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Interesting news, in more ways that one...
I've done some work in Edwardsville for a couple of class projects, and I've also attended some community events there in the last year. On more than one occasion, I heard from a couple of chamber of commerce members (don't know what the official word is, so I cannot say how true any of this information may be) that there were plans for a retail center at Interstate 55 and Illinois Highway 143 at the eastern edge of Edwardsville.
Who knows whether this is true, but it's important to note that there are indeed plans to extend Governors Parkway from Illinois 159 east toward the Illinois 143 interchange at Interstate 55, which would ostensibly make this area every bit as ripe for development as the parcel that is the subject of this thread.
And earlier this decade, prior to its acquisition by Macy's Inc. (then known as Federated), May Department Stores was exploring the idea of building a freestanding Famous-Barr in Edwardsville. Those plans (along with another freestanding Famous-Barr in the Winghaven area of O'Fallon, Mo.) were cancelled not long before the acquisition of May by Federated in 2005. I'm guessing if those plans had gone through, it probably would've been at the expense of the Alton Macy's location, which is one of several local Macy's anchors attached to a dying (or already dead) mall.
So while something of this magnitude with several national retailers is not unthinkable by any means, I share Framer's skepticism about this proposal. The Edwardsville area is certainly ripe for redevelopment and additional retail options, but I cannot imagine major retailers getting on board for a development like this until economic conditions improve signifcantly. Using the aforementioned Macy's example, they still have to improve same-store sales, and they may have to shutter even more underperforming stores like Alton or Northwest before they think about expanding again. Any other department store or big box retailer that's not already in Edwardsville has to be in a similar position. Walmart tried and failed to build a Supercenter in Glen Carbon, but I figure they will come back to Glen Carbon, Edwardsville, or even Maryville for another try eventually.
And I have mixed feelings. On one hand, I cannot get excited about another overgrown, autocentric development. On the other hand, I agree with Little Egyptian about some of the positive aspects of growth in Illinois.
I do think, however, there's an opportunity to go about growth in a smarter, more responsible way, and I would hope these cities learn from the mistakes of older suburbs before embracing a project of this magnitude. I also think the major retailers that residents of these communities seek will eventually build there anyway.
This will be an interesting one to watch...
I've done some work in Edwardsville for a couple of class projects, and I've also attended some community events there in the last year. On more than one occasion, I heard from a couple of chamber of commerce members (don't know what the official word is, so I cannot say how true any of this information may be) that there were plans for a retail center at Interstate 55 and Illinois Highway 143 at the eastern edge of Edwardsville.
Who knows whether this is true, but it's important to note that there are indeed plans to extend Governors Parkway from Illinois 159 east toward the Illinois 143 interchange at Interstate 55, which would ostensibly make this area every bit as ripe for development as the parcel that is the subject of this thread.
And earlier this decade, prior to its acquisition by Macy's Inc. (then known as Federated), May Department Stores was exploring the idea of building a freestanding Famous-Barr in Edwardsville. Those plans (along with another freestanding Famous-Barr in the Winghaven area of O'Fallon, Mo.) were cancelled not long before the acquisition of May by Federated in 2005. I'm guessing if those plans had gone through, it probably would've been at the expense of the Alton Macy's location, which is one of several local Macy's anchors attached to a dying (or already dead) mall.
So while something of this magnitude with several national retailers is not unthinkable by any means, I share Framer's skepticism about this proposal. The Edwardsville area is certainly ripe for redevelopment and additional retail options, but I cannot imagine major retailers getting on board for a development like this until economic conditions improve signifcantly. Using the aforementioned Macy's example, they still have to improve same-store sales, and they may have to shutter even more underperforming stores like Alton or Northwest before they think about expanding again. Any other department store or big box retailer that's not already in Edwardsville has to be in a similar position. Walmart tried and failed to build a Supercenter in Glen Carbon, but I figure they will come back to Glen Carbon, Edwardsville, or even Maryville for another try eventually.
And I have mixed feelings. On one hand, I cannot get excited about another overgrown, autocentric development. On the other hand, I agree with Little Egyptian about some of the positive aspects of growth in Illinois.
I do think, however, there's an opportunity to go about growth in a smarter, more responsible way, and I would hope these cities learn from the mistakes of older suburbs before embracing a project of this magnitude. I also think the major retailers that residents of these communities seek will eventually build there anyway.
This will be an interesting one to watch...
Little Egyptian wrote:Well, you all can disagree with the form of the development, but the fact is that this is another billion dollar development in the Metro East (yes, I know it is still a proposal). Plus, it will lead to more housing, more infrastructure, more jobs, etc.
The Metro East is coming along pretty fast now and is regularly contributing billion dollar projects into the local economy. I hope that the rest of the city is taking note and a lot of that "don't cross the river" nonsense is subsiding.
Nah, it just makes us more like New Jersey.
there's the area we're looking at :
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story today in the P-D: [url]http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/busine ... cument[url]
Presumably the "lots of green space" would be for play.
"We plan on making a live-work environment" with "lots of green space," he added.
Collins said the bill promotes "extensive flood plain development" and would "almost certainly" lead to wetlands destruction.
"Unfortunately, the incentives are set up for someone to make a quick buck developing the land, even getting a tax break to do so, and then walk away," she said. "When the inevitable (flooding) happens, they are long gone and insurance premium payers or the taxpayers in general are left to foot the bill for the damages to goods and property that result."
I noticed that article in the paper yesterday. I didn't realize this thing was in a flood plain. While I support continued development of the Metro East, I'm firmly opposed to commercial development in flood plains.
I hope this remains farmland.
I hope this remains farmland.
Then you're against almost any development in the poorest cities in the metro east. Almost half of the metro east is a giant flood plain. However, most of it is protected by levees.
