all for the compliments. I'm just trying to piece this all together myself. 

SymphonicPoet: Dude... You farking rock. Thanks for that. 
Also: Can you provide more info on that Spanos STL visit? I haven't heard about that at all, would appreciate any insight you can provide, especially corroborative links. Anyone else hear about that? 

I continue my request for any attorneys who participate on this forum to chime in and help me with the 2 questions I had; whether criminal charges could be made based on info from the case's discovery, and a better understanding of punitive damages under Missouri law. Cheers. 

212
Junior MemberJunior Member
212

PostJul 16, 2021#4429

Expect a settlement announcement to made nationally at 4:45 PM Eastern on a Friday afternoon. 🤑

144
Junior MemberJunior Member
144

PostJul 16, 2021#4430

gone corporate wrote:
Jul 16, 2021
ibleedlou wrote:
Jul 15, 2021
gone corporate wrote:
Jul 15, 2021

Couldn't resist using this picture now that there's the proper opportunity. Thanks for that... 

Well, I’ve been following this case like a hawk, and this entire NFL drama since word first leaked in January 2014 of Stank Kroenke buying land in Inglewood. I was out of town on vacation when Randy Karraker posted his tweets. I have to say that I was open-jawed amazed at what he wrote, then danced around a bit when I read of the bench order. Seriously, I danced a bit at this…
 
It remains quite possible that this case will not settle and therefore will continue all the way to trial.
Punitive Damages are absolutely in play.
 
Quick notes:

1.      The attorneys are working on a contingency basis and have fronted all the costs of the suit. No public or tax dollars have been used in any of this suit. Plus, it’s Bob Blitz’s law firm; he was the second half of the STL Task Force, along with Bob Peacock, to keep the Rams in STL. His firm’s been prepping this case with the same work notes they wrote in their efforts to keep the team here. They have incredible independence and autonomy in this suit. Since the beginning, they have stated that they want a judgment in open court, not a settlement. Even as they’re not beholden to the citizenry, public support for a judgment over a settlement is also high.

2.      IANAL… Missouri law states that Circuit Judge Christopher McGraugh’s bench order could only have been issued if the courts were presented with “clear and convincing evidence” that the plaintiffs were “intentionally harmed” from fraudulent actions committed by the defendants. Now, I’ve had hopes that the STL attorneys had some strong arguments they could make, but the fact that Judge McGraugh saw enough evidence in a pre-trial hearing to make this order has blown me away at how strong our case really is. Side note: I have a very high personal opinion of Judge McGraugh and his qualifications.

3.      The bench order means the financials for the named entities and individuals could be entered into the public record. The NFL has got to be beyond terrified of this. The only anecdotal financials of the NFL come from the Green Bay Packers’ annual financial statements, which are limited in size and scope. What this order will mean is that all financials and net worth assessments must be presented for the League and the Rams, as well as for Stank Kroenke (personally and professionally) and the other named owners, with the potential for other owners to be enjoined into this disclosure with that 10-day filing deadline given Monday. Think about it: some of the richest men/families/private businesses in America will have to provide full accountings of their net worth and financials to a court room, which will then have them available as part of the public record should it go to trial. How scared do you think Jerry Jones is right now? How about the League as it’s on the receiving end of future concussion-related settlements from former players?

4.      Financial data is in addition to the already submitted historical phone, text, and email records of the NFL, its franchises, and its franchise owners.

5.      Funniest part of this case… Bob Kraft is among the owners named by the court to provide his full financials as a part of this case… Remember a few years ago, when he was accused of attending the wrong type of massage parlor in south Florida, then had to figure a way out of it? Looks like this court order could compel him to provide ALL of that payout info... in addition to the previously submitted phone and text records! How scared do you think HE is right now?!?!?!

6.      Roger Goodell admitted in his deposition that the League’s relocation guidelines are mandatory and must be followed. The evidence is admittedly clear that the Rams’ relocation did not follow these relocation guidelines. That’s a hell of a lot of the case just right there.

7.      The Rams, LLC recognized loans from the NFL for the construction of the Inglewood stadium more than double the $300MM STL sought (and was chastised for seeking) from the NFL’s G4 loan program. I think they were around $700MM but could be mistaken. Exact financing will be a part of any disclosure.

