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PostJun 10, 2021#476

SeattleNative wrote:
Jun 10, 2021
Open the gates! Expo developer promised a more affordable option than a Whole Foods type, which I see Straubs slotting is an.

Thanks for the photo. 

While I've only seen it from FPP, your photo confirms my impression that there hasn't been a whole lot of progress for a month of good weather. I suspect the lumber shortage has slowed things down a bit.

And regarding Straub's: I haven't shopped there regularly in a long time, but...you think Straub's is significantly more affordable than Whole Foods? They must have lowered their prices, like, a lot.  When I used to shop there, I'd spend nearly twice what the equivalent items would cost at Schnucks...

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PostJun 10, 2021#477

urbanitas wrote:
SeattleNative wrote:
Jun 10, 2021
Open the gates! Expo developer promised a more affordable option than a Whole Foods type, which I see Straubs slotting is an.

Thanks for the photo. 

While I've only seen it from FPP, your photo confirms my impression that there hasn't been a whole lot of progress for a month of good weather. I suspect the lumber shortage has slowed things down a bit.

And regarding Straub's: I haven't shopped there regularly in a long time, but...you think Straub's is significantly more affordable than Whole Foods? They must have lowered their prices, like, a lot...
Sorry. Misspoke. I see Straub’s in the same category as Whole Foods so I don’t see them as a fit.

Yeah, could be a lumber shortage, although the Hudson didn’t seem to have any issues.


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PostJun 11, 2021#478

SeattleNative wrote:
urbanitas wrote:
SeattleNative wrote:
Jun 10, 2021
Open the gates! Expo developer promised a more affordable option than a Whole Foods type, which I see Straubs slotting is an.

Thanks for the photo. 

While I've only seen it from FPP, your photo confirms my impression that there hasn't been a whole lot of progress for a month of good weather. I suspect the lumber shortage has slowed things down a bit.

And regarding Straub's: I haven't shopped there regularly in a long time, but...you think Straub's is significantly more affordable than Whole Foods? They must have lowered their prices, like, a lot...
Sorry. Misspoke. I see Straub’s in the same category as Whole Foods so I don’t see them as a fit.

Yeah, could be a lumber shortage, although the Hudson didn’t seem to have any issues.


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Went by again a few minutes ago and they have a bunch of framing on site. Don’t think they’re short on lumber. But might just be working on the bottom floors.


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PostJun 14, 2021#479




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PostJun 14, 2021#480

^Really gives a sense of how far west the southern building extends. Thanks for the update. 

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PostJun 15, 2021#481

Continuing to make progress. Additional photos, and different angles of this project and Hudson, available on my drone thread.






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PostJun 29, 2021#482

aprice wrote:
Jun 10, 2021
DTGstl314 wrote:
Jun 10, 2021
wabash wrote:
Mar 20, 2021
Maybe Straub's will work on closing their yawning gap in western central corridor coverage.  
Isn't there a Straub's literally five blocks directly east at Kingshighway & Maryland?
A 28 minute, 1.4 mile walk to the East, yes. With no direct path due to private streets. 
Or about a 4-6 minute drive, depending on traffic. I'm just kind of doubtful that Straub's would seriously consider adding a location to a place in which another existing Straub's is already one of the closest available grocery stores (United Provisions in the Loop is just slightly closer), which can't be said about many places in STL given that there are literally only four Straub's in the entire metro area.

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PostJun 29, 2021#483

DTGstl314 wrote:
Jun 29, 2021
aprice wrote:
Jun 10, 2021
DTGstl314 wrote:
Jun 10, 2021
Isn't there a Straub's literally five blocks directly east at Kingshighway & Maryland?
A 28 minute, 1.4 mile walk to the East, yes. With no direct path due to private streets. 
Or about a 4-6 minute drive, depending on traffic. I'm just kind of doubtful that Straub's would seriously consider adding a location to a place in which another existing Straub's is already one of the closest available grocery stores (United Provisions in the Loop is just slightly closer), which can't be said about many places in STL given that there are literally only four Straub's in the entire metro area.
Has Straubs opened other stores since the 2008 crash? I remember them opening a huge store in Chesterfield right before the crash and that didn't last very long. For a small company that could sting quite a bit. 

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PostJun 29, 2021#484

Northern edge of Expo is topped out at 4 floors. Rest is still going vertical.


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PostJul 05, 2021#485

The last thing we need right here is a Straub's. 

I go to the KHwy Straub's for a handful of things, but it's expensive without a commensurate helping of upscale: more expensive than WF with a far, far worse selection than WF. The healthy food at Straub is insanely high priced and most of the store is sodium-packed canned food, sodium-packed deli takeaway, jars of $11 sauce, &c. Selectionwise, it's only about 80% of the way to being a full serve supermarket, and it'll price out most of the people who are actually, y'know, using the transit station. It somehow manages to do a bad job of catering to regular people buying groceries and to the uberbourgie set. 

It's basically a place for rich people to buy stuff they could get cheaper elsewhere but they don't want to see anyone with less money than themselves in the store.

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PostJul 05, 2021#486

throatybeard wrote:The last thing we need right here is a Straub's. 

