urbanSTL

I agree. Good idea.

I found this fascinating website on the history of the Jefferson National Memorial.



Old plans, photos, and illustrations are sprinkled throughout. Sorry if it is posted somewhere else.



get a cup of coffee...it's a long read!



http://www.nps.gov/history/history/onli ... f/adhi.htm

Well whaddya know, the NPS gets it (or at least someone there does):

The early local opposition to the memorial ceased and was forgotten. Questions remained, however, as to the razing of so many historically significant buildings and the heritage lost in the destruction of the Manuel Lisa warehouse. Portions of St. Louis' heritage were lost because of the emphasis on the site's national rather than local significance.

So what are they doing about it now!?!?!

really makes me wish the Arch never happened.

Should this thread be combined with the "Do more with the archgrounds?" thread? There's some good posting going on there about the new proposals that appeared in the post this week.

bpe235 wrote:really makes me wish the Arch never happened.

I have always thought that the arch would be REALLY cool (and thats in relation to how cool it already is) if the only buildings that were torn down were the ones that were located directly where the two feet are. If everything else was left alone, we would have an awesome 630 foot memorial sprouting out of an awesome historic neighborhood. How cool would that have been?

Well, I think that The Arch is awesome and love. However, the whole thing around is kinda...well blah. I like wheelscomp msg about it being built sprouting out of the historic neighborhood. On the other side I like the park area there but there is nothing to it. Its boring and there is nothing to it. Really they need to do something with the riverfront. We can't turn back time so we can only improve on things that we have. I really hope soon they get a plan together to better the archgrounds. STL is really missing out on something awesome with just having that all go to waste. As a kid my family went down to the riverfront when there was things to do. At lunch at McDonalds and the others. A couple family get togethers we were on the Robert E. Lee. So I would love to see a revamped riverfront the lid over I-70.

I think the NPS idea it operates under is that you're suppose to stroll through while contemplating history, look into the reflecting pools, and reflect on the ideals of westward expansion. In other words, when you go there, put on your cemetery hat and behave accordingly. It's a memorial. Bring tissue.

^ Yes, staring at the stuffed beaver in the museum has led me to reflect on many things (the animatronic Native Americans have led me to contemplate history - the history of animatronics).

I haven't been inside the Arch since high school. So the only thing I reflect on is how little there is to do around the Arch.

I think any Masterplan by trying to connect the Arch Grounds with the River is a miss guided effort at this time that hasn't served the interests of St. Louis. The Arch was meant to be the gateway to the west. What is west, Downtown and the city. To the East, a fast, muddy and straight river. The emphasis should be what are the possibilties between the city and Arch grounds when I-70 is relocated via a new Mississippi Bridge to the North. By presenting these ideas will you get a willingness to make the big change downtown that everybody wants.

^ given your name I would have thought you would be a little more river oriented - but you make a great point. So what if people go down to the river, then what? Anyone's who's been to the river in Cincinnati, Louisville, Pittsburgh and many other places is going to be disappointed in the river here anyway. Let's focus on connecting the Arch to downtown and offering visitors and residents alike the type of amenities that will add to our quality of life.

any updates on a riverfront plan?

stl1991 wrote:i would think there would be a lot more interest in riverfront lofts/condos and for a river walk but maybe thats just me

Ya know I always wondered why there isnt luxury condos lined on the riverfront too. It also surprises visitors that there isn't more condos looking at the arch and riverfront. Hopefully if we ever develop the riverfront these things will pop up.

I just found out about the Gateway Geyser like a year ago. I've never actually seen it in operation (even in pictures). I don't even know if it still runs regularly.



But it would be nice to clean up East St. Louis a bit, but obviously Missouri's not going to do it (considering it's Illinois), but what incentive does Illinois have to clean up East St. Louis? It has some potential, but would they be willing to give grants to clean up the city, when they could spend the money on some other project in Chicago (like renovating Wrigley)? And not having the historic tax credits might hurt anyone's efforts to revive it as well. There's less incentive usually to renovate it in that case.



