Has there been demained in St. Clair and Madison County for future light rail expansions? It would be crazy if Illinois ended up having more light rail than the Missouri side, it would just confirm my facts that Missouri holds St. Louis back.
The point made earlier that Illinois doesn't want another river crossing for metrolink makes sense to me. I believe it with has a lot to do with political desire & hope that Mid-America will compete against Lambert for air travelers one day. Not to mention that any political support will require Illinois expansion needs to serve Illinois first. So why wouldn't Illinois want to make it more convenient for someone in Edwardsville to get to the Scott AFB/Mid America Airport without having to cross the river on one bridge and then make a transfer to cross back the river again on a different bridge. The system still benefits overall, capital funds can be better spent and Illinois expansion gets political backing. Plus (getting off topic some more), Eads bridge still gives you the ability to have two trains leave Edwardsville, one for Downtown and one for Scott AFB, just as you have west bound Lambert and Shrewsbury trains leaving downtown
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Interesting. I'm not really up on everything, so it's good to hear other's views. The bit about an Edwardsville-Mid America train was interesting.
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There are maps and other things related to MetroLink expansion in Madison County here:
http://www.urbanstl.com/viewforum.php?f ... &start=100
http://www.urbanstl.com/viewforum.php?f ... &start=100
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^Or a webpage specifically on Madison County MetroLink expansion options studied by E-W Gateway, Metro and MCT here.
The thought on my mind (CNN talking about money/economy at the moment). Why don't they fast track design/construction of this bridge? Conceptual design is agreed upon, Environmental Impact Study is completed as I understand it, and final design is not abnormal by any stretch of the imagination that the shop work can be done pretty quick. You think construction solicitations would look good for politicians right about now.
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Hmmm. Where have I seen a similar design for a "landmark" bridge?
"An “iconic” cable-stayed bridge expandable to eight lanes and capable of accommodating a future bicycle/pedestrian facility will also be built just east (downstream) of the existing Paseo Bridge."
http://www.kcicon.org/proj_images.html
"An “iconic” cable-stayed bridge expandable to eight lanes and capable of accommodating a future bicycle/pedestrian facility will also be built just east (downstream) of the existing Paseo Bridge."
http://www.kcicon.org/proj_images.html
^ What? Are you blind?! Anybody can see that the "landmark" bridges for St. Louis and Kansas City are two completely unique designs that bear no resemblance to each other.
Kansas City
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St. Louis
Kansas City
St. Louis
^ Why don't you guys understand that Missouri is a leader in innovation and architectural integrity, but honestly why the hell are these bridges the same color too? I would like to see the bridge have a signature color! Like the cool yellow one in Pittsburgh or that sorta famous orange one in San Fran, maybe even a bridge that lights up like the one in Jacksonville. I hope they don't plan to make a plain white bridge. How about they have a vote in the St. Louis area about what the bridge color should be, like they had the vote for the ugly new license plates.
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If you guys want to complain about the KC bridge, might I recommend you consider comparing total number of lanes.
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Gone Corporate wrote:If you guys want to complain about the KC bridge, might I recommend you consider comparing total number of lanes.
Kinda why I quoted this part:
...bridge expandable to eight lanes and capable of accommodating a future bicycle/pedestrian facility...
Didn't directly quote the part about it being built with 6 lanes. Figured I'd leave that twist for the linked article.
goat314 wrote:How about they have a vote in the St. Louis area about what the bridge color should be, like they had the vote for the ugly new license plates.
Cardinal Red?
MoDOT picks designer for new bridge
The Missouri Department of Transportation announced today that it has selected a firm to come up with the design of the new Mississippi River Bridge near downtown St. Louis.
The department selected HNTB Corporation to design the bridge that will link Illinois to Missouri and to Interstate 70.
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Thank god there will be a new design. And I hope that this new firm incorporates some good lighting schemes to the bridge...everytime I drive across the Ohio from Cinci to KY at night I become rather depresssed at the lack of excitement from our bridges.
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What is the current condition of Poplar St. Bridge (I-55/70 bridge)?
When is the next scheduled maintenance for it?
Congratulations on the new bridge and end of the political wrangling surrounding it.
When is the next scheduled maintenance for it?
Congratulations on the new bridge and end of the political wrangling surrounding it.
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I am actually disappointed this thing is going to be redesigned.
I was not a huge fan of the current design, but at least it was something nice to look at. I wouldn't be surprised now if we get something like the PSB. I think the whole "signature" part of this bridge is long gone. I think the current modus operandi is build it on the cheap, so changing the design sort of concerns me.
I was not a huge fan of the current design, but at least it was something nice to look at. I wouldn't be surprised now if we get something like the PSB. I think the whole "signature" part of this bridge is long gone. I think the current modus operandi is build it on the cheap, so changing the design sort of concerns me.
