This thread is for information on MidAmerica St. Louis - St. Louis' secondary commerical airport located in the Metro East just minutes from Downtown St. Louis.
The airport has a new website:
http://www.flymidamerica.com/
The airport has a new website:
http://www.flymidamerica.com/
I thought G4 (IATA Allegiant) is the only carrier that flies out of BVL (IATA Mid America). There new website looks pretty cool; I'm not sure how practical this master plan is. They don't have very many cargo operations and with Lambert begging for more service I hope they don't build up that airport. While I have never been there, and have not intention of going-simply having two-three weekly flights on a LCC (low cost carrier) for a few local leisure travelers doesn't justify expansion. Who knows, for people who live on the east side and don't travel very much, it may be an appealing alternative. The folks in St. Clair county wanted to take on Lambert in the mid-late 1990s, however they failed to attract any airlines.
MetroLink has committed to expanding to the terminal (Phase III of St. Clar County), however they can't secure any federal funding. I seriously wonder why they won't fund it.
I think this airport should continue to serve the roll it currently does. I tend to believe that the second runway saved Scott AFB from BRAC (Base Realignment and Closing) in early 2005.
In conclusion, I would much rather see expansion at STL than at BLV.
MetroLink has committed to expanding to the terminal (Phase III of St. Clar County), however they can't secure any federal funding. I seriously wonder why they won't fund it.
I think this airport should continue to serve the roll it currently does. I tend to believe that the second runway saved Scott AFB from BRAC (Base Realignment and Closing) in early 2005.
In conclusion, I would much rather see expansion at STL than at BLV.
Lots and LOTS of potential...unfortunately too many people (especially the RIGHT people) in Missouri JUST don't GET IT.
Yes, I know that SOMEbody's gonna' come behind me and say that I'M the one who doesn't get it, but I just feel like priming the pump...or stoking the fire as the case may be 
Yes, I know that SOMEbody's gonna' come behind me and say that I'M the one who doesn't get it, but I just feel like priming the pump...or stoking the fire as the case may be People who get it realize that this was and is a boondoggle. With Lambert continuing its existence for the foreseeable future, all passenger airlines should focus on Lambert, not this facility. Let it develop as a major transportation and cargo facility. Given the development of warehousing in the metroeast, this seems like a good plan and one that would serve and vital role in enhancing St. Louis' position in the distribution industry. MidAmerica can and should play a roll, just not one that involves passenger traffic.
- 362
JMedwick wrote:People who get it realize that this was and is a boondoggle. With Lambert continuing its existence for the foreseeable future, all passenger airlines should focus on Lambert, not this facility. Let it develop as a major transportation and cargo facility. Given the development of warehousing in the metroeast, this seems like a good plan and one that would serve and vital role in enhancing St. Louis' position in the distribution industry. MidAmerica can and should play a roll, just not one that involves passenger traffic.
Why is this a boondoggle? It served its purpose perfectly. Scott survived the Clinton Administration's base closures and having the logistics command now at Scott should help it survive another round of base closures if a Democrat is elected in '08. MidAmerica is doing just fine. If it becomes a major transportation hub for warehousing or whatever, that is a bonus. Scott is the Metro East's largest employer and one of the largest employers in the Metro area and it is in solid shape to remain so.
I would argue Lambert is the boondoggle. Why we continue pouring money into a second-class facility is beyond me. Lambert could not keep both of its major tenets, TWA and McDonnell Douglas and now we are relegated to being a Southwest stopover with many of our gates sitting empty. Does anyone really think that in Lambert's present condition a major airline would even think about basing any operations here? Not a chance. Meanwhile, sister cities like Cincinnati are becoming major secondary hubs.
I am not saying MidAmerica is the alternative, but if anything is a boondoggle, it is Lambert. Saint Louis will never have a world-class airport at Lambert - ever.
JMedwick wrote:People who get it realize that this was and is a boondoggle. With Lambert continuing its existence for the foreseeable future, all passenger airlines should focus on Lambert, not this facility. Let it develop as a major transportation and cargo facility. Given the development of warehousing in the metroeast, this seems like a good plan and one that would serve and vital role in enhancing St. Louis' position in the distribution industry. MidAmerica can and should play a roll, just not one that involves passenger traffic.
