MVVA is considering the idea of permanently closing a portion of Memorial Drive:
http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/metr ... 6907a.html
http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/metr ... 6907a.html
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More correctly, others are considering closing Memorial Drive. This is part of the 90-day vision to plan process and would be a change from the MVVA plan.Framer wrote:MVVA is considering the idea of permanently closing a portion of Memorial Drive:
http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/metr ... 6907a.html
UrbanOmnibus has a great article on Michael Van Valkenburgh's vision and plan for the development of Brooklyn Bridge Park. It includes a 5 minute video featuring Michael himself. I've tried embedding the video, but can't seem to make it work. Perhaps someone savvier will be able to make that happen.
Here's the link: Park as Process: Brooklyn Bridge Park. Enjoy!
Here's the link: Park as Process: Brooklyn Bridge Park. Enjoy!
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I guess we can look forward to the end of January for a modified design. From the PD article today:
http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/arti ... 2bc8b.htmlMicahel Van Valkenburgh, whose MVVA firm was selected from five finalists, said that "a real substantive answer" for what the project will look like comes Jan. 24, when a modified design is made public
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So we have new BPV designs, and the arch designs coming in January. Looks like 2011 will be starting with a bang!
Danforth Foundation gives $1 million for Arch grounds improvements
link: http://www.stlbeacon.org/issues-politic ... n-for-arch
link: http://www.stlbeacon.org/issues-politic ... n-for-arch
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Depending on which story you read, it appears that the $1M is just for finalizing the plans that will be revealed Jan 24.
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“Report to the Community”
THE DESIGN CONCEPT PRESENTATION
JANUARY 26 AT AMERICA’S CENTER, FERRARA THEATRE
WHERE
America’s Center, Ferrara Theatre, Downtown St. Louis
Main entrance is on Washington Avenue at Eighth Street
Lead designer Michael Van Valkenburgh, members of his design team and others, will update the community on the design concept and discuss next steps for invigorating the Arch grounds and making connections to downtown St. Louis, the Mississippi River and the Illinois riverbank area, and next steps for community comments.
WHEN Wednesday, January 26 – doors open at 5:30 p.m.
• 6:00 p.m. – 7:15 p.m. – Public Presentation in Ferrara Theatre
WHO
• Julie Buck, radio personality, M.C.
• Tom Bradley, Superintendent, Jefferson National Expansion Memorial
• Michael Van Valkenburgh, Michael Van Valkenburgh Associates
• Jamie Carpenter, James Carpenter Design Associates
• Scott Newman, Cooper Robertson & Partners
• Walter Metcalfe, CityArchRiver 2015 Foundation
For information and to pre-register (not required): http://www.cityarchrivercompetition.org/
PLEASE NOTE: This is a public event and will not include questions or discussion from the audience. Members of the media are permitted to bring photographic and video equipment into the theater and will be permitted to come and go. One-on-one interviews for media will be offered at the conclusion of the event.
THE DESIGN CONCEPT PRESENTATION
JANUARY 26 AT AMERICA’S CENTER, FERRARA THEATRE
WHERE
America’s Center, Ferrara Theatre, Downtown St. Louis
Main entrance is on Washington Avenue at Eighth Street
Lead designer Michael Van Valkenburgh, members of his design team and others, will update the community on the design concept and discuss next steps for invigorating the Arch grounds and making connections to downtown St. Louis, the Mississippi River and the Illinois riverbank area, and next steps for community comments.
WHEN Wednesday, January 26 – doors open at 5:30 p.m.
• 6:00 p.m. – 7:15 p.m. – Public Presentation in Ferrara Theatre
WHO
• Julie Buck, radio personality, M.C.
• Tom Bradley, Superintendent, Jefferson National Expansion Memorial
• Michael Van Valkenburgh, Michael Van Valkenburgh Associates
• Jamie Carpenter, James Carpenter Design Associates
• Scott Newman, Cooper Robertson & Partners
• Walter Metcalfe, CityArchRiver 2015 Foundation
For information and to pre-register (not required): http://www.cityarchrivercompetition.org/
PLEASE NOTE: This is a public event and will not include questions or discussion from the audience. Members of the media are permitted to bring photographic and video equipment into the theater and will be permitted to come and go. One-on-one interviews for media will be offered at the conclusion of the event.
Looks like the improvements have not generated the visits -
I think at least part of this has to be attributed to the design. The selected entry was the least inspired and probably the "safest" pick by the selection committee. It looks better, but it did not accomplish anywhere near the integration or activation that the other proposals had.
Likewise I feel the selection committee for the yet to be named GRG Central Corridor trail have made the same mistake, with a safe, uninspired selection and it will yield the same results.
https://www.bizjournals.com/stlouis/new ... s_headline
I think at least part of this has to be attributed to the design. The selected entry was the least inspired and probably the "safest" pick by the selection committee. It looks better, but it did not accomplish anywhere near the integration or activation that the other proposals had.
