This is a little off topic but is our Planned Parenthood really the last abortion clinic in the state? I thought I saw a sign when I was Springfield, that they have an abortion clinic down there but I only saw it for a split second because it was along the highway. I may have been seeing things.

And on this topic, St. Louis and KC are not in favor of what's going on in Jefferson City right now and I don't expect it to remain law for that long. I do think, and this is insane, that St. Louis will do something about this to retain abortion here. There are most likely loopholes in the bill Governor Parson signed that smart enough people can find to make new laws in St. Louis and, to a lesser extent, KC. On Alabama being not as bad as us comment, I see that as a little too far. They flat out banned it and will jail people for an abortion. I don't think ours does that but I may be wrong. I don't pay attention much to Jefferson City's show because I see problems here we have to address. I think State Leaders have pounded other issues enough that they are bored at this point. They also want to cause some sh*t since Greitens isn't in office anymore to stir controversy. 

And, to be honest with you, I think that the State Legislature believes that if anyone wants a legal abortion, they can go to Illinois. That's just my opinion but Illinois is doing the exact opposite of us. 

On other things mentioned, I don't think this will hurt St. Louis' image much. Most people know that we are Progressive here compared to the rest of the state and KC for that matter. Most people should know that 75%+ of the population in St. Louis City and County are against what the State did and for those who can see that, we should be fine. Will it make us slow down? Hard to tell. I have this very, and I mean a very, small idea that this will cause an influx of some conservative people moving into the state and metro areas if this is upheld.

Our politicians, they spoke out when the bill was passed. Both Lyda Krewson and Sam Page tweeted about it but that may not be enough for some. I think that this comes from, by my observations, that Lyda and now Sam Page, want the State's help in combating our problems. It appears they don't want to piss off Parson or really anyone in Jefferson City that much or else we won't get needed help. It appears Krewson warmed up to Parson more but that's just a mild observation. Sam Page is also moderate and doesn't want to anger the three majority Republican districts in the county at this point. Here are Lyda's and Sam's Tweets: 




One more thing, as we all know, our Planned Parenthood is at risk of closure. Some say because of all the medical emergencies that have happened there recently. I see that site being prime for new development. It's a crazy idea but what if a developer built apartments there and allowed Planned Parenthood to have a non-abortion clinic there and an actual abortion clinic somewhere else in the city that is away from the fast-growing CWE-Cortex area? I think it would be a good tradeoff to have an urban building on that corner but have P.P. in the retail space to keep their presence there. The abortion clinic could then be built elsewhere where protester, ProChoice, and ProLife couldn't get close to it by design. 

Anyway, this post is just me rambling about multiple factors relating to this issue.

I said this elsewhere, but I fear the TRAP laws (targeted restrictions of abortion providers) would prevent them from being most if any other places. The state has already closed down every provider on the Missouri side in Kansas City. (Long ago now, in fact. KC folks already had to cross to Kansas. That's right, progressive old Kansas.) PP has long fought to keep procedures available at the clinic in Columbia, but that was the last one other than St. Louis, and they've been unable to find a doctor that was both willing and could satisfy the admitting privileges thing. In St. Louis most hospitals wouldn't grant admitting privileges, since most are Catholic, and what few remain are often equally conservative. BJC would be the big exception, which means they need to stay within a certain perimeter of BJC.

But I think stlgasm has hit the nail on the head. Our national reputation was already little better than Alabama. This is going to do us serious damage if it hasn't already. Our leaders need to overturn it and fast. And Parsons has lost any support from me now and forever. He just threw us under the bus.

Trololzilla wrote: I have to also disagree with Chris's assessment that outsiders will see this as an "only Missouri" problem and give STL credit for being relatively progressive. I think you're being far too generous by assuming that out-of-staters will ignore the ramifications of the ban and that they would also be smart enough (or care enough) to know St. Louis' demographics regarding the issue. All they see is news reports saying "Missouri passes abortion bill", and as stlgasm pointed out, it likely has a shot of STL's downtown as the header. All that does is lump the metro in with the rest of state, however much the local populace might disagree. The NY Post article made that rather clear - people are literally refusing to come to STL because it's a part of Missouri.

....

Regardless of anyone's personal opinions on abortion, it is clear that the legislation is eminently harmful towards women and their health, and can and already is having an effect on perception and people's willingness to come here to stay. STL needs all the help it can get to attract outside people and investment, and Missouri just made it that much harder for the region to succeed. This legislation will end up impacting everyone here in some way should it continue like this. 