Why is this a boondoggle? It served its purpose perfectly. Scott survived the Clinton Administration's base closures and having the logistics command now at Scott should help it survive another round of base closures if a Democrat is elected in '08. MidAmerica is doing just fine. If it becomes a major transportation hub for warehousing or whatever, that is a bonus. Scott is the Metro East's largest employer and one of the largest employers in the Metro area and it is in solid shape to remain so.
I would argue Lambert is the boondoggle. Why we continue pouring money into a second-class facility is beyond me. Lambert could not keep both of its major tenets, TWA and McDonnell Douglas and now we are relegated to being a Southwest stopover with many of our gates sitting empty. Does anyone really think that in Lambert's present condition a major airline would even think about basing any operations here? Not a chance. Meanwhile, sister cities like Cincinnati are becoming major secondary hubs.
I am not saying MidAmerica is the alternative, but if anything is a boondoggle, it is Lambert. Saint Louis will never have a world-class airport at Lambert - ever.
- 8,911
Little Egyptian wrote:
I would argue Lambert is the boondoggle. Why we continue pouring money into a second-class facility is beyond me. Lambert could not keep both of its major tenets, TWA and McDonnell Douglas and now we are relegated to being a Southwest stopover with many of our gates sitting empty. Does anyone really think that in Lambert's present condition a major airline would even think about basing any operations here? Not a chance. Meanwhile, sister cities like Cincinnati are becoming major secondary hubs.
Uhhhh hello.... Boeing??? American? Southwest stopover? I don't get opinions like this...
Little Egyptian wrote:I Lambert could not keep both of its major tenets, TWA and McDonnell Douglas...
Um, TWA went bankrupt and MD was bought out by Boeing. I don't see how "Lambert" "lost" those two.
- 923
I look at MidAmerican and Lambert the same way I look at Melbourne's Tullamarine and Avalon airports (and probably the same as most cities with 2 airports) - Let Lambert be the main airport for the major US and international (HA! if they ever come back...) carriers, and shunt all other small/discount domestic, cargo, and private aircraft to MidAmerican. There's no logical reason that ATA, AirTrain, Frontier, Midwest Express, USA3000 etc - should be flying out of Lambert. Yes, there are plenty of gates available, but why would these discount carriers want to pay the insane landing fees? Aside from that - why compete on the ground against the larger, more entrenched carriers like AA, Delta, Southwest, etc - when they can move across the river, get the whole damn airport to thmeselves, command major concourse presence, and build market share among the metro east and eastern missouri populous?
Moving the private jets to MidAmerican (i'm not sure how much traffic there is at Downtown airport or lambert, but I assume it's fairly significant) would bring a significant high end commerical presence to the metro east and may work to shift the balance of high-end commerce towards the center of the metro area (i.e. downtown/near metro east)
Cargo obviously makes sense, given the high level of logisitics operations in and coming to the southern Illinois area.
Moving the private jets to MidAmerican (i'm not sure how much traffic there is at Downtown airport or lambert, but I assume it's fairly significant) would bring a significant high end commerical presence to the metro east and may work to shift the balance of high-end commerce towards the center of the metro area (i.e. downtown/near metro east)
Cargo obviously makes sense, given the high level of logisitics operations in and coming to the southern Illinois area.
Little Egyptian wrote:JMedwick wrote:People who get it realize that this was and is a boondoggle. With Lambert continuing its existence for the foreseeable future, all passenger airlines should focus on Lambert, not this facility. Let it develop as a major transportation and cargo facility. Given the development of warehousing in the metroeast, this seems like a good plan and one that would serve and vital role in enhancing St. Louis' position in the distribution industry. MidAmerica can and should play a roll, just not one that involves passenger traffic.
Why is this a boondoggle? It served its purpose perfectly. Scott survived the Clinton Administration's base closures and having the logistics command now at Scott should help it survive another round of base closures if a Democrat is elected in '08. MidAmerica is doing just fine. If it becomes a major transportation hub for warehousing or whatever, that is a bonus. Scott is the Metro East's largest employer and one of the largest employers in the Metro area and it is in solid shape to remain so.