I hear complaints that Illinois ignores its southern half, and I've even heard calls to split Illinois in two. Whether or not Illinois does ignore its southern half I don't know, but I would think they'd rather pump money into just about anywhere else than East St. Louis. It used to have some plants when the industrial age was big, and it was a real town, but population has declined from 80k in 1950 to 30k today. Most of those who are left are very poor and live in rundown buildings. From my understanding the towns outside of it like Edwardsville and Collinsville are pretty good towns. What can be done for East St. Louis?

STLCardsBlues1989 wrote: What can be done for East St. Louis?

Alas, Bucky is gone now.

^^come on we talk about everything here.



http://www.urbanstl.com/viewtopic.php?t ... way+geyser



I think there's a link to the company that owns it.

bonwich wrote:

STLCardsBlues1989 wrote: What can be done for East St. Louis?

Alas, Bucky is gone now.

Yeah, but Richard Rogers is still around. Maybe he can work the same magic here that his Millennium Dome brought to London...er, nevermind

Ay guys check this out, sounds like some progress! Lets pray for the best.



Thursday, March 6, 2008 - 9:00 AM CST

Metro St. Louis mayors move for Arch grounds development

St. Louis Business Journal



The Metro Mayors of St. Louis passed a resolution in support of the development of the St. Louis riverfront, calling for federal legislators to pursue an agreement with the National Park Service to release the passive-use requirement on those acres that do not immediately surround the Gateway Arch.



The resolution, adopted Jan. 31 and made public Wednesday, said the Arch and the riverfront can only be enhanced if regulations prohibiting development on some portions of the 91-acre site are lifted. The Gateway Arch and surrounding Jefferson National Expansion Memorial are part of the National Park System.



The Metro Mayors of St. Louis, an organization that discusses regional issues, is comprised of more than 30 mayors from the St. Louis area. The organization said it wants to further the Danforth Foundation's efforts to expand the downtown attraction to contribute to the vitality and sustainability of the St. Louis region.



The Danforth Foundation has funded a study of ways to revitalize the Mississippi riverfront and better-connect it to downtown St. Louis, including a "lid" over the Interstate 70 depressed section downtown.



The Metro Mayors of St. Louis includes more than 30 mayors from municipalities with a population of 10,000 or more in St. Louis, Jefferson, St. Charles and Franklin counties in Missouri, St. Clair and Madison counties in Illinois. The City of St. Louis is also included in the organization.

goat314 wrote:The Metro Mayors of St. Louis, an organization that discusses regional issues, is comprised of more than 30 mayors from the St. Louis area. The organization said it wants to further the Danforth Foundation's efforts to expand the downtown attraction to contribute to the vitality and sustainability of the St. Louis region.



The Danforth Foundation has funded a study of ways to revitalize the Mississippi riverfront and better-connect it to downtown St. Louis, including a "lid" over the Interstate 70 depressed section downtown.

Yes, "progress." A 30-year-old solution to a problem that shouldn't exist anymore once the new bridge is built. And not a peep out of the "leadership" about the potential of simply eliminating the depressed section. Go team!

bonwich wrote:

goat314 wrote:The Metro Mayors of St. Louis, an organization that discusses regional issues, is comprised of more than 30 mayors from the St. Louis area. The organization said it wants to further the Danforth Foundation's efforts to expand the downtown attraction to contribute to the vitality and sustainability of the St. Louis region.



The Danforth Foundation has funded a study of ways to revitalize the Mississippi riverfront and better-connect it to downtown St. Louis, including a "lid" over the Interstate 70 depressed section downtown.

Yes, "progress." A 30-year-old solution to a problem that shouldn't exist anymore once the new bridge is built. And not a peep out of the "leadership" about the potential of simply eliminating the depressed section. Go team!

Well whatever they do it has to be better than what we got now. The key is connecting downtown with that Arch and riverfront.....which would definitely spark more activity in that area. I don't care if they eliminate the depression or build a "lid" which could be cool if they implement a solid and comprehensive design. I'm just glad they region can agree that our riverfront sucks right now and they actually getting together to solve a problem....instead of the normal politics of this region .