I go to the KHwy Straub's for a handful of things, but it's expensive without a commensurate helping of upscale: more expensive than WF with a far, far worse selection than WF. The healthy food at Straub is insanely high priced and most of the store is sodium-packed canned food, sodium-packed deli takeaway, jars of $11 sauce, &c. Selectionwise, it's only about 80% of the way to being a full serve supermarket, and it'll price out most of the people who are actually, y'know, using the transit station. It somehow manages to do a bad job of catering to regular people buying groceries and to the uberbourgie set. 

It's basically a place for rich people to buy stuff they could get cheaper elsewhere but they don't want to see anyone with less money than themselves in the store.
There’s about 0% chance it will be Straubs. The developer said it would not be a Whole Foods type grocer.


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PostJul 06, 2021#487

Anyone know when this project is expected to be finished, and when the grocery store might be announced/open?

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PostJul 06, 2021#488

The developer said they'd announce the grocery store within 45 days about 90 days ago.

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PostJul 06, 2021#489

PeterXCV wrote:Anyone know when this project is expected to be finished, and when the grocery store might be announced/open?
Finished in Spring of 2022


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PostJul 06, 2021#490

quincunx wrote:
Jul 06, 2021
The developer said they'd announce the grocery store within 45 days about 90 days ago.
And at this point, I'd trust anything this developer says about negative ten percent.

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PostJul 06, 2021#491

symphonicpoet wrote:
May 13, 2021
^There's certainly no rule that you can't put more steel into a building than required. The 5 over 2 is a minimum, if I understand it correctly, not a maximum. And local laws may (and doubtless do) vary. (Stagehands and musicians are doubtless not great resources on local and national building code.)
6 stories is about the maximum with standard load-bearing wood framing.  You can go taller with lighter floors and higher grade, bigger or more closely spaced studs, or with engineered wood products, but that added cost becomes counter-productive very quickly in all but a handful of markets.

PostJul 06, 2021#492

Laife Fulk wrote:
Mar 19, 2021
I can't see Amazon choosing this location for their first in the St. Louis market.  I'll guess it'll be a second location for a local place like Golden Grocer or City Greens.
Also, it wouldn't be Amazon's first in the St. Louis market.

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PostJul 07, 2021#493

urbanitas wrote:
Laife Fulk wrote:
Mar 19, 2021
I can't see Amazon choosing this location for their first in the St. Louis market.  I'll guess it'll be a second location for a local place like Golden Grocer or City Greens.
Also, it wouldn't be Amazon's first in the St. Louis market.
Praying it isn’t Amazon. But most importantly, I just want a full service grocer within walking distance.


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PostJul 07, 2021#494

throatybeard wrote:
Jul 06, 2021
quincunx wrote:
Jul 06, 2021
The developer said they'd announce the grocery store within 45 days about 90 days ago.
And at this point, I'd trust anything this developer says about negative ten percent.
They're getting the project done are they not? That was a whole lot of talk. When no one on here knows what goes on behind the scenes prompting a push Bach, wanting to say that you're not going to trust this developer's words is laughable. The announcement timeframe is now late summer/early fall. A grocery store/market-like tenant will be here and the announcement will eventually come. 

If I were the developer, I would announce prior to the development opening up next year.

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PostJul 07, 2021#495

chriss752 wrote:
Jul 07, 2021
throatybeard wrote:
Jul 06, 2021
quincunx wrote:
Jul 06, 2021
The developer said they'd announce the grocery store within 45 days about 90 days ago.
And at this point, I'd trust anything this developer says about negative ten percent.
They're getting the project done are they not? That was a whole lot of talk. When no one on here knows what goes on behind the scenes prompting a push Bach, wanting to say that you're not going to trust this developer's words is laughable. The announcement timeframe is now late summer/early fall. A grocery store/market-like tenant will be here and the announcement will eventually come. 

If I were the developer, I would announce prior to the development opening up next year.
My mistrust of them has very little to do with timeframe and everything to with the racism they spewed in justifying the project. They may think residents are too stupid to see through their code for "we had to get rid of that strip mall with the Black people at it," but guess what, we aren't.

PostJul 07, 2021#496

SeattleNative wrote:
Jul 07, 2021
urbanitas wrote:
Laife Fulk wrote:
Mar 19, 2021
I can't see Amazon choosing this location for their first in the St. Louis market.  I'll guess it'll be a second location for a local place like Golden Grocer or City Greens.
Also, it wouldn't be Amazon's first in the St. Louis market.
Praying it isn’t Amazon. But most importantly, I just want a full service grocer within walking distance.


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Provisions is within a medium walk. And it's at least as close to being a full service grocer as KHwy Straub, if not closer.

That said, a closer grocery would be at least one saving grace from this grotesque matchstick interstate motel looking pile of lumber. Built by developers obsessed in their public comments with crime, of which there was very little at the strip mall, who called a functioning strip mall blighted because there were AfAm businesses in it, and on whose consruction site you see only white laborers.

But hey at least some bourgeoisie like me won't have as far to walk to buy fruit. Progress.

