urbanSTL

Would the proposed office space house tech workers associated with the data center or would they be leasing primarily to outside companies?

I know data centers do not employee a ton of people, so I assume the latter. 

Reminder: Data centers are predicated on the theory that AI will start making crazy revenue to pay for the trillions in capital investment over the past several years.

This is not based in reality and is fundamentally based on emotion. Most Data center supporters are also unhinged, on this very forum as well.

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Incorrect. Every function of the internet relies on data centers and a majority of functionality on every social media, e-commerce, and entertainment websites already supported by AI. There is no theory. If you are on the internet (including this website) you are already using AI. 

addxb2 wrote:Incorrect. Every function of the internet relies on data centers and a majority of functionality on every social media, e-commerce, and entertainment websites already function with the assistance of AI. There is no theory. If you are on the internet (including this website) you are already using AI.  

https://www.visualcapitalist.com/sp/bhp ... 2014-2025/

Take note, my point is that it is very unlikely that there will ever be the profit necessary to pay for all of this massive boom in data center construction, much less pay the supposed massive property taxes, which is the only good argument for it. Has nothing to do with the nominal purpose of data centers or the historic purpose of data centers. But naturally you have to deflect because you experience cognitive dissonance.

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So, with the Lifetime Fitness and Residences plan at the Boulevard seeming to be the latest fail in the second phase of that development, why not put the health club in the Armory Building and build the residential on the lot between the Armory and Grand? Add in a new hotel building too, and that should be a winner. Hotel guests and residents have special access to the health club, public can join if they wish. Any unused space in the Armory, then consider turning into some other area amenities or whatever. It’s large enough and such usages would be good to have at the MetroLink and connected to the Foundry via new pedestrian bridge.

Lifetime Fitness in the City would be great and make quite a statement.  Unfortunately I dont think the income demographics in the area meet their criteria. 

Lifetime Brentwood Blvd still moving forward.

Chris Stritzel wrote: ↑

7:42 PM - Mar 19

So, with the Lifetime Fitness and Residences plan at the Boulevard seeming to be the latest fail in the second phase of that development, why not put the health club in the Armory Building and build the residential on the lot between the Armory and Grand? Add in a new hotel building too, and that should be a winner. Hotel guests and residents have special access to the health club, public can join if they wish. Any unused space in the Armory, then consider turning into some other area amenities or whatever. It’s large enough and such usages would be good to have at the MetroLink and connected to the Foundry via new pedestrian bridge.

Honestly, my big wish is that the Foundry development team would swoop in and rescue the Armory from this fate. It would make such a natural extension of The Foundry complex. It just needs that better connection for pedestrians. There is enough parking. I wish GRG would have prioritized this ped bridge over 64/40...having that amenity would make all the difference in this situation and would have likely served as a come-on, to the Foundry owners. 

SRQ2STL wrote:

Chris Stritzel wrote: ↑

7:42 PM - Mar 19

So, with the Lifetime Fitness and Residences plan at the Boulevard seeming to be the latest fail in the second phase of that development, why not put the health club in the Armory Building and build the residential on the lot between the Armory and Grand? Add in a new hotel building too, and that should be a winner. Hotel guests and residents have special access to the health club, public can join if they wish. Any unused space in the Armory, then consider turning into some other area amenities or whatever. It’s large enough and such usages would be good to have at the MetroLink and connected to the Foundry via new pedestrian bridge.

Honestly, my big wish is that the Foundry development team would swoop in and rescue the Armory from this fate. It would make such a natural extension of The Foundry complex. It just needs that better connection for pedestrians. There is enough parking. I wish GRG would have prioritized this ped bridge over 64/40...having that amenity would make all the difference in this situation and would have likely served as a come-on, to the Foundry owners. 

This is what the city should be working towards and incentivizing.

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Goodwill midtown data center to be approved

This is more or less proof that democracy doesn't exist in the City of St. Louis and it makes it increasingly difficult to criticize Missouri or the federal government's anti-democratic actions when we do the same stuff.

St. Charles City is more democratic.

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250 testify in opposition does not outweigh a aldermen who represents 20,000 people being in support

This will just be one of those projects down the road that we see 10% of what is promised, actually realized

As far as going forward, we need to leverage these data centers to save our most at risk historic architecture, particularly our brick industrial and warehouse buildings (especially those less conducive to residential repurpose), many of which lie in the north riverfront. As much as I’ve held out for something better, may be the only way to avoid the pervasive fires that happen in those

Other than that, there’s just not many positives of having these in the urban core. Should avoid


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dbInSouthCity wrote:250 testify in opposition does not outweigh a aldermen who represents 20,000 people being in support

The point is that the city doesn't follow the will of the people. There's a 0% chance this would pass on a city-wide vote. The BoA not following the popular opinion of those they represent do not magically make their decision "democratic." You can't spin this any other way than the capital interest's opinion outweighing the overwhelmingly one-sided opinion of residents of the city.

