I saw that the CEO of Nvidia made a surprise stop at the convention. I also work downtown and saw all sorts of storefronts being leased for private parties to support the conference. This is pretty normal for large IT conferences I've been to so neat to see it happen in St. Louis. Also, in talking to an attendee, this conference pulls in a huge international audience. Lots of questions from them on how and why St. Louis ended up being the host City. Hopefully they liked it here!
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You May Have to Move to Minnesota to Escape the Data Center Epidemic
https://gizmodo.com/you-may-have-to-move-to-minnesota-to-escape-the-data-center-epidemic-2000687733
https://gizmodo.com/you-may-have-to-move-to-minnesota-to-escape-the-data-center-epidemic-2000687733
are we (stl) "missing the boat"?
https://www.cnbc.com/2025/12/19/data-center-deals-hit-record-amid-ai-funding-concerns-grip-investors.html
https://www.cnbc.com/2025/12/19/data-center-deals-hit-record-amid-ai-funding-concerns-grip-investors.html
Maybe a silly question. But does having a data center local as opposed to 500 miles away make a difference? Or does it not really matter where you are sending your data to?chris fuller wrote: ↑Dec 21, 2025are we (stl) "missing the boat"?
https://www.cnbc.com/2025/12/19/data-center-deals-hit-record-amid-ai-funding-concerns-grip-investors.html
As in does having a data center say downtown help get some kind of jobs here anymore than having it somewhere off I-70 out past Wentzville? This is referring to jobs outside the data center, not the few people working in it.
Unless latency is of paramount importance to what you're doing, I don't see why.
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In stock trading and also some surgery where robotics are used, it makes a difference if it’s 2 miles away vs 500jshank83 wrote: ↑Dec 22, 2025Maybe a silly question. But does having a data center local as opposed to 500 miles away make a difference? Or does it not really matter where you are sending your data to?chris fuller wrote: ↑Dec 21, 2025are we (stl) "missing the boat"?
https://www.cnbc.com/2025/12/19/data-center-deals-hit-record-amid-ai-funding-concerns-grip-investors.html
As in does having a data center say downtown help get some kind of jobs here anymore than having it somewhere off I-70 out past Wentzville? This is referring to jobs outside the data center, not the few people working in it.
I think the other question for the city is do you want the private leasable property and corresponding tax base that goes with it stay in the city or you perfectly content with say Wentzville gaining the tax revenues? Discussion to where to place the data center(s) within city is a different question but do think that anything that helps city increase private property tax rolls and collections is a plus simply due to the large amount of old industrial and underutilized property.jshank83 wrote: ↑Dec 22, 2025Maybe a silly question. But does having a data center local as opposed to 500 miles away make a difference? Or does it not really matter where you are sending your data to?chris fuller wrote: ↑Dec 21, 2025are we (stl) "missing the boat"?
https://www.cnbc.com/2025/12/19/data-center-deals-hit-record-amid-ai-funding-concerns-grip-investors.html
As in does having a data center say downtown help get some kind of jobs here anymore than having it somewhere off I-70 out past Wentzville? This is referring to jobs outside the data center, not the few people working in it.
From AI overview.
St. Louis City garners property taxes from taxable properties (residential at 19%, commercial at 32% assessed), but a big chunk (around 40%) of its land is tax-exempt (govt, parks, non-profits), limiting revenue, forcing reliance on an earnings tax, and making property taxes a smaller share (around 13%) of total revenue compared to other cities, with rates needing increases to offset lost earnings tax funds.
The workhouse site seems like a good site. No onsite fossil-fuel power generation beyond so.e tiny amount, IMO.dredger wrote: ↑Dec 22, 2025I think the other question for the city is do you want the private leasable property and corresponding tax base that goes with it stay in the city or you perfectly content with say Wentzville gaining the tax revenues? Discussion to where to place the data center(s) within city is a different question but do think that anything that helps city increase private property tax rolls and collections is a plus simply due to the large amount of old industrial and underutilized property.jshank83 wrote: ↑Dec 22, 2025Maybe a silly question. But does having a data center local as opposed to 500 miles away make a difference? Or does it not really matter where you are sending your data to?chris fuller wrote: ↑Dec 21, 2025are we (stl) "missing the boat"?
https://www.cnbc.com/2025/12/19/data-center-deals-hit-record-amid-ai-funding-concerns-grip-investors.html
As in does having a data center say downtown help get some kind of jobs here anymore than having it somewhere off I-70 out past Wentzville? This is referring to jobs outside the data center, not the few people working in it.