Likewise I feel the selection committee for the yet to be named GRG Central Corridor trail have made the same mistake, with a safe, uninspired selection and it will yield the same results.
https://www.bizjournals.com/stlouis/new ... s_headline
I don’t buy the claim the PARK is less successful. We’re talking tickets and museum entry, not PARK visits. My coworkers and I probably increased our park visits annually by 5x pre vs post improvements.
It’s so much more welcome and accessible to non-tourist.
This is the biz journal doing what it does best. Find a non-issue and cultivate mistrust between the public and spending.
It’s so much more welcome and accessible to non-tourist.
This is the biz journal doing what it does best. Find a non-issue and cultivate mistrust between the public and spending.
Looks like you know why I canceled my subscription a few years ago.addxb2 wrote: ↑Feb 07, 2020I don’t buy the claim the PARK is less successful. We’re talking tickets and museum entry, not PARK visits. My coworkers and I probably increased our park visits annually by 5x pre vs post improvements.
It’s so much more welcome and accessible to non-tourist.
This is the biz journal doing what it does best. Find a non-issue and cultivate mistrust between the public and spending.
^ Month long+ government shutdown didn't help last year either. But there is something to be said for the way the park ended up. The park itself is stunning, its beautiful and a vast improvement. But some of the original ideas like the beer garden in the summer/ice rink in the winter, the cathedral square multi level restaurant, etc. would have gone a long way toward activating the park a little more and brining more and repeat visitors. Unfortunately the NPS had other ideas...
"Find a non-issue and cultivate mistrust..."addxb2 wrote: ↑Feb 07, 2020I don’t buy the claim the PARK is less successful. We’re talking tickets and museum entry, not PARK visits. My coworkers and I probably increased our park visits annually by 5x pre vs post improvements.
It’s so much more welcome and accessible to non-tourist.
This is the biz journal doing what it does best. Find a non-issue and cultivate mistrust between the public and spending.
I believe you have described the strategy of every remaining "news" media slinger...
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Considering the state of affairs at the Arch grounds prior to the renovation, I can't argue too much about the money spent. The infrastructure was aging and dated. Even with less visitors, the face of STL does a way better job of representing the city now.
The arch grounds are very pleasant but the redesign missed a huge opportunity. Opted for a one block solution for a 10 block problem.
They really should have listened to the grassroots voice of city2river.
They really should have listened to the grassroots voice of city2river.
Have to agree and believe the visitors will be back in time. They needed to tackle the Arch Grounds infrastructure and I can't wait to enter through the new entrance, space & renovated museum. Too bad the existing railroad track makes a similar entrance from the east almost impossible. Otherwise, you could literally have a gateway to the West experience when you visit the Arch.GoHarvOrGoHome wrote: ↑Feb 07, 2020Considering the state of affairs at the Arch grounds prior to the renovation, I can't argue too much about the money spent. The infrastructure was aging and dated. Even with less visitors, the face of STL does a way better job of representing the city now.
Imran, I think the opportunity in the future is about removing the raised freeway, bring the freeway up to an at grade intersection with Wash Ave and rebuild going north into a blvd in order to reconnect downtown with Laclede's Landing/North Riverfront. That will provide huge opportunities to redevelop at a very reasonable cost to improve infrastructure. I would argue that should city next priority after the old 22nd street interchange/Jeff Ave/MLS stadium is built but the unfortunate reality is the city needs a commitment from the State/MoDOT to make it happen and who knows what kind of imaginary red tape walls have been added with the new Interstate designation. But as you noted, city missed a golden opportunity to engage in some voices that wanted to go beyond the Arch Grounds when the opportunity presented itself.
Ok, realized that I have written some posts with the same theme. The city needs a vision on future infrastructure needs, what to change, what to add, what to get rid off and a plan to get there.. For the Arch Grounds, to me it is how to better connect the north and south riverfronts to the rest of the city for continued development and therefore better access to the Arch Ground.
The renovation was sold as increasing visitors, but that wasn't the main reason for it. Yes, updating aging infrastructure, but more importantly it was solving the problem of folks parking in the Arch garage, going up in the Arch, then leaving town without seeing anything else downtown.
One could argue about the choice for a lid as opposed to converting the depressed section of I-44 to a boulevard, but I do think this project meet that goal. The folks who are coming to see the Arch are parking in downtown and walking through downtown to get to the Arch. Anecdotally, there's been a lot of folks walking around when I've been down there, even on non-game days.
Is it perfect? No. Is it an improvement? Yeah, a pretty big one IMO. I do think the numbers will come in time. But even is not it doesn't make the work worthless.
I would be interested to see if there's been a measurable financial impact from the changes. I know Laclede's Landing development is booming now, though it may be simply rebounding from several years of restricted access during construction (plus the restoration Lucas Ave). But what about downtown west of Memorial Dr?
-RBB
One could argue about the choice for a lid as opposed to converting the depressed section of I-44 to a boulevard, but I do think this project meet that goal. The folks who are coming to see the Arch are parking in downtown and walking through downtown to get to the Arch. Anecdotally, there's been a lot of folks walking around when I've been down there, even on non-game days.