8.     The Big Variable: The NFL entered into a new long-term media rights deal subsequent to construction of the SoFi Stadium in Inglewood, and the Rams’ & Chargers' relocation to Inglewood. (and the Raiders to Las Vegas, which is comparably incidental at best). Games will be broadcast on ABC; NBC; CBS; Fox; ESPN; Amazon; the NFL Network; and AT&T/DirecTV. Prior to this new contract, the League’s media rights deal was estimated at around $30BB… Starting in 2023, the new ten-year contract is valued at $100BB, as it now recognizes that 2 teams are now based in the LA metro area. 

ONE HUNDRED BILLION DOLLARS!!!



These monies will be split among all 32 NFL franchises. They all will be personally enriched with this new media rights deal. This increase in media rights value will absolutely be recognized by the Plaintiffs when considering how the League has increased annuitized revenues triple that from before the LA relocation. It's not just their current net worth; it's their forecasted future annuitized revenue streams that are at play when the plaintiffs are assessing damages against them. If I were a plaintiff’s attorney, I’d absolutely argue for a share of this revenue stream on a go-forward basis as part of any judgment.

9.      It’s a big story in STL media but not nationally, despite the fact that these are very, very serious charges against the League and some of its biggest owners. But, it’s not on ESPN or any of the other networks that have business relationships with the NFL for twelve-figures in cash. That’s not a coincidence. It’s not in their financial interests to bite the hand that feeds them.

10.      How was the NFL so stupid as to let this happen? Simple: They never thought the case would get out of arbitration. That’s what Stank Kroenke promised them. That's why he assumed so much potential liability. That’s why he fought for this to be appealed all the way to the US Supreme Court, which denied them cert. (And remember, it was the appeal to the MO Court of Appeals which enjoined all the other NFL franchises and their ownership into the suit). They never thought this would happen. I credit hubris and a lack of foresight.

11.      It is generally believed that Stank Kroneke & Kroenke Sports Enterprises assumed all costs associated to any and all legal actions that resulted from the Rams’ relocation from STL to Inglewood, that this was a precondition to the vote to relocation. We’ll see if the courts expands that liability to other parties…

12.      Rumors began circulating in NFL media a couple days before Monday’s pre-trial hearing that the NFL was considering expanding to 34 teams, creating 2 new franchises, and that STL was the top contender for one of them. This is one hell of a coincidence, as well as rather unlikely. It also follows how certain NFL media back in 2018 threw out the idea of the Chargers relocating to STL to settle this lawsuit right when it was picking up momentum, which Bernie Miklasz subsequently thrashed in an article that, sadly, has a dead link today. Basically, Bernie argued that the League must pay for everything, give ownership to local leadership, admit their bad behavior, and apologize for everything – publicly – to STL, and then maybe, MAYBE, we’d consider it.

13.      As Shadrack mentioned, any proof of the team tanking pre-relocation would be so mind-blowingly incredible that I have a hard time thinking about it. If he “Major League”’d us… if he Black Sox’d us… that’s for the FBI and way beyond anything that I can ramble on about, other than this would truly damn the Rams and the League. I'd think anyone connected with the business of organized gambling would be furious, let alone the Justice Department. The team’s Draft history certainly doesn’t help (building a defense when the offense needs help, making a 5’8” WR their top pick, et.al., then drafting a #1 QB once in LA)… Bring on Jeff “7-9” Fisher as a “hostile witness”.

14.      There are potentially other NFL suits that can emerge from this entire mess. First, if it’s true that the fix was in the entire time that Inglewood would be built, then there’s potentially another round of fraud suits against the NFL by the Chargers and the Raiders, whose joint proposal for the Carson Stadium project was rejected for the Inglewood Stadium project. That action came after the select Owners Committee on new stadiums sided in favor of the Carson proposal by I believe 6-1 over Inglewood. The Chargers could further an argument that their current domicile in Inglewood, as Stank Kroenke’s tenants, was established by unsavory means, perhaps even leading to an argument that their brand valuation has sharply decreased in direct correlation (no tears for the Spanos family, though). Then, there exists the very real risk that there could be a push for a lawsuit by the City of Atlanta and/or the State of Georgia against the NFL and the Atlanta Hawks, whose new stadium (opened 2017) was funded with public monies through their stadium authority, the Georgia World Congress Center, in December 2014. Now, this use of hundreds of millions in public dollars was partially done with the belief that the threat remained for all teams of relocation to Los Angeles should they not receive public support for new extravagant stadium construction. If the NFL was already committed to the Inglewood proposal beginning in 2013, then the Atlanta funding came without any knowledge of this (the Rams wouldn’t be approved for relocation until 2016). I don’t know how strong their case could be, but it’d be another high profile lawsuit with underlying accusations of fraud in play.