In all honesty, I’ve read the NY Post article taking about this. I’m sure this comment will get me torn up but if people are this upset about a law that will be overturned in the higher courts, they are too sensitive. Refusing to come to a state, like Missouri, and St. Louis in particular, over the actions of the Republican led state legislature is laughable. If those people see that as a problem, then don’t come here. This state isn’t going to change because of the dynamics out state. Secession would be shot down almost immediately.

I may be being too generous on the St. Louis being progressive part but I really think it is true. We will find a way to fix this somehow and will give us a more independent mindset and governance than the rest of the state even if it means crazier bills and legislation.

I say give a month or two. It will end up in the Supreme Court and they’ll take care of it. I’ll be shocked if Roe V Wade is overturned. Will I protest? No. I refuse to protest for both the pro life and pro choice movements as it appears it is driving a stake right into the division this country has right now. The media, President Trump And the partisan b*tching on the issue isn’t helping either. This isn’t at the top of my list of priorities that I see that needs to be fixed. This is down the line some. The complaining from both sides just needs to stop at this point. Because it will keep being a big circle no matter what side you are on.

But if some are craving long term change... run for office at the city and state level. You’ll surely be elected somewhere along the way.

EDIT...
1. I see the ACLU is working on getting this on the ballot for a referendum. I believe outstate will pass the recent law and uphold it come the election. I don’t think there are enough voters in this state to be pro-choice in this instance.
2. I see this debate turning violent. I hate to believe that people are going to die as a result of this. Men, Women and Children could suffer once the radicals on both sides get involved into this. They’ll start killing each other to make a point. Some radical pro-life people have before but you know that sooner or later pro-choice will too to try to make a point. This is a civil war forming right before our eyes and I don’t want to see how it ends.

^Wow. That was possibly the hardest 180 I've ever seen

This will hurt us economically. There is no doubt about it. This only more firmly establishes us (metropolitan areas included - we're unfortunately all in this together) as a backwoods flyover state to the rest of the country, and encourages current residents and businesses with more liberal viewpoints to continue to flock to hipper/more-progressive states or cities.

Unfortunately, it is pretty clear that a majority of the population in this state wants to return to the 19th century. 
I do find it ironic that the state legislators that want to impose Saudi-style social laws on the people of Missouri are the same ones who allegedly "work hard" to turn Missouri into a biotech state, try to help the city expand the Cortex into a nationally-recognized tech hub, talk of a hyperloop, etc. It already is VERY hard for St. Louis or Kansas City-based companies to attract talent and an educated labor force from out of state or even retain internal talent (see the latest editions of the St. Louis Fed's beige book). Things like this make it incredibly harder. I have no doubt that this will have (negative) material consequences for the city. It's not that most people even know that St. Louis is across the river from Illinois, and they can simply cross the river and get an abortion there. It's not even about how easy it is for people to get abortions themselves, but rather about living in a state whose legislature actively works to curb other's individual rights. As certain right start being rolled back, who knows what will come next? Attacks on minorities?

kipfilet wrote:

The Mayor wrote:
State law supersedes all municipal law.  Even if St. Louis attempted to lead by protecting PP or abortion in some other form the State would be well within its powers to kill those laws.  And you can bet they will.  St. Louis (and other Missouri cities) are already banned from minimum wage hikes, plastic bag bans, and a whole host of other things the goons in Jeff City don't like.

An apt description of GOP State Government philosophy: "we are all for local power, except when it does things that we do not like".

LMFIFY: An apt description of GOP State Government philosophy: "we are all for local power, except when it does things that we do not like".

Regardless of how one feels about abortion, this kind of extreme guardrail legislation will do nothing but damage our ability to attract companies and jobs.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

It's already impacting other states with similar laws, Disney, Netflix and WarnerMedia have already made statements that they may no longer do business in Georgia due to the legislation. 
https://www.cnn.com/2019/05/30/business ... index.html

