Places like Charlotte have been rapidly expanding their light rail system. The city of Charlotte is around the density of St. Louis County without the city. So I don't think the density argument checks out with LRT. Plus the inner ring suburbs it would touch in North County and South County are definitely dense enough to support LRT. The problem is not density. The problem is lack of regional cooperation, a federal government that thinks austerity is the order of the day, and lack of will from St. Louis leadership. Really that's it. If St. Louis wanted it, it would happen. Just like everything else it chooses to do.addxb2 wrote: ↑7:39 PM - 1 day agoThere is no way of involving the County geographically without tripling the cost and the County's low density does not generate equivalent ridership to justify doing so. The money you unlock from St. Louis County would not outpace math of $ per rider. Best solution is St. Louis County support whatever line the City draws and agrees to redirect their revenue to that regardless of whether it involves the County. As we all know, that isn't happening.
Even in Biden's infrastructure prime, the 2023 Jones administration route for Northside Southside was uncompetitive. Needed 50-100% more ridership than even the best projections and still further cost reductions.
Charlotte can do things in part because they are in the county and have access to the entire county's tax base to do things and the city has annexed most of the county as is.goat314 wrote:Places like Charlotte have been rapidly expanding their light rail system. The city of Charlotte is around the density of St. Louis County without the city. So I don't think the density argument checks out with LRT. Plus the inner ring suburbs it would touch in North County and South County are definitely dense enough to support LRT. The problem is not density. The problem is lack of regional cooperation, a federal government that thinks austerity is the order of the day, and lack of will from St. Louis leadership. Really that's it. If St. Louis wanted it, it would happen. Just like everything else it chooses to do.addxb2 wrote: ↑7:39 PM - 1 day agoThere is no way of involving the County geographically without tripling the cost and the County's low density does not generate equivalent ridership to justify doing so. The money you unlock from St. Louis County would not outpace math of $ per rider. Best solution is St. Louis County support whatever line the City draws and agrees to redirect their revenue to that regardless of whether it involves the County. As we all know, that isn't happening.
Even in Biden's infrastructure prime, the 2023 Jones administration route for Northside Southside was uncompetitive. Needed 50-100% more ridership than even the best projections and still further cost reductions.
The idea adding the county's tax base to a transit tax wouldn't help things is completely delusional and not based in any semblance of reality.
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I completely agree. We have to come to the realization at some point that it's going to be increasingly harder to accomplish big regional projects like major transit expansions, securing another major league franchise, major city changing redevelopment projects, etc. until the city and county are a single entity or atleast function in a more cooperative manner. Regional progress is severely hampered by fragmentation and metros that don't work together will increasingly become less competitive with metros that are more unified.StlAlex wrote: ↑2:33 AM - TodayCharlotte can do things in part because they are in the county and have access to the entire county's tax base to do things and the city has annexed most of the county as is.goat314 wrote:Places like Charlotte have been rapidly expanding their light rail system. The city of Charlotte is around the density of St. Louis County without the city. So I don't think the density argument checks out with LRT. Plus the inner ring suburbs it would touch in North County and South County are definitely dense enough to support LRT. The problem is not density. The problem is lack of regional cooperation, a federal government that thinks austerity is the order of the day, and lack of will from St. Louis leadership. Really that's it. If St. Louis wanted it, it would happen. Just like everything else it chooses to do.addxb2 wrote: ↑7:39 PM - 1 day agoThere is no way of involving the County geographically without tripling the cost and the County's low density does not generate equivalent ridership to justify doing so. The money you unlock from St. Louis County would not outpace math of $ per rider. Best solution is St. Louis County support whatever line the City draws and agrees to redirect their revenue to that regardless of whether it involves the County. As we all know, that isn't happening.
Even in Biden's infrastructure prime, the 2023 Jones administration route for Northside Southside was uncompetitive. Needed 50-100% more ridership than even the best projections and still further cost reductions.
The idea adding the county's tax base to a transit tax wouldn't help things is completely delusional and not based in any semblance of reality.
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