15.      The STL case is set to be held in a STL City Courtroom in mid-January 2022, right before the Super Bowl is to be broadcast from – guess where? – Inglewood, CA, about the first week of February 2022.
 
This really is the case of a lifetime for plaintiffs’ counsel. Godspeed.
 
 
Two Questions for any attorneys on this forum...
 
A.     What are the possibilities of criminal fraud charges being filed against Demoff or Grubman? I’ve read something in the last day that this may happen here. Are there statute of limitations considerations, or would those be voided if the evidence for such charges emerge as part of this case’s discovery?

B.     I’m trying to get a good understanding of what’s possible for Punitive Damages awards for this case… Would 3x sought damages be reasonable here? That’s my optimistic working estimate. This recognizes that we have a suit on contract law involving fraud and identifiable damages, for which preliminary damages are already estimated at $1.5-2BB; including the relocation fees of 3 teams and lost general revenues; plus the new lost opportunities from the new $100BB media rights package (which I believe could go beyond my guesstimate); leading to 3x punitive damages. Can anyone reasonably provide ballpark and max estimates? 
Great insight, very thorough take. You are not an attorney yourself?
Thanks. I Am Not An Attorney (IANAL). I did go to law school for a while until I had what alcoholics call a "moment of clarity" and decided to join the financial services industry instead, where my studies in contract law have been quite helpful, but I still cannot stand tax law...

Thanks to y'all for the compliments. I'm just trying to piece this all together myself. 

SymphonicPoet: Dude... You farking rock. Thanks for that. 
Also: Can you provide more info on that Spanos STL visit? I haven't heard about that at all, would appreciate any insight you can provide, especially corroborative links. Anyone else hear about that? 

I continue my request for any attorneys who participate on this forum to chime in and help me with the 2 questions I had; whether criminal charges could be made based on info from the case's discovery, and a better understanding of punitive damages under Missouri law. Cheers. 
It was to do with this tweet last year. The reason for the aircrafts presence has never been explained. The aircraft is Spanos private jet.

sc4mayor
sc4mayor

PostJul 16, 2021#4431

^ Huh, kind of surprised I missed that one.

Also wanted to pop in and give some props to GC for his reply and insights. Really appreciate you sharing all that here.

144
Junior MemberJunior Member
144

PostJul 16, 2021#4432

@gone corporate

Someone has put your post on the PD NFL Talk forum and its getting rave reviews! Should have stuck out law school. E-mail Blitz's firm and see if he needs any researchers 😆

sc4mayor
sc4mayor

PostJul 16, 2021#4433

^ Guess I need to repost this:

2,929
Life MemberLife Member
2,929

PostJul 16, 2021#4434

Suburban Sprawl wrote:
Jul 16, 2021
@gone corporate

Someone has put your post on the PD NFL Talk forum and its getting rave reviews! Should have stuck out law school. E-mail Blitz's firm and see if he needs any researchers 😆
BWAAAAAAAAAAAAAAhahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!!

I am not an attorney (IANAL), says so in the second note. Whatever, F it, glad to stir some stuff up.

sc4mayor
sc4mayor

PostJul 16, 2021#4435

^ Nothing better than stirring sh*t up, GC. Especially when you know what you’re talking about like you do.

6,123
Life MemberLife Member
6,123

PostJul 17, 2021#4436

Suburban Sprawl wrote:
Jul 16, 2021
gone corporate wrote:
Jul 16, 2021
ibleedlou wrote:
Jul 15, 2021
Great insight, very thorough take. You are not an attorney yourself?
Thanks. I Am Not An Attorney (IANAL). I did go to law school for a while until I had what alcoholics call a "moment of clarity" and decided to join the financial services industry instead, where my studies in contract law have been quite helpful, but I still cannot stand tax law...

Thanks to y'all for the compliments. I'm just trying to piece this all together myself. 

SymphonicPoet: Dude... You farking rock. Thanks for that. 
Also: Can you provide more info on that Spanos STL visit? I haven't heard about that at all, would appreciate any insight you can provide, especially corroborative links. Anyone else hear about that? 

I continue my request for any attorneys who participate on this forum to chime in and help me with the 2 questions I had; whether criminal charges could be made based on info from the case's discovery, and a better understanding of punitive damages under Missouri law. Cheers. 
It was to do with this tweet last year. The reason for the aircrafts presence has never been explained. The aircraft is Spanos private jet.
Yes, that was it precisely. While it's possible (maybe even likely) someone other than Spanos himself was riding the thing at the time, I'd be willing to place a bet on it being connected.