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What you must understand is that Cahokia (the oldest city in Illinois, and the St Louis area) has endured flood after flood. East St Louis, once the 2nd largest city in Illinois, has withstood flood after flood. Granite City has done the same. This isn't anywhere near the river, in comparrison. The flood situation isn't as problematic in this area, and the communities near the river, have plenty of experience with dealing with the river and floods.
What you must understand is that Cahokia (the oldest city in Illinois, and the St Louis area) has endured flood after flood. East St Louis, once the 2nd largest city in Illinois, has withstood flood after flood. Granite City has done the same. This isn't anywhere near the river, in comparrison. The flood situation isn't as problematic in this area, and the communities near the river, have plenty of experience with dealing with the river and floods.
I guess I should clarify myself, and say that I'm firmly opposed to any new development on floodplains, and I'm opposed to new levee construction pretty much anywhere.
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I'll just add that there are several reasons to be against this development whether in a floodplain or not.
Grover wrote:I'll just add that there are several reasons to be against this development whether in a floodplain or not.
Well yeah.
Post Dispatch had a good article on Star Bonds proposal, state senate voted in favor 51-4 and moves it onto house committee. The article states some Metro East mayors feel that they will be on the losing end on this one. Agree, only so many dollars in the area. The other items that I found interesting were amendments/conditions. Including no sales tax generated by a big box store can be used for the development if a similiar store is within 25 miles. Wonder how that number is derived and why any developor would agree to such a term in a metro area.
http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/s ... enDocument
A statement from University Town Center Development said the proposed amendment would, among other provisions:
— Exempt sales taxes of the Madison County Transit District, the Madison County Flood Protection District and Metro-East Park and Recreation District.
— Provide that only new and additional sales taxes generated by the development would go to pay for it.
— Prohibits use of sales tax from any retail business larger than 20,000 square feet that closes a store in Illinois within 25 miles of a STAR bond district.
— Prohibits automobile dealerships from locating in STAR districts.
The Glen Carbon project is proposed for an area bounded by Interstate 270, Illinois Route 157, Interstate 255 and Illinois Route 162.
The bill is SB 1909.
http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/s ... enDocument
A statement from University Town Center Development said the proposed amendment would, among other provisions:
— Exempt sales taxes of the Madison County Transit District, the Madison County Flood Protection District and Metro-East Park and Recreation District.
— Provide that only new and additional sales taxes generated by the development would go to pay for it.
— Prohibits use of sales tax from any retail business larger than 20,000 square feet that closes a store in Illinois within 25 miles of a STAR bond district.
— Prohibits automobile dealerships from locating in STAR districts.
The Glen Carbon project is proposed for an area bounded by Interstate 270, Illinois Route 157, Interstate 255 and Illinois Route 162.
The bill is SB 1909.
900 acres of pure un-adulterated St. Charles County being built in Glen Carbon! This St. Louis Region is so needing regional planning with authority.
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^ Yep. I did a quick post (and there's a link to the preliminary project proposal), but I think the developer (and the bank loaning the money) is crazy to think this will pull in people from 250miles around.
http://www.stlurbanworkshop.com/2009/08 ... chief.html
http://www.stlurbanworkshop.com/2009/08 ... chief.html
As a Collinsville resident who went to school in Edwardsville, this makes me want to cry. I've said it before, but I'll say it again. I know it's frustrating for urbanites to see sprawl eating up the farmland outside their city. But it's even more depressing for those that live here to see our farmland eaten up by sprawl.
I just hope that the cities and townships in the Metro East maintain at least a little bit of their individuality and don't become another blob of suburbia. But, the way things are going, it isn't looking too bright.
I just hope that the cities and townships in the Metro East maintain at least a little bit of their individuality and don't become another blob of suburbia. But, the way things are going, it isn't looking too bright.
As a Collinsville resident who went to school in Edwardsville, this makes me want to cry. I've said it before, but I'll say it again. I know it's frustrating for urbanites to see sprawl eating up the farmland outside their city. But it's even more depressing for those that live here to see our farmland eaten up by sprawl.
I just hope that the cities and townships in the Metro East maintain at least a little bit of their individuality and don't become another blob of suburbia. But, the way things are going, it isn't looking too bright.
I just hope that the cities and townships in the Metro East maintain at least a little bit of their individuality and don't become another blob of suburbia. But, the way things are going, it isn't looking too bright.
Looks like the project hit the wall on the political front.
http://interact.stltoday.com/blogzone/p ... backs-off/
I wish LEGOLAND would embrace a park along the riverfront, preferably just north of Laclede's Landing, that embraces a river theme and the area's history. The kid in me pictures massive lego bridges, paddleboats, trains with water everywhere. I would even dare them to build a lego boat that actually floats on the Mississippi.
http://interact.stltoday.com/blogzone/p ... backs-off/
I wish LEGOLAND would embrace a park along the riverfront, preferably just north of Laclede's Landing, that embraces a river theme and the area's history. The kid in me pictures massive lego bridges, paddleboats, trains with water everywhere. I would even dare them to build a lego boat that actually floats on the Mississippi.
Yeah, I too heard that this project was dead. And that makes me happy.
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Now the developer is confirming the project is dead. Apparently Metro East mayors successfully stalled the tax financing in the state legislature.
http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/s ... enDocument
http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/s ... enDocument
Or you can just wait for Cementland!! The east side could use some legos!Dredger wrote:Looks like the project hit the wall on the political front.
http://interact.stltoday.com/blogzone/p ... backs-off/
I wish LEGOLAND would embrace a park along the riverfront, preferably just north of Laclede's Landing, that embraces a river theme and the area's history. The kid in me pictures massive lego bridges, paddleboats, trains with water everywhere. I would even dare them to build a lego boat that actually floats on the Mississippi.