[quote="stlgasm"]
I don’t think we can ignore the enormous damage that Missouri’s draconian abortion ban is bound to have the local economy.  Right now in the eyes of the rest of the country, Missouri is worse than ALABAMA, and deserved or not, St. Louis has now become synonymous with ass backwardness.  How many news shows and press articles have you read over the past 48 hours with the Arch as the backdrop??  This is HORRIBLE and infuriating on many levels.  Until this embarrassing, unconstitutional ban is overturned, we can kiss goodbye any hopes of becoming a hub for tech or art or music or education or anything other than a hub of ignorance and ridicule. No progressive-minded, upwardly mobile person would choose to live in such an oppressive and idiotic state. Companies will not move here. Talent will be even harder to attract (as if it weren’t challenging enough before), local universities will suffer dearly (already are- did you read the NY Post article about Wash U applicants sending rejection letters to the university denouncing the ban and rejecting their acceptance??), and we will be (already are) the butt of jokes in the national media.  I feel like our elected leaders are asleep at the wheel. WHY AREN’T THEY SPEAKING OUT EMPHATICALLY AND BOLDLY AGAINST THIS BS???  Where’s our mayor and county executive? Corporate CEOs???  University chancellors??  We are AT THE VERY BOTTOM now, it’s just shameful.  St. Louis was recently named the best city for female entrepreneurs, right?  HA!  What a joke. What self-respecting ambitious woman would ever choose to start or grow a business in this hillbilly state. We no longer deserve to hold that title.  It’s hard to get excited about development projects in the city knowing that these suffocating state laws are destined to sabotage any urban appeal or momentum we have.  Missouri actively repels educated and innovative people- those with the means to choose where they want to live will choose someplace else, ANYPLACE else but here. We should all be outraged. We deny women’s basic rights and healthcare. We don’t fund higher education. We don’t fund public transit. We don’t expand Medicaid. We have the lowest gas tax in America. The lowest tobacco tax in America. A complete lack of gun control measures. The only state without an prescription opioid registry... This is very very bad and is overshadowing any progress we as a city have made. Because at the end of the day we are the first state to ban abortion completely. That’s our claim to fame. We’re screwed.
[/quote]

Is your echo chamber tiny world desperate for coastal elite approval so small that you really think people make decisions on where to live based on the availability of ABORTIONS?

You may not, but many people care about human rights and access to healthcare. 

The Planned Parenthood location on Lindell is indeed the only operating abortion clinic in the state (and has been for a couple years) due to the state legislature's increasingly insane rounds of regulations that they pass every year or two, forcing any provider to comply with increasingly ludicrous regulations. I know Planned Parenthood started providing abortions at a second clinic in Columbia but was unable to renew their license as no hospital in Columbia was willing to provide admitting privileges to the doctors due to behind the scenes pressure from Republicans. I would guess that there are similar barriers in Kansas City and elsewhere in the state. There used to be a second private clinic in St. Louis but it was shuttered when the doctor retired a few years back. I should state that this is all going as planned by Republicans/pro life activists, who have long seen the clinic on Lindell (right down the street from the Cathedral Basilica) as a symbol for their struggle.

People forget that there are two abortion providers on the East Side; Granite City and Belleville. Of course, no one in the rest of the country knows that; all they'll remember hearing is that "Missouri is the only state in the country without an abortion clinic".  

^And there are providers in Kansas near Kansas City. Sure. But Missouri's GOP is quite clearly trying to shut them down. They've accomplished most of their aims, shutting down the clinics in Columbia, Springfield, and I believe also Joplin at one time.

Also, minor point: It's on Forest Park. The Red Cross is on Lindell. Some people probably like that almost as little, though oddly it's completely the other side. (I like both, for the record. And have set foot in both for assorted reasons. Though not technically the particular building on Forest Park, but . . . might as well have been. Just lived elsewhere at the time. And I've donated things to both; money to one and time and blood to the other.)

I think ultimately the clinic will end up staying open for both healthcare and abortions. In its own little way abortion is an effective tool in the fight against crime and poverty. Much needed here.

I just think some people are a little too preoccupied about as to whether or not cool people from cool places also think that they're a cool person from a cool place. It's just kind of sad. That's all.

leeharveyawesome wrote: I just think some people are a little too preoccupied about as to whether or not cool people from cool places also think that they're a cool person from a cool place. It's just kind of sad. That's all.

That's how things work, whether you like it or not. The Amazon HQ debacle was this on steroids. While it was ultimately inconsequential, I think it is a good case study of the dynamics at work: you can only attract high value-added investment if you can also attract qualified talent. Said talent does not want to move to places that are unable to offer basic "amenities" (I am calling them like this because some people might dislike what they really are -- basic human rights). This phenomenon is very salient in some of the latest editions of the St. Louis Fed's Beige Book. Some places are unable to offer said amenities for primarily economic reasons (most of Latin America, Africa, etc.). Other places refuse to supply these amenities for political reasons -- this is the case of Missouri. As I said above, this is fine if that is what most of the constituents want, but then please stop complaining about dying cities or brain drains. 

I do find it interesting that places like Dallas, Atlanta, Nashville, and Charlotte are booming despite being in very conservative states. I think that Missouri could play the conservative card and still grow. Investment in education and infrastructure is where St. Louis is seriously getting it wrong in my opinion. Obviously, you will get a lot of people that will not come to a right wing state like Missouri but money also talks in a big way.