PostJul 17, 2021#4437

gone corporate wrote:
Jul 16, 2021
SymphonicPoet: Dude... You farking rock. Thanks for that. 
No no sir. You rock! And you're welcome. Not that I can promise it doesn't infringe on about three trademarks. It surely ain't terribly original. Or terribly polished. But . . . it's all yours! I'd be more than happy to send you a higher resolution or png copy so you can use it any way you see fit. (I'd have put the PNG version in the thread if I could have uploaded it to IMGUR.)

2,327
Life MemberLife Member
2,327

PostJul 17, 2021#4438

Found this blog post from a law firm regarding the case.

Pertinent info from the post:

When it comes to professional football, the NFL is of course the only significant game in town, as it were, and the courts have required that organizations like the NFL take extra steps to comply with federal monopoly/anti-competitive regulations. One such step was the Ninth Circuit requiring in 1984 that the NFL to adopt a “Relocation Policy” that must be followed before a team is allowed to move to another city. The policy requires a team to “work diligently and in good faith to obtain and maintain suitable stadium facilities in their home territories, and to operate in a manner that maximizes fan support in their current home community.”

Link
https://wagensellerlaw.com/city-st-louis-sues-nfl/

6,123
Life MemberLife Member
6,123

PostJul 18, 2021#4439

^This is going to be the stuff of movies. I can easily see this becoming a cross between Eight Men Out and The Pelican Brief.

144
Junior MemberJunior Member
144

PostJul 18, 2021#4440

@gone corporate 

Is there any risk at all of this falling at the summary judgment hearing next month? Surely not given recent revelations and its simply just team Kroenke trying to be as awkward as possible and using any means necessary to avoid court even if its in sheer desperation?

991
Super MemberSuper Member
991

PostJul 19, 2021#4441

I'm not GC (obviously), but I'd put this failing at the summary judgement hearing next month at 0.01%.  You're correct that it's just team Kroenke using every possible avenue to hopefully get this tossed.  I wouldn't label it as desperation as Kroenke's lawyer's also realize it's going to full trial or settlement, but still worth the hail mary to go through the motions and hope that the STL side might slip up in some way.

443
Full MemberFull Member
443

PostJul 19, 2021#4442

Suburban Sprawl wrote:
Jul 18, 2021
@gone corporate 

Is there any risk at all of this falling at the summary judgment hearing next month? Surely not given recent revelations and its simply just team Kroenke trying to be as awkward as possible and using any means necessary to avoid court even if its in sheer desperation?
I agree with Laife. Also, consider that the standard for prevailing on a Motion for Summary Judgment requires the moving party to demonstrate that there is no "genuine issue material fact" when the facts are viewed in the light most favorable to the non-moving party. The Judge has already found that there is clear and convincing evidence of fraud, so it would seem almost impossible for the NFL to win on SJ. 

2,929
Life MemberLife Member
2,929

PostJul 19, 2021#4443

shadrach wrote:
Jul 17, 2021
Found this blog post from a law firm regarding the case.

Pertinent info from the post:

When it comes to professional football, the NFL is of course the only significant game in town, as it were, and the courts have required that organizations like the NFL take extra steps to comply with federal monopoly/anti-competitive regulations. One such step was the Ninth Circuit requiring in 1984 that the NFL to adopt a “Relocation Policy” that must be followed before a team is allowed to move to another city. The policy requires a team to “work diligently and in good faith to obtain and maintain suitable stadium facilities in their home territories, and to operate in a manner that maximizes fan support in their current home community.”

Link
https://wagensellerlaw.com/city-st-louis-sues-nfl/
Solid link buddy. Very serious stuff here... I think it's been mentioned before somewhere in this thread, but the NFL has put at risk their entire business model by its conduct here. If it can be fully demonstrated in court that the League knowingly and deliberately violated its relocation policies, then they come under the risk of strongly increased Federal regulation. Much of this goes back to when the late Al Davis relocated the Raiders from Oakland to Los Angeles, doing so pretty much on his own initiative, the League be damned. Subsequently, the relocation policies were mandated by the NFL front office to keep all franchisees in compliance with Federal regulations of monopolies. Therefore, if the Rams' relocation can be found in court to be a conscious violation of the relocation policies as mandated by antitrust regulations, and last week's bench ruling sure as hell signifies this, then the entire NFL will be in crap up to its eyes when the Feds step in. It's also interesting how so much talk has been made in recent years about the excessive growth of certain technology companies (FAANG+M) leading to increased calls for anti-monopoly legislation being introduced against, specifically, Amazon and Facebook. Microsoft already had to endure this in the '90s, but now could be more severe. If the NFL is going to be under the microscope for antitrust issues, well, they sure as hell picked the wrong time to mess around. This will only increase their desire to settle, and will only increase the desire for the STL plaintiffs to stick it to them. 