I would argue Lambert is the boondoggle. Why we continue pouring money into a second-class facility is beyond me. Lambert could not keep both of its major tenets, TWA and McDonnell Douglas and now we are relegated to being a Southwest stopover with many of our gates sitting empty. Does anyone really think that in Lambert's present condition a major airline would even think about basing any operations here? Not a chance. Meanwhile, sister cities like Cincinnati are becoming major secondary hubs.
I am not saying MidAmerica is the alternative, but if anything is a boondoggle, it is Lambert. Saint Louis will never have a world-class airport at Lambert - ever.
While one may dispute some of the points made, I personally have no argument with the last point.
migueltejada wrote:I look at MidAmerican and Lambert the same way I look at Melbourne's Tullamarine and Avalon airports (and probably the same as most cities with 2 airports) - Let Lambert be the main airport for the major US and international (HA! if they ever come back...) carriers, and shunt all other small/discount domestic, cargo, and private aircraft to MidAmerican. There's no logical reason that ATA, AirTrain, Frontier, Midwest Express, USA3000 etc - should be flying out of Lambert. Yes, there are plenty of gates available, but why would these discount carriers want to pay the insane landing fees? Aside from that - why compete on the ground against the larger, more entrenched carriers like AA, Delta, Southwest, etc - when they can move across the river, get the whole damn airport to thmeselves, command major concourse presence, and build market share among the metro east and eastern missouri populous?
Moving the private jets to MidAmerican (i'm not sure how much traffic there is at Downtown airport or lambert, but I assume it's fairly significant) would bring a significant high end commerical presence to the metro east and may work to shift the balance of high-end commerce towards the center of the metro area (i.e. downtown/near metro east)
Cargo obviously makes sense, given the high level of logisitics operations in and coming to the southern Illinois area.
Do you know anything about the airline industry? First off, AA, DL, and other major carriers have agreements at Lambert and aren't necessarily paying 'insane' landing fees. Not only is this true at most all airports, more specifically Lambert has an incentive program that attracts new airlines or new routes from existing carriers. For example, AirTran got its first years worth of gate rental, landing fees, and other expenses waived from Lambert. In November they're starting a new route to SRQ and are not only getting incentives on our end, they're also getting them from Sarasota.
Airlines will not move to Mid America simply because it is available or because they would be the dominant carrier. Mid America is not as easily accessible for the majority of the metropolitan area; and is therefore not convenient.
BTW-ATA doesn't serve STL!!!!!
Dulles isn't exactly accessible to Washington D.C. People go there because they have to. International flights work better at more distant airports, from my perspective, because the flights are already very long, and people take those types of trips less often. Dulles was very much the international airport, while National airport was more-or-less domestic, from my observation, while I lived there.
Outside of a limited number of exceptions, flights from DCA are also limited in how far they can go...maybe 1250 miles, something like that, if I remember correctly. Thus people have to go to IAD for longer domestic flights as well. When Dulles was built, some thinking was that DCA would eventually close, but the Congressmen like its convenience and it has remained open.
Both Downtown and Lambert carry a fair amount of private traffic, as does Spirit.
Both Downtown and Lambert carry a fair amount of private traffic, as does Spirit.
- 1,610
Until the Metro finally reaches Dulles, Reagan also has the advantage of being connected to the rapid transit system.
- 11K
b777stl wrote:BTW-ATA doesn't serve STL!!!!!
I don't really know how these things work, but I've been searching for a flight from St. Louis to Honolulu (STL - HNL for everyone here) and ATA keeps coming up as an option. Would this be a charter flight? A flight run by another airline in some kind of partnership?
Would imagine that STL-HNL would be a combination of Southwest and ATA...
migueltejada wrote:
Moving the private jets to MidAmerican (i'm not sure how much traffic there is at Downtown airport or lambert, but I assume it's fairly significant) would bring a significant high end commerical presence to the metro east and may work to shift the balance of high-end commerce towards the center of the metro area (i.e. downtown/near metro east)
This would make absolutely no sense at all. Business jets land as close to their final destination as possible. St. Louis actually has a perfect set up with CPS serving people who need access to downtown and SUS serving business in West County, along with the occasional aircraft that chooses STL. The drive from BLV to West County could easily be an hour. The type of person who travels via private jet is not willing to travel an addition hour in a car to reach their destination.