Is it perfect? No. Is it an improvement? Yeah, a pretty big one IMO. I do think the numbers will come in time. But even is not it doesn't make the work worthless.
I would be interested to see if there's been a measurable financial impact from the changes. I know Laclede's Landing development is booming now, though it may be simply rebounding from several years of restricted access during construction (plus the restoration Lucas Ave). But what about downtown west of Memorial Dr?
-RBB
^All good points. I think another consideration is how - if at all - it's improved the lives of Downtown residents. Sure, they're not going to go up in the Arch or Museum of Westward Expansion any more often, but if it's proving to be a popular place to jog, picnic, play frisbee, take the kids, etc... there's a lot to be said for that - although it's much harder to quantify.
Good point newstl2020, if ever ALL CAPS was appropriate, WHY IS THAT CORNER NOT DONE YET? The new alignment of the highway lid and Kiener garage Arch parking already shifts all visitors away from Wash Ave and toward BPV. The casual / out of town visitor that previously would have looked to Laclede's Landing or Wash Ave for a drink or meal after visiting the Arch is now going to look straight to BPV as it offers something of a spectacle in itself (i.e. Cardinals Hall of Fame & Museum) that is also near where they parked. Having a completely busted up and dysfunctional entrance/crosswalk between the Park and Wash Ave just seems to throw salt in that wound.
Good point newstl2020, if ever ALL CAPS was appropriate, WHY IS THAT CORNER NOT DONE YET? The new alignment of the highway lid and Kiener garage Arch parking already shifts all visitors away from Wash Ave and toward BPV. The casual / out of town visitor that previously would have looked to Laclede's Landing or Wash Ave for a drink or meal after visiting the Arch is now going to look straight to BPV as it offers something of a spectacle in itself (i.e. Cardinals Hall of Fame & Museum) that is also near where they parked. Having a completely busted up and dysfunctional entrance/crosswalk between the Park and Wash Ave just seems to throw salt in that wound.
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I visited this weekend for the first time, though I have walked the grounds a few times. The museum is impressive. It’s on-par with other national museums and I was very proud to accompany a friend who was hosting someone from France.
I know none of you want to hear this but removing the parking garage was a mistake in my opinion. STL residents and most visitors travel by car to get to the museum and are now forced to park further away Maybe not that much further away but it’s hard for regular people to find garages without markings or directionals, especially with all the one-ways.
Also here is a pic of this corner
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Based on a quick Google Maps review, looks like it's been in its current state since at least summer 2018. What?
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I think the Arch project should have gotten the parking garages downtown to up their game to get the windfall handed them. Signage for arch parking downtown in private garages is abysmal. The big garages along Kiener plaza have only exits facing the plaza. Entrances are on Pine with almost zero help for visitor to learn that. The Arch website uses the center of those garages as the destination point, so half the time their own app directs visitors to the Kiel garage exits on chestnut instead of entrances on Pine.dbehrens011 wrote:
I visited this weekend for the first time, though I have walked the grounds a few times. The museum is impressive. It’s on-par with other national museums and I was very proud to accompany a friend who was hosting someone from France.
I know none of you want to hear this but removing the parking garage was a mistake in my opinion. STL residents and most visitors travel by car to get to the museum and are now forced to park further away Maybe not that much further away but it’s hard for regular people to find garages without markings or directionals, especially with all the one-ways.
Also here is a pic of this corner
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Apparently all those garages are owned by out of state companies so they don’t give a whit.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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I think if they had built a comparable garage in Laclede's Landing. (A lot of people liked the Drury parcel, though i was partial to the the lot between 1st and 2nd next to the MLK Bridge) then the loss would have been mitigated and perhaps even a net positive as it would drive visitors to engage with the landing. A faux historic garage with street level retail stalls would be a reasonable land use, and allow for GRG to remove the garage east of commercial street as well and kick off their greenway improvements.dbehrens011 wrote: ↑Feb 11, 2020I know none of you want to hear this but removing the parking garage was a mistake in my opinion. STL residents and most visitors travel by car to get to the museum and are now forced to park further away Maybe not that much further away but it’s hard for regular people to find garages without markings or directionals, especially with all the one-ways.
Of course the time to build it seems like it was when the landing was half closed already due to resetting the cobblestones rather than now when the landing is still trying to get its legs back. Drury is still just sitting on their property and i don't get a sense that is going to change anytime soon.
FWIW the Kiener garages and Ballpark East garage are as close or closer to the arch museum entrance than the old arch garage was. So its not strictly a proximity issue.
One of my absolute favorite ideas for an arch parking solution was the Blvd proposal for Memorial Dr. through downtown and to turn the cavity under it (formerly the depressed lanes) into the a new multi level arch parking garage which would serve both the arch and the downtown area immediately adjacent. A close second was the idea to build a large parking facility underneath Kiener Plaza. Both could have had the bonus effect of helping to make the Kiener garages obsolete and hastening their redevelopment. Of course, it seems like those idea's time may have come and gone, but maybe in a couple decades we can revisit them...
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