I'm pretty sure it is going to be a cable stayed bridge. The design that you are referring to was merely a placeholder, with no engineering done.
I'm still against the bridge. The only way I would support another bridge is to have the depressed section removed. There's no longer any reason to have the highway dividing our City. Screw the lid, remove I70.
If we're going to finance yet another autocentric project then we should have something which would benefit our urban built environment. Rather than put a band aid on this horrible wound to our City, we should have this cancer removed. Get rid of I70.
If this Administration would use their political capital for actually good things, instead of maladroit ideas like BPV, then perhaps our City would see more progress.
If we're going to finance yet another autocentric project then we should have something which would benefit our urban built environment. Rather than put a band aid on this horrible wound to our City, we should have this cancer removed. Get rid of I70.
If this Administration would use their political capital for actually good things, instead of maladroit ideas like BPV, then perhaps our City would see more progress.
I'm still against the bridge. The only way I would support another bridge is to have the depressed section removed. There's no longer any reason to have the highway dividing our City. Screw the lid, remove I70.
I totally agree with what you're saying. Focusing on mass-transit and the removal of 170 downtown would have a much greater impact on the longterm strength of the city.
That being said, the fact that Missouri is only paying $88 million for a new bridge that will strengthen downtown's position as the center of the metro area (and therefore most logical employment center) seems like sweet-heart deal. It's amazing how eager Illinois is to invest in transit infrastructure (see Metrolink) in the St. Louis area compared to Missouri.
Why I'm in favor of the bridge:
people are going to sprawl in this region, thanks to idiots in rural MO who want to bleed STL dry. so, might as well let them sprawl right into IL, recentering downtown in the region.
a new bridge that will strengthen downtown's position as the center of the metro area
people are going to sprawl in this region, thanks to idiots in rural MO who want to bleed STL dry. so, might as well let them sprawl right into IL, recentering downtown in the region.
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Meetings set for new Mississippi River bridge
By Elisa Crouch
ST. LOUIS POST-DISPATCH
05/01/2008
Two public meetings will be held this month to discuss progress on building a new Mississippi River bridge.
Read More Here
By Elisa Crouch
ST. LOUIS POST-DISPATCH
05/01/2008
Two public meetings will be held this month to discuss progress on building a new Mississippi River bridge.
Read More Here
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Regulars and lurkers know that I've already compared the hypocrisy of MODOT's 10-lane Page Avenue extension to this 4-lane Downtown bridge. If not for that westward sprawl enducement, I'd buy the argument of not wanting eastern sprawl. In other words, Downtown know needs another bridge just to compete and re-center. An unlike the Missouri counterparts, Illinois has already invested in transit alternatives.
Now Hypocrisy Pete (Rahn) is even pushing for a separate I-70 just for trucks. Trucks are what now back up the Poplar outside of rush hour. Unless the new I-70 bridge downtown is just for trucks (yeah right), how can MODOT defend a 4-lane bridge? Besides, if truck lanes are defended as necessary for Missouri serving as a key national freight corridor, what happens when you want that freight to actually reach the more densely part of the nation lying across the Mississippi River from your state?
Most transportation planners and engineers know that intersection or interchange (depending on roadway type) improvements can usually move more traffic than widening. That's because while widening can move traffic faster along the segments, it doesn't matter if you're creating longer signal phases at intersections, or in the case of limited-access facilities, bottlenecks of high-volume merges and lane-shifts at interchanges.
Now Hypocrisy Pete (Rahn) is even pushing for a separate I-70 just for trucks. Trucks are what now back up the Poplar outside of rush hour. Unless the new I-70 bridge downtown is just for trucks (yeah right), how can MODOT defend a 4-lane bridge? Besides, if truck lanes are defended as necessary for Missouri serving as a key national freight corridor, what happens when you want that freight to actually reach the more densely part of the nation lying across the Mississippi River from your state?
Most transportation planners and engineers know that intersection or interchange (depending on roadway type) improvements can usually move more traffic than widening. That's because while widening can move traffic faster along the segments, it doesn't matter if you're creating longer signal phases at intersections, or in the case of limited-access facilities, bottlenecks of high-volume merges and lane-shifts at interchanges.
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Latest Update.
http://newriverbridge.org/
Initial Phase Satellite photo
http://newriverbridge.org/PDF/ProposedInitialPhase.pdf
Ultimate Plan Satellite photo
http://newriverbridge.org/PDF/UltimateConcept.pdf
http://newriverbridge.org/
Initial Phase Satellite photo
http://newriverbridge.org/PDF/ProposedInitialPhase.pdf
Ultimate Plan Satellite photo
http://newriverbridge.org/PDF/UltimateConcept.pdf