urbanSTL

Xing wrote:


They should build a Victoria's Secret School for Fashion Models downtown. Oh, and I go to one of those downtown schools. Fun stuff, I'm telling ya.

Which campuses specifically are in downtown Chicago? Are there dorms down there, or are they satellite campuses?

I know that DePaul and Loyola have Loop campuses, and I think that Northwestern's law school is in the Loop.

Fordham in NYC has a campus for its fine and liberal arts students in the Upper West Side.

A couple months back I emailed the lead developer at Desco who oversees the OPO stuff and I asked him why they couldn't sign a bookstore to a lease. He never wrote back so I must have hit a nerve. I could have exposed his own failure in signing decent tenants and he couldn't admit it.

Northwestern has its Medical, Law and Business Schools all downtown.

ComandanteCero wrote:Northwestern has its Medical, Law and Business Schools all downtown.

It would be awesome if St. Louis could get a downtown university complete with dorms. Other than Webster U, that is.

I think it would be a good option for UMSL, Lindenwood or Maryville - the colleges that aren't centrally located.

I'm a Webster U Graduate, and I'm really excited that they're moving more classes Downtown. I don't know how much you guys know about Webster, but it started out as a small Liberal Arts School, and has, especially over the course of the last 15-20 years, really branched out in their business, communications, and thechnology. Right now its about a 50/50 split between the two, as far as enrollment goes. I would love to see the University move its Fine and Liberal Arts Programs downtown. I think with the direction they are going, there may be the chance for that (or something similar) in the future. Even when I was going there (3 years ago, when classes were in the Lammert building) there were classes that could only be taken downtown. I think a sizeable student population that lives in the area (my guess would be about 300-400 liberal and fine arts majors who live on campus at Webster) and not just night students could really add another piece to the puzzle downtown.

The ugly truth is that a lot of money spent to develop the Downtown Now! plan, and City Hall essentially flushed it down the toilet. An RFP should have been issued. This is a mediocre development.



For those who don't know, the Old Post Office was renovated in the '80s and it wasn't successful. Also, the spin DESCO took is that the Century was sacraficed to "save the other buildings" district. WRONG. All other buildings were spoken for without the garage, and the Old Post Office has almost as much protection as the Statue of Liberty, so while they stress how important it is to "save" the gem, it wasn't going anywhere regardless. To add insult to injury, two local development companies offered proposals to rehab the Century into lofts AND parking.



I truly feel like the Old Post Office deal is the lousiest project underway amidst a downtown that is growing and thriving around it.

I remember the OPO about 14 years ago when it was a small hub of activity. I guess we have to be patient but I too think the space and the market could bear some high end, speciality retail. I certainly won't be patronizing a Pasta House Express.

STLgasm wrote:The ugly truth is that a lot of money spent to develop the Downtown Now! plan, and City Hall essentially flushed it down the toilet. An RFP should have been issued. This is a mediocre development.



For those who don't know, the Old Post Office was renovated in the '80s and it wasn't successful. Also, the spin DESCO took is that the Century was sacraficed to "save the other buildings" district. WRONG. All other buildings were spoken for without the garage, and the Old Post Office has almost as much protection as the Statue of Liberty, so while they stress how important it is to "save" the gem, it wasn't going anywhere regardless. To add insult to injury, two local development companies offered proposals to rehab the Century into lofts AND parking.



I truly feel like the Old Post Office deal is the lousiest project underway amidst a downtown that is growing and thriving around it.

I am so glad that somebody sees this deal for what it is -- a boondoggle and tragedy. Remember the Century!

I read on Ecology of Absence recently that there will be no on-street parking for the Old Post Office District...



http://ecoabsence.blogspot.com/

Monday, October 31, 2005

The joke gets funnier every day



The new "old" curbs are in, the sidewalks are being paved and the vintage light standards are up at the Old Post Office in St. Louis. One thing is clear: there will be no on-street parking on the Old Post Office block when the renovation is done. This is number 1,456,349 of 10,000,000 Ways In Which This Project is Designed to Fail Before It Is Even Complete, the actual blueprint being used by the developers (recycled, of course, from the St. Louis Centre project).



