My search for housing in STL continues... Got a quick question for you St Louis experts:



There are several loft resells available at 1709 and 1703 Washington (King Bee). I was wondering if anyone knows of a website or document that details floorplans/layouts or more info about the building.



Animal

I also know there is some available raw space in that building. You may want to try contacting Benjamin Muchoki of "M Group Development" at 800-379-3801 to see if they have any additional information on that building for you.

King Bee does not really have floorplans. Each space is different and each floor has been split up differently. Some of it is still just raw space like urbanstlouis mentioned and some of the lofts are older that would need to be updated but for that reason can be a really good buy.

Animal wrote:My search for housing in STL continues... Got a quick question for you St Louis experts:



There are several loft resells available at 1709 and 1703 Washington (King Bee). I was wondering if anyone knows of a website or document that details floorplans/layouts or more info about the building.



Animal

A friend of mine has lived there for almost 2 years now. It is a very cheap building to live in. It is tax abated, his utilities are nothing and hardly ever has to turn on his AC or heat. It is a true NY style building where all spaces are different and you can pretty much do anything you want to them. That being said, my friend says he would not buy in there again. He says Sam Glasser does practitally nothing as far as updates to the building and that Sam keeps promising stuff that never happens. It appears that some of the work is shoddy in drywall has like no soundproofing and windows are original single pane glass, hence being drafty and noisy. The original wood floors are kind of beat up and some have small holes in them. In my friends loft, you can hear everything that is happening in the loft next to him. And I believe that there are some lofts that are working businesses right next to others that are residential. Not good in my book.



My friend paid around $116 a square foot but has no bedroom or walls for one, has one bathroom that is decent but nothing special and a utility area for laundry and storage. Everything else is just open, which I actually like. Makes the space seem really big at it is around 1200 SF. Kitchen is formica with gas stove and a dishwasher and does have nice cabinets above, but no island, no additional storage or anything like that. And no covered or garage parking, all parking is in a gated secure outdoor surface lot. Oh yea, one thing that Sam has been promising is storage lockers for residents down in the basement. That still has not happened.



I'd be very interested to see what resales are getting there.

It sounds like your friend bought his space in the King Bee and is not just leasing, correct? If so, the old floors and out dated kitchen is why he only paid $116/sq ft. Has he looked into having the floors replaced or refinished and the kitchen updated?



Also, they have just formed a condo association in the building so the building management will no longer be just up to Sam. So maybe those building improvements will finally happen.

Also, aren't there ways to improve soundproofing in walls between units? Sounds like your friend got a great deal, especially since the utilities are low, etc. Some of his problems can be dealt with pretty easily, and like buckethead said, the condo association will helpful. From what you say, this place sounds like a good starter condo.

buckethead wrote:It sounds like your friend bought his space in the King Bee and is not just leasing, correct? If so, the old floors and out dated kitchen is why he only paid $116/sq ft. Has he looked into having the floors replaced or refinished and the kitchen updated?



Also, they have just formed a condo association in the building so the building management will no longer be just up to Sam. So maybe those building improvements will finally happen.

He does own and has looked into updating. I think he is contemplating putting about $20,000 - $30,000 into it. But that doesn't help the sound problem and whatever possible upgrades that the building needs which it may be hiding. Now that there is an association they will be liable for any major improvements. I know of a development in the West End that had a special assessment of around $11,000 for each unit to replace windows. My point is, the building is a good buy and you can really make the space your own. But to me, the cost of making that space your own could probably get you into a new completely rehabbed building with things like new elevators, new windows, new roof, garage parking, rooftop deck, etc., etc.

Thanks everybody!! That's exactly the kind of info/feedback I was looking for! This forum is making my move to St Louis much easier!!



My search continues....



Animal

I agree with you OU812. My friends that live there are really happy with the place and are excited about having a condo association now. But they also upgraded their lofts which is nice - they got exactly what they wanted but I'm sure it was a lot of work and took time. Like you said, that's not for everybody.

I would like to know how many units are still available at King Bee, and also if someone knows how many units does the building have?

From the Ventana thread, Debaliviere wrote: I noticed the other day that the ground floor level of the King Bee Building is all boarded up. What's up with that?



Upon returning to Moon tonight I could hear jackhammering going on over there so ventured for a closer look. It appears that some type of office space is going in there as the ground floor is now white boxed in what looks to be smaller office type spaces. I've got a friend who lives there and will see if I can get more details. On a side note, the building facade lights on the Ventana look awesome. Too bad you will be looking into a parking garage on the west side and not some new retail space.

Asynchrony Solutions (one of downtown's fastest growing businesses - http://www.asolutions.com), which is currently on the second floor, is expanding to the ground floor. New, huge windows will be installed all around the ground floor which will really open up the building. Many other improvements to the building facade will also happen as well as an underground parking garage for the residents.

buckethead wrote:Asynchrony Solutions (one of downtown's fastest growing businesses - http://www.asolutions.com), which is currently on the second floor, is expanding to the ground floor. New, huge windows will be installed all around the ground floor which will really open up the building. Many other improvements to the building facade will also happen as well as an underground parking garage for the residents.

Interesting. That will make the building look much more alive and the residents will surely love the new underground parking garage.

We do not allow listings or advertisements on the forum. Thank you for your cooperation.



MattnSTL

dpsnodgr wrote:

I didn't think solicitation/advertisements were allowed on urbanstl.



[Thanks, they're not.]

I've just gotten word that I'll be transferred to St. Louis, and I'm very excited! I've always wanted to get a loft, but I have always been stationed in locations where they were cost prohibitive. With the availability of so many at such great prices (compared to where I'm living now), I feel like a kid in a candy store...



Among many other facilities, I've been looking (online) at a couple of lofts available at the King Bee that I'm very interested in. However, upon stumbling upon this site - and thread - I'm not so sure any more.



Have things improved with the establishment of the association? Any current feedback on this building would be greatly appreciated!



Thanks!

I went to an open house in a finished unit in the King Bee a few months back and it was a great space. Custom designed by the owner or her fmaily or something. I think it's still available. I don't think there is on site parking though. Honestly...I'd say search around some of the other available properties as well. There is a good amount of different types available with developers ready to cut some deals or add some incentives. Ventana for instance right next door.

I cannot say that I am surprised that Sam Glasser is not making good on his promises at the King Bee. Speaking from experience, NEVER make a decision based on a 'promise' by Glasser. He has reaped a small fortune in St. Louis by not delivering on copious promises (otherwise known as lying or fraud).



Get everything in writing before signing on to anything he has his hands in. Trust me, many folks downtown learned this lesson the hard way.

Thanks for the info! So I guess that this is one of those places to scrutinize very carefully beforehand. I really do like the open style of these lofts, but I will definitely be asking the tough questions when looking at them.



Thanks again for the insight!

The new RFT has a major article about the ongoing shenanigans at the King Bee Lofts.



<a href="http://www.riverfronttimes.com/2008-05- ... tung/">Bad buzz</a>



This part regarding the new occupancy permit ordinance is interesting:

[Building commissioner] Frank Oswald believes the King Bee slipped through a crack in the system. In what the city calls a "Housing Conservation District," no building or apartment can accept a new occupant without the proper inspection. But downtown, like several other neighborhoods, does not fall into one of these districts.



If it weren't for that gap, Oswald says, "I don't think we would've had anybody moving in, because a real estate agent wouldn't have closed without an occupancy permit." (Oswald notes that Mayor Francis Slay recently signed an ordinance requiring occupancy permits throughout the city starting next year.)

I vow to never buy from Glasser or Jump, ever.