Grover wrote:b777stl wrote:BTW-ATA doesn't serve STL!!!!!
I don't really know how these things work, but I've been searching for a flight from St. Louis to Honolulu (STL - HNL for everyone here) and ATA keeps coming up as an option. Would this be a charter flight? A flight run by another airline in some kind of partnership?
You're getting a nonstop Southwest to Phoenix (possibly LAX?) then picking up ATA to Honolulu. It's just a codeshare agreement, just like you can get US Airways flights on United, Delta via Continenal, etc. But no, it is not a charter flight. It's normal scheduled service.
Southwest actually owns part of ATA. ATA started out and still is a vacation charter airline based out of Indianapolis (pardon my spelling) until it attempted to get into the domestic market with somewhat of a hub in Chicago Midway. I use to take their flights from MDW to LAG? (Laguardia) or MDW to PHL all the time for business. Great flights for me, new planes, leather seats and few passengers. Unfortunately that doesn't make money for them. Southwest bought out part of ATA, I believe for the additional routes and gates. However, they kept ATA brand for some of the tourist destinations.
Well, it appears MidAmerica is going to get some service that Lambert doesn't have (and would like to have). An Irish tour operator has agreed to operate some 20 flights during 10 weeks this summer and is getting about $100k in incentives. The flights will be operates on 757s in a 198 passenger configuration and operate to Shannon, Ireland. I think this is both great for Mid-America and St. Louis as a whole.
The article mentions:
Hopefully this is only the beginning of more good things to come. I wonder how they will have ground transportation in place for the 200 some people getting off. Maybe they'll have buses shuttling people to the Shiloh-Scott station or have buses taking people to hotels. Is there a rental car counter at Mid America??
Here's the article in the Belleville News-Democrat:
http://www.bnd.com/homepage/story/209155.html
The article mentions:
"They've done 'the Boston,' they've done 'the New York.' They want to come into the hinterlands. They're interested in the culture that mid-America can offer," Nay said. "You're right there on the Mississippi. There's the music. There's traveling in the wine country there. That's what they're looking for."
Hopefully this is only the beginning of more good things to come. I wonder how they will have ground transportation in place for the 200 some people getting off. Maybe they'll have buses shuttling people to the Shiloh-Scott station or have buses taking people to hotels. Is there a rental car counter at Mid America??
Here's the article in the Belleville News-Democrat:
http://www.bnd.com/homepage/story/209155.html
- 2,005
I bet the incentives had a lot to do with them choosing Belleville International. We all know those Irish like to drink, so there's no better summer destination than St. Louis. I can see the headline now 'Drunk Irish Tourist Drowns in Beechwood Aging Vat'. 
Perhaps the Irish tourists will come away interested in condo purchases...
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/12/21/reale ... f=nyregion
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/12/21/reale ... f=nyregion
- 362
Woah. This is unexpected. So is it MidAmerica International Airport now? (I guess they will have to check Passports and stuff, so I guess it does?). So now we have 2 International Airports and the only one with flights to Europe is MidAmerica? That is certainly a change.
Frankly, this is a cool idea the Irish have come up with. They will take care of you from the time you enter the Airport to the time you leave the Airport a week later. And a direct flight is even better. I bet they will get a lot of business on this. There are a lot of older, retired folks that would love to travel to Europe, but are probably fearful of all the hassles of International travel. With this, you get to go with a group of Midwesterners and much of the details of International Travel seem easier. I am positive Travel Companies will take advantage of this to package all-inclusive trips where transportation, accommodations and food are taken care of.
Huh. What a nice surprise on a Friday. I really think this will work.
Frankly, this is a cool idea the Irish have come up with. They will take care of you from the time you enter the Airport to the time you leave the Airport a week later. And a direct flight is even better. I bet they will get a lot of business on this. There are a lot of older, retired folks that would love to travel to Europe, but are probably fearful of all the hassles of International travel. With this, you get to go with a group of Midwesterners and much of the details of International Travel seem easier. I am positive Travel Companies will take advantage of this to package all-inclusive trips where transportation, accommodations and food are taken care of.
Huh. What a nice surprise on a Friday. I really think this will work.