urbanSTL

Can you consolidate police, parks, health, etc. across two independent jurisdictions? I’m actually asking because I don’t know. I imagine maybe parks and health might be more doable. Obviously there have been some successes over the years like the ZMD, MSD, etc. but those aren’t operated by the city and county governments.

Then there was the merged economic development agencies…that ended up with a county executive and several cohorts in federal prison. Never mind the regular accusations of favoritism for the county when it came to various site selections and whatnot. I’m sure it didn’t help the city was still independent from the county…

How would consolidating, for example, the city and county PDs work if both the city and county are going to continue to operate independently? Because of the city’s independent nature it’s required to carry out its own county functions. St. Louis County would have to do the same. So if the PDs were combined somehow…wouldn’t each county still have to operate an individual sheriffs office as the city is required to do now? If we could get away with doing some of this without a “merger” vote, I’m all for it…I just wonder if the existing separation makes even that too difficult.

I also think a bare-minimum re-entry, while certainly not a slam dunk, would be easier to get past the voters than people think. Some of this is based on my own personal anecdotes with the County folks I work and hang out with. I also know the Municipal League (a primary opponent to BT) supports the BoF and has said re-entry could be a good way forward to start. If Pat Kelly can get the mayors of St. Louis County on board with that they may be able to get their constituents to vote for it. Even my rabid conservative family members who were fully against (if not aghast) at BT even want re-entry. Most people seem to know that the way we do things here is broken. We just can’t agree on how to fix it.

Maybe a simple re-entry would fail but after what people saw could happen with BT I think there are more open minds out there than some of us here think. I know there has been a sea change among the people I personally know…but obviously that can’t be extrapolated across the County.

Anyway, just some thoughts I had. Really great discussion.

npav wrote: ↑

Jun 17, 2021

The cost of re-entry?  Many politicians currently holding power lose their seats as aldermen or neighborhood police chiefs or other positions that only exist because of the regional fragmentation.  So the people who are needed to have the political willpower to push this through, are some of the ones who are least motivated personally to make it happen.

While there are some positions, especially in the city, that would be eliminated as redundancies (the county functions)...they wouldn't be aldermen or police chiefs.  From a County perspective re-entry just bumps the number of County municipalities from 88 to 89 (or however many there are now) and as others have mentioned would require adding a couple of council seats.  It wouldn't trigger any personnel changes in the small police departments or cities that litter the metropolitan area, that is if I'm understanding "aldermen and neighborhood police chiefs" as you intended it.  County municipalities would be largely unaffected by re-entry, at least as I understand it.

Probably just need to have a municipal bond/tax increase thread since there are always so damn many of them.  Coming up in August!
https://www.stltoday.com/news/local/gov ... f0f6d.html

The college district is among several jurisdictions seeking property tax hikes at the August election.

In St. Louis County, the Kinloch Fire Protection District has two separate propositions — each calling for a 25-cent increase — on the ballot while the Northeast Ambulance and Fire Protection District wants voters to approve a single 34-cent increase.

Also seeking a boost in property taxes, of up to 15 cents, is the Warrenton Fire Protection District in Warren and Lincoln counties. 

Greendale, a small municipality near Normandy, is proposing a $410,000 bond issue to upgrade streets, sidewalks and landscaping and to repair the city garage.  The ballot wording would allow a property tax increase, if needed, to pay off the bonds. However, Greendale officials said Thursday that revenue from an existing sales tax would be used to pay off that debt and a tax increase isn’t planned.
They said the only way a tax hike would occur is if the city doesn’t have sufficient other funds to pay the debt service, which is not expected.

Clayton and Frontenac also are seeking property tax hikes for various city services.

Hooray for fragmentation!

Finally!  Something I can agree with.

Merge St. Louis police departments? Neidorff says yes, but obstacles remain
https://www.bizjournals.com/stlouis/new ... s-yes.html

Even if the political will for a merger existed, logistical concerns would have to be overcome. They include how to handle pay rates, pension plans and job assignments, Rosenfeld said.  But such questions previously were answered, at least in part.

A failed 2019 attempt by the group Better Together to merge the city and county governments would have consolidated not just the city and county departments, but also those of smaller municipalities.
Jane Dueker, a lobbyist for the primary city and county police unions, said the Better Together plan, after negotiation with the unions, envisioned:

• Keeping in place collective bargaining agreements; 
• Solving "transition issues," with officers initially keeping their rank in a merged department, and city officers coming in at the county's higher pay scale;
• Keeping officers in their current pension plans, with a new plan for new hires;
• And disallowing forced transfers, in which an officer in the city, for example, could be assigned to West County.

"The line police officers and staff were at the table," Dueker said of the Better Together proposal, though they never voted on the plan because it was scrapped. "I think there may be a way to do it" now.  Rosenfeld agreed that those issues could be resolved. More important, he said, are the potential benefits of such a tie-up.  Those include operational efficiencies, but also improvements to crime-fighting. "Crime doesn't respect the border," he said. "One then would ask what are the advantages of having two police departments, with jurisdiction over these two entities, when, in fact, crime spills over that borderline quite frequently."  Dueker said "having a big unified department could have tremendous benefits." "It would have all similar training, there would be no false line between the city and county," she said.

Dueker said the unions have had no discussions with Neidorff, but would be willing to meet. She warned, though, that any combination is likely to fail "without input from those charged with carrying out policing in the region."  Still, she gave Neidorff credit for speaking out while violent crime rates remain high.

"The community has to be united in the fact that crime has to be the No. 1 issue, and it's not," Dueker said. "It takes courage for such an important business person to give it the urgency it needs."

I actually think Dueker's comments are somewhat encouraging.

I didn't say she wasn't a piece of sh*t...