Really, for a project whose backers are so paranoid about insufficient adjacent parking, it's a huge embarrassment that there is no actual street parking on the Old Post Office block itself. Such parking would be convenient to people wanting to stop in at one of of the Old Post Office shops and would form a protective buffer between sidewalk diners and through traffic on Olive, Ninth, Locust or Eighth streets. Assuming any of those people ever show up.



posted by Michael Allen

-----



Now, look at this picture someone posted at the beginning of this thread, apparently from the 1960s:







Notice the on-street parking.



Now, with a lack of any compelling restaurant options for the OPO so far, perhaps on-street parking won't be such a priority. But I'd have to agree with EOA in that this project has just left a bitter taste in everyone's mouth.



I'll try to be more positive...anyone know if any new tenants were announced for this project?



Thoughts?



UPDATE: Wow, good timing on my part. There's a Post-Dispatch article about the renovation work on the OPO today.

[Entire Article Below]



Developers offer hope for the Old Post Office



With a 24-foot-deep moat around it, a somber, fortress-like granite exterior

and nothing much going on inside, the Old Post Office mostly has been a dead

spot downtown for years.



After preservationists kept it standing amid demolition threats in the 1960s

and 1970s, its federal owners spent $16 million in the 1980s to renovate it.

Even that failed to perk up the place.



But a $45 million revival, instigated by Webster University nearly eight years

ago, is likely to change all that.



In the months ahead, as construction dust continues to fly, passersby will see

signs of what's coming.



Many of the heavy, almost 14-foot-tall wood entrance doors around the

121-year-old landmark will be opened and secured permanently into place.

Doorway openings will be filled with glass, and in some cases, glass revolving

doors.



Visible from outside will be painters brightening walls and the ornate columns

with lighter colors. Kiosks and partitions built during the 1980s' renovation

are already gone. The original postal screen with teller windows is coming back

to the lobby.



"We're making the building brighter, more inviting, and taking it back as close

as we can to its original look," said Gwen Knight, a vice president at the

Desco Group Inc., which is redeveloping the building with DFC Group Inc. "And

when people walk by, they'll see inside rather than looking into those big,

closed-up, wood doors."



Even more dramatic is the lineup of who's about to move into what's been mostly

a federal office building, giving it a life it's not had before.



In early January, Webster University will begin classes on one of six levels

there after moving and expanding its downtown campus from the nearby Lammert

Building. In mid January, 11 judges and staff at the Missouri Court of Appeals

Eastern Division - a group of about 65 - will take over the top two floors. The

big courtroom there, still ornate and two stories tall, has chief Judge Glenn

Norton dazzled.



"It's magnificent," he said, "... a big awesome space that has been going to

waste" since federal judges moved out in 1935.



Including Webster, the judges, and others moving in later, about two-thirds of

the building's 157,000 square feet of rentable space is leased so far.



In mid-March, when most of the tenants are expected to be settled in, the

developers plan to reopen the building to the public.



By then, J. Kim Tucci expects to have his Pasta House Co. Pronto restaurant

open with a coffee house area and outdoor dining on the patio.



Nearby on the first level, visitors will find an Old Post Office architectural

and history museum with replicas of original drawings and other rare materials.

An art gallery is coming to a lower level.



Arts-related groups and organizations will supply rotating exhibits for the

gallery, said Steven Stogel, DFC's president.



Also opening, probably in April, is the St. Louis Public Library.



Library executive director Waller McGuire said it will be "kind of a high-end

bookstore," with books, magazines, DVDs and other materials to check out.

Patrons also will be able to use a computer there to order from Central

Library, 1301 Olive Street, and branch libraries.



"We think of this as outreach to the business community and new residents

downtown," McGuire said, "and for people not able to make it to Central at

lunch time or on breaks."



Downtown Now hopes to have a small public park north of the building open by

spring.



