urbanSTL

quincunx wrote: ↑

Nov 19, 2021

Preservation review districts are up to the alderman in that it's a matter of aldermanic courtesy.

That’s partially true but the districts are already established (the existing ones) that won’t go away with new wards, current district will stay as is (unless a specific bill is passed to change that, doubt that will happen)

Prelim agenda
https://www.stlouis-mo.gov/government/d ... 0-2021.pdf

These City boards have gotten out of control. They need to go away or at least get new membership.

The Engineers Club building was a mistake and never should have been built in the first place. It looks totally out of place for the City and is ridiculously suburban. Looks better suited for Creve Coeur. This development can help fix that mistake.

Call me crazy, but I didn't move to St. Louis to celebrate or honor the traffic-oriented development that this city built when it was cutting off its nose to spite its face. 

I'd raze the thing and free up the entire site if it were up to me. 

FYI, besides the Chairman of the Aldermanic Committee on Public Safety (Ald Coater), the other board members are appointed by the mayor.

We look to them to protect the walkable places for people, which usually overlaps with the old, but that's not what they're mean to do. The community has expressed what they want through elected officials through ordinances. The PB is meant to give much deference to that, tax base, population growth, etc, not as much.

Stlgasm used to be on it. I hope he'll weigh in..

^JiveCitySTL (Randy) was on the Preservation Board. Randy and Jeff have to be the two most confused for each other people in St. Louis

LOL, my bad.

I guess you go back to city leadership willing to work a deal with developers and green lighting this project as a few others.  The city has an opportunity to add this density, along w Optimist proposal, as well as Opus 14 story corner proposal.  Three significant dense urban developments that add value, residents and what comes along with it (foot traffic for local business, taxes, so on).   

While I think the dense urban proposal that got turned by Webster Grove city council was too much for context of its surroundings it would be a shame if the city starts embracing the same mentality on projects that have been up for review lately but actually fit well IMO. 

I did serve on the Preservation Board for several years and while I can't really speak for any other board members, I do know that neighborhood engagement is high on the list when it comes to influencing opinions.  I have heard through the grapevine that there was very little public engagement on the Engineers Club proposal, so maybe that has something to do with the decision.  Not sure how I would have voted on this one (depends on the presentation, which I missed), but from what I have seen I think I'd probably be okay with it because it did incorporate at least a portion of the existing structure in the project footprint, and it certainly would increase density, which is a good thing.  But of course there could be a number of other factors that led to the majority vote against it that I am unaware of.  All in all, I am satisfied with Lux's revision of the Optimist site, and if they can execute a sensitive development that preserves the most striking features of the existing Engineers Club I would *think* it would be a win-win.  Have to get the scoop from some of the other commissioners....

StlToday - As St. Louis’ historic buildings crumble, city eyes little-used powers some say can help save them

https://www.stltoday.com/news/local/met ... b935a.html

^Good! Let's hope Lousteau can steer the ship in the right direction. On top of that, I love her name. Nice to see both some French and more specifically New Orleans connections. (Mind you, having a French name doesn't necessarily mean much. Even I have some French heritage buried deep down there somewhere on the Moginot side, but it'd be hard to prove it from a family dinner. Still, it's cool to see that connection. And then mispronounce it.)

This months agenda - New town houses in Soulard, new home in Benton Park - and the usual windows and retaining walls 


https://www.stlouis-mo.gov/government/d ... 2022-2.pdf

So question on these PRB findings. Say, for example, this one: 

ADDRESS: 4525 Lindell Boulevard 
ITEM: Appeal of the Director’s Denial to retain & install 352 windows

The short version: these guys started replacing every window in the building with aluminum windows before getting a permit. They were stopped partway through by an inspector and told they needed a permit. They permit they applied for included the 44 aluminum windows already installed, which was denied. This agenda item is to discuss an appeal of the denial.

The recommendation is that the denial be upheld. My question is re: enforcement of these types of denials - are they going to be required to replace the 44 installed windows with compliant ones?  What are the repercussions if they don't? 

And are there any differences in enforcement between, say property owners of a large multifamily building versus an individual home owner?  There's a similar appeal of a retaining wall installed using non-approved materials without a permit that is expected to be upheld. What if that person refuses to redo that wall?

-RBB

rbb wrote: ↑

Jan 24, 2022

So question on these PRB findings. Say, for example, this one: 

ADDRESS: 4525 Lindell Boulevard 
ITEM: Appeal of the Director’s Denial to retain & install 352 windows

The short version: these guys started replacing every window in the building with aluminum windows before getting a permit. They were stopped partway through by an inspector and told they needed a permit. They permit they applied for included the 44 aluminum windows already installed, which was denied. This agenda item is to discuss an appeal of the denial.

The recommendation is that the denial be upheld. My question is re: enforcement of these types of denials - are they going to be required to replace the 44 installed windows with compliant ones?  What are the repercussions if they don't? 

And are there any differences in enforcement between, say property owners of a large multifamily building versus an individual home owner?  There's a similar appeal of a retaining wall installed using non-approved materials without a permit that is expected to be upheld. What if that person refuses to redo that wall?

-RBB

Enforcement is the same for this building or me putting in 1 window on a garage. What happens if the person doesn’t do it? They can appeal the Boards decision at the Circuit Court. What happens if they ignore the Boards decision? City takes them to court.

^Thanks for the rundown. Any ideas on what kind of penalties might result from losing in court? I assume some sort of penalty fee, that accumulates further over time, potentially resulting in a lien being placed on the property? But then what - can the city auction your property to recoup the penalty? If not, and if you're not planning on selling the home, would the lien matter? What's the "worst" that the city could legally do if a property owner outright refuses to comply?

By SeattleNative

NextSTL - The societal cognitive dissonance of demolition and reverence in St. Louis

https://nextstl.com/2022/02/the-societa ... -st-louis/

I do agree with Tony's article, those little pieces of St. Louis' historic architecture are almost painful to look at. But something that's been on my mind is that there is broad recognition among urbanists and preservationists that St. Louis' greatest asset is its historic architecture. Yet I haven't noticed much of a change in strategy about how to save buildings and neighborhoods at risk. Other than the Prop N-S program, it doesn't seem to me that preservationists' power has increased in the last decade. We decry that they tear down hundred+ year old buildings for gas stations or just nothing, but it doesn't seem to be getting any easier. 

And I don't notice much discussion about how to change that. 

After the 1900 Olive debacle, there was talk of making changes by Ald Ingrassia. I guess nothing cam of it.

Then there's the demolition by neglect process passed by the BoA that hasn't been used. Not even for 7200 S Broadway where supposedly everything was tried.

^A good reminder. Now who's going to hold her accountable to that promise? 

Feb 28 prelim agenda

https://www.stlouis-mo.gov/government/d ... -28-22.pdf

Final agenda is now posted... infill construction items are two single-fams on Geyer in McKinley Hts. & two townhomes on Lami in Soulard. Both have staff recommendations for preliminary approval. 

https://www.stlouis-mo.gov/government/d ... 8-2022.pdf

The 33 Westmoreland denial is nuts. That house isn’t even original to the neighborhood, it was built in 41 with little merit.  The addition improves the scale and massing since the house is so undersized compared to its neighbors.  Not sure what they want, do they want it to step in vs flush to the house?

Editing- the board made a good point, there is really no way to match the brick and slate so it will be an obvious addition.  Sounds like they suggested a step in so the material match won't matter as much.


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