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Totally AddictedTotally Addicted
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PostSep 08, 2009#126

gopher wrote:


And I'll say this again... This is what happens when we have neglect and abuse of a park for nearly 40 years. That's what should be sad. That's what you should be angry about. That's what you should be fighting for in your own neighborhood... To prevent what has happened here from happening elsewhere. That's what you should be working to improve.


Personally, I believe one can both want to better the park and retain its trees.



Just because people criticize a decision to remove an existing tree canopy from the park does not necessarily mean they are angry only at your effort and not at the sorry state of the current park.



Also, I will not say anything else about the homelessness issue except this: when you're at all a public entity (such as an individual or a member of a group trying to convince others to renovate a public park), I would avoid the use of the word "bum". Why antagonize people? You might not like the effects of the presence of the homeless on property values/the image of the park/etc. But that doesn't mean you have to be derogatory.



As it stands now, if I were in St. Louis, I would not be a part of this effort simply because I now perceive it as an anti-homeless (to be differentiated from anti-homelessness) rally of sorts. Just my opinion.

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AdministratorAdministrator
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PostSep 08, 2009#127

To be clear, only the trees along 14th were cut down. The rest are still there. I'm OK with it there.


Matt Drops The H wrote:Also, I will not say anything else about the homelessness issue except this: when you're at all a public entity (such as an individual or a member of a group trying to convince others to renovate a public park), I would avoid the use of the word "bum". Why antagonize people? You might not like the effects of the presence of the homeless on property values/the image of the park/etc. But that doesn't mean you have to be derogatory.



As it stands now, if I were in St. Louis, I would not be a part of this effort simply because I now perceive it as an anti-homeless (to be differentiated from anti-homelessness) rally of sorts. Just my opinion.


I can't help but agree with this on both points. Choosing your words is as important as anything else when you are dealing with community development issues.

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Life MemberLife Member
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PostSep 09, 2009#128

gopher wrote:And it can start in a small little park that everyone has given up on.
You gave up? :P



And I agree with the last two commenters. Treating the homeless like crap serves no purpose but to make you look bad. They're people, not animals.

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Junior MemberJunior Member
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PostSep 09, 2009#129

^ Noted.



However, let me be crystal clear on this.



I believe that there is a very strong difference between someone who is "homeless" and someone who is a "bum".



They are not necessarily the same.



e.g. A homeless individual may not be a "bum", likewise a "bum" may not be homeless.



A homeless individual may be working to better themselves, never panhandle, seek appropriate help, and never bother anyone. I'm fine with that and wish them the best of luck. I will and have literally given them the shirt off my back to help them out.



A bum is not working to better themselves, panhandles, sucks the life out of the community, creates problems for everyone, and I'm not cool with that as it directly impacts me.



I know several people who are homeless whom I would not consider "bums". They don't panhandle me, work around the neighborhood doing odd jobs, and are generally friendly and say "hi". They are nice people. They have drug, alcohol, and mental problems and are often assaulted and beaten by what I call "bums". That angers me. They are taken advantage of and they are what society needs to support.

Most of the people who live here know the difference as we deal with this on a daily, if not hourly basis.



I do however, have a serious problem with the bums who destroy on a daily basis what we are trying to improve.



Call it frustration on my end. I've been seething with rage since seeing an "individual" masturbate in front of my kid, being assaulted, and seeing a homeless child beaten in this park. I'm an adult and can apologize when I'm wrong. So if I offended anyone who is homeless and not a bum I didn't mean to lump you all in together, and I apologize.



However, if someone wants to pull out their wee-wee in front of my kid, strip down nude and take a few laps in the fountain, or turn a city I've come to love and call home into their own personal "Johnny on the Spot... well don't be surprised if "bum" is but one of many choice words I have for said "individual".

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Life MemberLife Member
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PostSep 09, 2009#130

Well said. I agree 100%.

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Super MemberSuper Member
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PostSep 09, 2009#131

^^ agreed



When you have "bums" throwing bottles at windows (aka homes)... something has to be done.

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