To finance the renovation and a $32 million parking garage across the street,

on the site of the demolished Century Building, the developers relied heavily

on state and federal tax credits and other public assistance. The state wound

up owning the garage and the Old Post Office, and may move some state offices

there.



"We're looking at all sorts of options," said Dave Mosby, director of

facilities management, design and construction for the state.



In designing space for tenants, Trivers Associates Architects took on some

unusual challenges.



One was making the stone-faced building look and feel more friendly. And

because it's a national landmark still treasured by national and local

preservationists, Trivers had to restore as much as possible while making space

inside workable and comfortable for modern-day tenants.



Trivers decided to remove the dark and drab pink and terra cotta colors that

came with the 1980s renovation, said the firm's president, Andrew Trivers.



The new, lighter colors are "close to original," Trivers said. And special

lighting being added will brighten things even more.



The developers also are taking out partitions and drop ceilings that enclosed

spaces and in some cases, covered architectural features. An ornate ceiling and

plasterwork was uncovered in one courtroom being converted into a law library.



One particularly challenging area was the first level, a nearly 26-foot-tall

space with an original skylight and ornate columns throughout. In the middle is

a square hole beneath the skylight that's part of an atrium that was cut down

into the building's two underground levels in the 1980s.



Trivers said the team wanted to keep the room's open look after removing the

kiosks and partitions. But they also had to design space for the restaurant,

library, St. Louis Business Journal and another tenant.



The solution, after deciding to glass-in exterior doorways, was more glass for

the tenants.



"By putting them behind glass walls, that leaves the look of the columns

intact, and the room looks open," he said.



Another challenge was getting natural light into the floor below - one of the

building's two underground levels - for Webster's campus. Trivers did that by

cutting windows in classrooms to face the atrium.



Webster has about 650 evening students, and will expand with daytime classes

and special programs and activities for downtown businesses, workers and

residents.



"Maybe seminars, speakers, or a small ensemble to do music at lunchtime," said

campus director Beth Russell.



On the upper floors, one challenge was protecting the judges. Trivers used

security glass to block off certain areas and designed a bullet-proof bench for

the large courtroom.



University President Richard Meyers said the building is turning out "even

better" than he imagined years ago when Webster stepped forward with the idea

for reviving it.



Karen Luebbert, Meyers' executive assistant, still remembers the area around

the Old Post Office back then.



"You saw buildings boarded up, some falling down, a lot of pigeons, and not a

lot of people.



"But now," she said, "you see revitalization at the Paul Brown, the old school

board building, the Roberts Orpheum. ... We're confident this will be very

successful too."



Carolyn Toft is executive director of the Landmarks Association of St. Louis

Inc., which led the battle to save the Old Post Office. But Landmarks lost a

later fight to save the marble-clad Century, which, together with the Syndicate

Trust Building, once housed the Scruggs-Vandervoort-Barney department store.



The Century went down for the 1,050-space garage. The Syndicate Trust remains,

so far still empty.



"Now we are anxious to see the Syndicate Trust project get under way," Toft

said.



Old Post Office through the years



1884 - U.S. Customhouse (Old Post Office) opens after more than a

decade of construction with federal courtrooms, offices, and storage areas for

gold bullion and other federal assets.



1935 - Federal judges move to new courthouse at Tucker and Market

Streets.



1961 - Federal employees move to new building at 1520 Market Street,

leaving behind only small Post Office branch.



1964 - General Services Administration decides to build a new

federal building on the site, igniting protests by Landmarks Association of St.

Louis Inc. and national preservationists.



1970 - The rare French Second Empire-style building, designed by

Alfred Bult Mullett, becomes a National Historic Landmark.



1975 - Postal branch closes, leaving the building empty.



1976 - Congress approves bill pushed by St. Louisans to allow leased

space for mixed uses in federal buildings.



1977 - General Services Administration decides to keep the Old Post

Office.



1982 - Building reopens after a $16 million renovation with federal

offices above space for shops, restaurants, a postal branch and other

commercial activity. Shops, art gallery, food court and other commercial open,

but later close.