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PostJul 07, 2021#497

throatybeard wrote:
Jul 07, 2021
chriss752 wrote:
Jul 07, 2021
throatybeard wrote:
Jul 06, 2021
And at this point, I'd trust anything this developer says about negative ten percent.
They're getting the project done are they not? That was a whole lot of talk. When no one on here knows what goes on behind the scenes prompting a push Bach, wanting to say that you're not going to trust this developer's words is laughable. The announcement timeframe is now late summer/early fall. A grocery store/market-like tenant will be here and the announcement will eventually come. 

If I were the developer, I would announce prior to the development opening up next year.
My mistrust of them has very little to do with timeframe and everything to with the racism they spewed in justifying the project. They may think residents are too stupid to see through their code for "we had to get rid of that strip mall with the Black people at it," but guess what, we aren't.
Yes, because that sh*tty strip mall and parking lot were SOOO much better for the City and neighborhood than what we're getting there currently.

This project had nothing to do with running minority owned businesses and people out of the neighborhood. The thing was mostly vacant and looked terrible. It was a major detraction to the neighborhood's aesthetics and didn't fit the Transit Oriented Development plan for the neighborhood and area. There were several things going wrong with it long before you could even pull "racism" out of the air.

If you and others think and thought the development was truly "racist", then you should've complained during the neighborhood meetings and contacted the developer to complain. The ship has long sailed and you, and people who have the same mindset as you, been left on the dock as it sails away to prosperity. It's just "racist" because you and others hate it, and that's fine. Call it a "grotesque matchstick interstate motel looking pile of lumber" if you want but overall, it's a clear improvement over what was once there.
Built by developers obsessed in their public comments with crime, of which there was very little at the strip mall, who called a functioning strip mall blighted because there were AfAm businesses in it, and on whose consruction site you see only white laborers.
This comment right here proves that your hate for the project has absolutely nothing to do with the development itself and everything with the developer. Forget "racism" for a moment and think. All you want is that strip mall back, which was a terrible land use. You're sour that a developer is investing millions into a neighborhood in the City of St. Louis and along a street that went to hell pretty quickly and is now being transformed. And in case you weren't aware, you and your neighborhoods live in a part of the city where land values are at a premium and apartments consistently fill up because this is where people want to be. Low-density usages like a strip mall and parking lot, of which the owners were willing to make a deal to sell and develop on, is not what this city needs. We need more developments like Expo to link our neighborhoods and stitch back the density that we once had (and there will be more).

If you and your neighbors don't like it, well then I don't know what to tell you all. You're stuck with this now no matter how much you hate it.

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PostJul 07, 2021#498

i like the project. ***** strip malls. and ***** cars.

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PostJul 07, 2021#499

urbanitas wrote:
Jul 06, 2021
symphonicpoet wrote:
May 13, 2021
^There's certainly no rule that you can't put more steel into a building than required. The 5 over 2 is a minimum, if I understand it correctly, not a maximum. And local laws may (and doubtless do) vary. (Stagehands and musicians are doubtless not great resources on local and national building code.)
6 stories is about the maximum with standard load-bearing wood framing.  You can go taller with lighter floors and higher grade, bigger or more closely spaced studs, or with engineered wood products, but that added cost becomes counter-productive very quickly in all but a handful of markets.
Sorry, I wasn't clear there. Five over two is a term I've heard thrown around a lot lately for what I used to call four story stick, but with a steel framed garage underneath. I don't mean to say you can make a wood frame structure infinite height, but I think the two stories of steel framing is a minimum amount of steel, for your twigrise not a maximum. (Otherwise downtowns would be a lot shorter than they are.) Mind you, I don't mean to say you could put a four story wooden hat on top of the Sears Tower, but I don't think having a five over two as a part of your structure would prevent you from having five stories of solid steel as another wing.

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PostJul 07, 2021#500

throatybeard wrote:
SeattleNative wrote:
Jul 07, 2021
urbanitas wrote: Also, it wouldn't be Amazon's first in the St. Louis market.
Praying it isn’t Amazon. But most importantly, I just want a full service grocer within walking distance.


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Provisions is within a medium walk. And it's at least as close to being a full service grocer as KHwy Straub, if not closer.

That said, a closer grocery would be at least one saving grace from this grotesque matchstick interstate motel looking pile of lumber. Built by developers obsessed in their public comments with crime, of which there was very little at the strip mall, who called a functioning strip mall blighted because there were AfAm businesses in it, and on whose consruction site you see only white laborers.

But hey at least some bourgeoisie like me won't have as far to walk to buy fruit. Progress.
I don’t really remotely see Provisions as meeting my grocery needs. I’m glad it’s nearby, but I rarely shop there other than to add a couple items.

I agree with you that the strip mall was not “blighted.” And I was upset by their comments that there was already enough affordable housing in the neighborhood so that they didn’t feel the need to contribute units.

But that strip mall was terrible land use next to one of St. Louis’ busiest transit stops. We absolutely need to get more people living on top of our transit stops and a strip mall doesn’t do that.

My hope for the grocer continues to be a Schnucks Culinaria type store that serves all residents from the surrounding neighborhoods and further (as the transit stop gives great access).


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