PostJul 19, 2021#4444

symphonicpoet wrote:
Jul 18, 2021
^This is going to be the stuff of movies. I can easily see this becoming a cross between Eight Men Out and The Pelican Brief.
My hope is for an HBO movie with Bruce McGill in a strong supporting role (maybe as Jeff Fisher?). HBO doesn't have a share of the new NFL media contract, but they sure won't be getting any "NFL behind the scenes" shows afterwards for a very long time. 

Meanwhile, I don't want to get overly dramatic here, but The Pelican Brief is an interesting movie comparison. We don't have anything as monumental as Supreme Court Justices being taken down by a dark hit squad (let alone Julia Roberts being the only smart person to figure it out from, of all places, the French Quarter during Mardi Gras). That said, we are talking about a case involving billions of dollars; shady private business actions; multiple allegations of fraud; allegations of conspiracy; and some of the richest men in America, with Stank Kroenke trying really hard to be a big man in Hollywood. Seriously, billions of dollars; people can be tempted to do very bad things for very large sums of money. There could be some interesting crime noir coming out of this. "Forget it, Jake. It's Inglewood." Eh? Maybe not. 

2,419
Life MemberLife Member
2,419

PostJul 19, 2021#4445

Is this the kind of lawsuit that could have leadership in other professional sports leagues biting their fingernails? 

991
Super MemberSuper Member
991

PostJul 19, 2021#4446

Probably not - the only league that's potentially looking at team relocations in the near future is MLB, and those two situations (A's and Rays) are totally different from what the Rams pulled in STL.  

2,929
Life MemberLife Member
2,929

PostJul 19, 2021#4447

KansasCitian wrote:
Jul 19, 2021
Is this the kind of lawsuit that could have leadership in other professional sports leagues biting their fingernails? 
More like... I wonder if other pro sports leagues have any requirements for their franchises' ownership to not be convicted of fraud in the ownership of any other businesses, "conduct unbecoming an owner" and all that... 

i.e. This may be what Arsenal Football Club (Premier League, UK) fans may use to get Stank Kroenke to sell that team. His holding company Kroenke Sports & Entertainment also has ownership of the Denver Nuggets (NBA), the Colorado Avalanche (NHL), the Colorado Rapids (MLS), the Colorado Mammoth (National Lacrosse League), the LA Gladiators (Overwatch League), and the LA Guerrillas (Call of Duty League). 

2,419
Life MemberLife Member
2,419

PostJul 19, 2021#4448

I've been allowing myself to dream a bit on how dramatically this could affect Kroenke's status.

7,809
Life MemberLife Member
7,809

PostJul 19, 2021#4449

KansasCitian wrote:
Jul 19, 2021
Is this the kind of lawsuit that could have leadership in other professional sports leagues biting their fingernails? 
I don't think so as the other leagues haven't painted themselves into the corner line the NFL has.

IIRC the NHL and NBA don't have any anti-trust exemptions and can move/block teams as they like. The MLB might as they struggle with the As and Rays. The NFL ended up here after the Raiders Oakland > LA > Oakland drama and lawsuits plus their limited anti-trust exemption.

6,123
Life MemberLife Member
6,123

PostJul 20, 2021#4450

gone corporate wrote:
Jul 19, 2021
The Pelican Brief is an interesting movie comparison. We don't have anything as monumental as Supreme Court Justices being taken down by a dark hit squad (let alone Julia Roberts being the only smart person to figure it out from, of all places, the French Quarter during Mardi Gras). That said, we are talking about a case involving billions of dollars; shady private business actions; multiple allegations of fraud; allegations of conspiracy; and some of the richest men in America, with Stank Kroenke trying really hard to be a big man in Hollywood. Seriously, billions of dollars; people can be tempted to do very bad things for very large sums of money. There could be some interesting crime noir coming out of this. "Forget it, Jake. It's Inglewood." Eh? Maybe not. 
I thought about that. We also don't have any evidence of players throwing a series. But the two pictures seem to capture the particularly elevated level of drama and intrigue. The reputations and amounts of money at stake are, if anything, even higher than in the two pictures.

(I do sincerely hope this doesn't give anyone any ideas. I hope even Kroenke isn't quite that awful.)

Read more posts (1052 remaining)