1998 - Webster University proposes an education and culture center.



2000 - Federal tenants begin moving to new Thomas F. Eagleton U.S.

Courthouse.



2001 - The Desco Group Inc. and DFC Group Inc. begin work on a

revival plan.



2002 - Postal branch closes; building is empty again.



2004 - State takes ownership; $45 million renovation begins.



---------------------



There's still nothing too specific in there as far as new tenants. The library branch is a joke. How many people "can't make it" to the Central library who truly want to go there on a lunch break? Why spend $50 million renovating the Central library?



Also, I love the reference to the new "small public park" that will be created north of the OPO. I think downtown has a large enough public park already called the Gateway Mall just a couple blocks south.

And an even larger NATIONAL park just a few blocks to the east.



Actually, I don't have a problem with the OPO park - as long as the land can be used for new construction when there's a market for residential or office space.

Nothing against Pasta House but the location and space is ideal for something really unique, maybe upscale in the evening with casual/fun during the day.

What the Post-Dispatch often ghost-written by the Mayor's top political advisor won't tell you:



If you were able to see the OPO in the 1980s and 1990s before it went vacant, you would see that the 1982 $16 million renovation was fairly nice.



That the City and State crafted a deal for Slay and Holden contributors Stogel and Schnuck that now costs $45 million for the OPO, plus another $32 million for Century demolition and Ninth Street Garage construction, looks like a fairly inflated price to pay. But then, no one is reporting the hefty developer fees for developers that just happen to also be major Slay/Holden contributors.



The City sued the previous owner of the Syndicate/Century to stop that private owner's demolition plans, then became owner of the Syndicate/Century. Meanwhile, the feds (GSA) sold the OPO to the State of Missouri. The combined City/State ownership of these two blocks allowed for a closed deal to go to developers who happen to also be campaign donors to the chief City and chief State elected officials.



Craig Heller offered a private alternative to redeveloping the Century/Syndicate, but with an abrasive City development czarina, Heller quietly backed down. Only after the City/State completed their OPO/Century deal did the City then finally issue an RFP for the remaining Syndicate Trust building.



Preceding demolition, developers largely accepted that at least 422 spaces could be incorporated into a mixed apadaptive reuse of the Century/Syndicate. Also, the urban plaza site offered an alternative site for a garage, but Danforth and the Roberts brothers most strongly backed the half block to become an urban plaza and Mayfair addition.



The Downtown Plan adopted in 2000 did call for an urban plaza, but also called for no parking garages about the OPO, including the Century site. The City's Planning Commission has only a slight majority of citizen members, but also voting members representing the Mayor, Comptroller, Aldermanic President, and Aldermanic Chair of the HUDZ Committee. Plus, the slight majority of citizen Planning Commission members are recommended by the Mayor and approved by the full Board of Aldermen. That such a stacked Planning Commission would vote that Century demolition was consistent with the Downtown Plan shouldn't then be surprising.



The National Trust was also fooled into this insider deal, thinking that the loss of the Century helped save the OPO, a building that our federal government had just renovated years prior. The outcry by National Trust supporters was so large, that the organization has now had to launch a public campaign (i.e.- HGTV commercials) to rebuild its credibility.



Two citizens, Roger and Marcia, represented by Matt Ghio, had tried to stop the demoliton by pointing out lack of public process. The GSA, former federal owner, failed to conduct any full historic evaluation of the buildings as required by law when federal funding is tapped. Showing just how they would get their way, developers went ahead and began demoliton while arguments were being heard in court. Now, the City (LCRA), State (MDFB) and Developers have sued Roger and Marcia for "malicious prosecution" in their attempt to uphold credibility to public procedures.



The tenants to be in the OPO all seem to have a Slay or Holden connection as well. Kim Tucci owns Pasta House and is a major Democratic party contributor. The Business Journal consistently editorialized in the corporate attorney mayor's favor. Pressured by the Mayor, the Public Library is opening a small branch, when its own Central Library just blocks straight west needs a major multi-million dollar renovation. The courts will go wherever the state will place them. Webster had backed off of interest in the OPO when the Downtown Plan called for a higher education tenant, plus Webster sent mixed messages on parking needs.