It's hard to complain about Jefferson City when City Hall acts the same way.

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What about the Preservation Board?

StlAlex wrote: ↑

9:43 PM - Mar 29

dbInSouthCity wrote:250 testify in opposition does not outweigh a aldermen who represents 20,000 people being in support

The point is that the city doesn't follow the will of the people. There's a 0% chance this would pass on a city-wide vote. The BoA not following the popular opinion of those they represent do not magically make their decision "democratic." You can't spin this any other way than the capital interest's opinion outweighing the overwhelmingly one-sided opinion of residents of the city.

It's hard to complain about Jefferson City when City Hall acts the same way.

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Why do you believe this as 0% chance of passing on a city-wide vote?  I am not sure the people who showed up to the town halls are a representative opinion of the city at large.

^Do you honestly think he's wrong about this one? Nationally data centers are so spectacularly unpopular right now, and the opposition is so focused that I'm inclined to agree with him. I don't want to say the folks who showed up at a town hall are representative of city opinion, but I expect they're more representative than we are, and they're probably a much better proxy for those who will show up and vote. Hyperbole aside,  I think it's a fairly safe bet that this would go down by a very wide margin if it were up for a vote.

Can data centers be useful? Yes. Do large data centers belong in dense urban neighborhoods? Hell no. Is this a dense urban neighborhood? Not yet, but it has the potential to become one. It's adjacent to one, and with a little imagination and connectivity it could be one. We all want to see our historic architecture preserved. But even more than that we all want to live in dense, walkable, vibrant cities. The first can't be the enemy of the second.

STLAPTS wrote: ↑

2:24 AM - Mar 30

StlAlex wrote: ↑

9:43 PM - Mar 29

dbInSouthCity wrote:250 testify in opposition does not outweigh a aldermen who represents 20,000 people being in support

The point is that the city doesn't follow the will of the people. There's a 0% chance this would pass on a city-wide vote. The BoA not following the popular opinion of those they represent do not magically make their decision "democratic." You can't spin this any other way than the capital interest's opinion outweighing the overwhelmingly one-sided opinion of residents of the city.

It's hard to complain about Jefferson City when City Hall acts the same way.

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Why do you believe this as 0% chance of passing on a city-wide vote?  I am not sure the people who showed up to the town halls are a representative opinion of the city at large.

The large majority of people that would go vote in a special election would be those that are also going to the town halls to voice their opinion. 

Something to consider, this project significantly increases the likelihood that the MERS Goodwill Building could one day become residential. The data center development is going to restore the exterior, clear the decay indoors, and provide clear floor plans. It’ll be primed for residential/office conversion if data centers drop off.

I think the alternative is Goodwill leaves as they’ve suggested will happen regardless and this building will sit vacant until it has to be demolished because it’s simply too much SQFT to convert.

Even if the data center requires demo of the building, its replacement will be easier to convert.

The Mers Goodwill building will be demolished as part of their plan. Do you mean its shorter replacement? 

I think that's definitely possible. I'd like to see them go 1-2 floors higher on the new build to get back to the massing of the Goodwill building. The highrise data center proposal in KC is very attractive, imo. 

STLAPTS wrote:

StlAlex wrote: ↑

9:43 PM - Mar 29

dbInSouthCity wrote:250 testify in opposition does not outweigh a aldermen who represents 20,000 people being in support

The point is that the city doesn't follow the will of the people. There's a 0% chance this would pass on a city-wide vote. The BoA not following the popular opinion of those they represent do not magically make their decision "democratic." You can't spin this any other way than the capital interest's opinion outweighing the overwhelmingly one-sided opinion of residents of the city.

It's hard to complain about Jefferson City when City Hall acts the same way.

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Why do you believe this as 0% chance of passing on a city-wide vote?  I am not sure the people who showed up to the town halls are a representative opinion of the city at large.

How out of the loop are you? Data centers are currently the only thing both the left and right agree are bad according to polling data. I've yet to meet anyone in my personal life who lives in the city who actually likes the idea of this site becoming a data center. Beyond that, the anti-data center crowd would be much more energized to vote it down. 0% chance it would pass a city-wide vote. It would lose by a very wide margin.

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dylank wrote: ↑

2:13 PM - Mar 30

The Mers Goodwill building will be demolished as part of their plan. Do you mean its shorter replacement? 

I think that's definitely possible. I'd like to see them go 1-2 floors higher on the new build to get back to the massing of the Goodwill building. The highrise data center proposal in KC is very attractive, imo. 

Maybe. It’s not a given yet that preservation board will allow a demo, the building got put on historic list by green street. Plan B I assume would be to internally reconfigure

TheWayoftheArch_V2.0 wrote: ↑

5:51 PM - Mar 30

That alderman represents me and I do not support this and told him so. 

Can't wait until the hum of this thing ruins the Foundry experience. 

Laura Keys is a she