I will say this for the OPO design: I think it completely misses the mark. It's an imposing building and frankly i really don't see it as a good choice for anything other than governemtn or insitutional uses. The pasta house is not gonna fly in there. The sad thing is to make this wonderful deal happen the city is playing a simple shell game, as webster was alreayd in the lamert building. Why didn't they just step up and see what St. Paul, MN did with the Landmark Center. It really is the same basic problem, but St. Paul has had a wonderful soultion. Screw it, just put a damned museum in the building.

PS. At least the park has been scaled back an now only comprises the western edge of the vacant lot. The orginal plan called for the parking of the whole thing.

Two museum plans have been proposed for the OPO:



- An Art Museum satellite, proposed in the late 1990s by citizens concerned about the loss of the OPO and of park space in Forest Park that Art Museum expansion threatened. The Art Museum chose to ignore the citizens and proceed with yet-to-be realized expansion in Forest park.



- A baseball museum backed by developer Steve Trampe, who withdrew the plan after Steve Stogel and Webster U. started talking with Gov. Holden and city officials. Trampe has business ties to Stogel.

I was a frequent customer of the OPO in the early 1990s. The upper floors had government offices (SBA, Sen Bond). It seemed busy most times. I don't know why it closed up abruptly. Maybe the overhead costs were just too high for the small tenants.

I read on Ecology of Absence recently that there will be no on-street parking for the Old Post Office District...

I'm no expert in this area, but I read that post and walked down there to see what he was talking about.



I don't see how he can come to the conclusion that there will be no street parking. I thought maybe it was the extra-wide sidewalks, but now that I look at the old picture you posted, the current work looks very similar to that.



Can someone with more knowledge put some facts behind this speculation?

MattonArsenal wrote:
I don't see how he can come to the conclusion that there will be no street parking.

Totally agree. The street width is clearly sufficient for on street parking, and it's consistent with neighboring streets.

regarding the project as a whole, i want to see it succeed. i can't say i feel the same way about the people developing it, though.



it's interesting that the business journal is one of the tenants. newspapers in general (and the business journal in particular) are not known for dropping huge wads of cash on their office rents. when the business journal moved to met square in the early '90s, they paid about $10.50 a square foot for the space there, if i remember correctly. this was at a time when met square's asking price was $25 per foot, but the building was desperate for tenants.



so i'm guessing (and it's only a guess) that the business journal is going into the OPO at a fairly cheap rent. not a good sign for the financial viability of the project. i can't help but wonder if there will be losses down the road that will require a taxpayer-funded bailout.

^A second taxpayer bailout.

Only nearly fives times as much a bailout this time around, of which just under half is going to the garage-mahal.



Sure, more development is occurring in the OPO district, but much of it already was underway before the garage was a sure thing. And developers and their lenders certainly wouldn't risk such investment if the garage were essential.



And now even a development announced after garage construction, the Chemical building, gives word that it will be apartments not condos (see Chemical thread), due to lack of "on-site" parking. And here we thought the garage-mahal was supposed to offer district parking.



Of course, all of the announced OPO tenants, already come from other downtown locations. So then, these mostly non-profit and public sector tenants "attracted" to this huge public subsidy must have had horrible parking before.



More and more, it would seem obvious that the only activity the OPO/Century deal was meant to stimulate was the bottomline of businesses whose owners are major Slay supporters.

There will be no on-street parking on the Olive, Ninth and Eighth street sides. Check the renderings and site plans DESCO and DFC have released: no parking here. Locust may get parking, but probably not.



The Olive Street sidewalk is being extended wider than it has ever been. Olive will be down to two lanes for part of the block due to this move and the neck-down at Ninth. There should be parking on Olive across the street for the rest of the block, since Pyramid actually wants to create a quality project with the Arcade rehab.

Ridiculous!