From AI overview.
St. Louis City garners property taxes from taxable properties (residential at 19%, commercial at 32% assessed), but a big chunk (around 40%) of its land is tax-exempt (govt, parks, non-profits), limiting revenue, forcing reliance on an earnings tax, and making property taxes a smaller share (around 13%) of total revenue compared to other cities, with rates needing increases to offset lost earnings tax funds.
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The county gets the benefits, the sales taxes, and none of the responsibility. What does participation in airport governance get them?
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Being in med tech, network latency issues are definitely a consideration for major and regional health centers.
Anything requiring real time or near real time feedback cannot have network lag.
Anything requiring real time or near real time feedback cannot have network lag.
I will admit the reality is that no one is building data centers in MO because of the energy issue/consumption driven in part state politics & a mentality doesn't support clean energy at the state level. Ironically TX a very red state is leading in renewable energy in part to letting the market to provide the immediate cheap renewable energy whereas POTUS just screwed VA on the offshore wind permit for a project that is like 80-90% complete.
Closer to MO. See the data center buildouts in KS and NE continue because of abundant wind energy. Doubt KS is crying over spilled milk of the grain belt express being denied Fed loan to get cheap energy headed east because the data center investment in KS will soak up that energy supply either way & a few more farmers and landowners will benefit from rent checks, royalty checks coming off new windmills. Whereas MO soybean farmers have to get bailed out again over a self inflicted trade war..
Closer to MO. See the data center buildouts in KS and NE continue because of abundant wind energy. Doubt KS is crying over spilled milk of the grain belt express being denied Fed loan to get cheap energy headed east because the data center investment in KS will soak up that energy supply either way & a few more farmers and landowners will benefit from rent checks, royalty checks coming off new windmills. Whereas MO soybean farmers have to get bailed out again over a self inflicted trade war..
So there are plenty of users who don't need super low latency then.
The battle continues…
Two data centers eye open land in Foristell, at edge of St. Charles County - STLtoday.com
Two data centers eye open land in Foristell, at edge of St. Charles County - STLtoday.com
Sprouting up like weeds
STLMag - Rural Missouri is quickly becoming a new battleground over data center development
https://www.stlmag.com/business/rural-m ... tleground/
STLMag - Rural Missouri is quickly becoming a new battleground over data center development
https://www.stlmag.com/business/rural-m ... tleground/
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The data center rebellion is here, and it’s reshaping the political landscape
As the buildout of AI infrastructure alarms communities, it is fast emerging as a potent electoral issue across the political divide
https://archive.ph/MYv7n
As the buildout of AI infrastructure alarms communities, it is fast emerging as a potent electoral issue across the political divide
https://archive.ph/MYv7n
Recall the rebellion against cars in cities was stamped out by the industry a century ago. The data center forces are certainly more powerful today than they were back then.
St Louis, specifically downtown St. Louis, between 909 Chestnut and Railway Exchange literally has up to 2.7 million square feet of empty space if my AI Overview search is correct. So say 2.5 million of leasable space. I understand that no one will like my next comment but hear me out. Just renting 20-30% of that vertical space for data center use it would be between 500,000 to 750,000 square feet of leasable, rent paying, tax paying space back in use and a significant anchor use. Combine that with development incentives for rest of the space and I honestly think it would mean that these buildings finally get redeveloped with downtown gaining another more than 1.5 million square feet of residential, hotel room and commercial space coming together. To me that is pretty good outcome any you look at it.
My broader point is that Mayor Spencer and City leadership should all over the idea of incorporating data center space as part of an overall downtown development plan and an elegant solution to adding tech infrastructure & while dealing with an urban core built environment that simply has too much space & not enough demand. Pencil something, anything to at least get a reaction or feedback, something to argue cons and pros, so forth.
An even broader point. Target some old industrial sites in the city if no one wants it downtown, midtown or part of CORTEX. The failing in city leadership IMO is in letting exburbs argue over who wants or doesn't want up to a half billion dollars or more in investment without putting some skin in the game seems completely nonsensical to me. I get the point of not a lot of jobs. But it is still private investment/capital into the city, its still construction jobs and materials, its still a paying user of city water and most importantly for city residents it is tax revenues!! Maybe it is happening behind the scenes, maybe DB can give some insight.
My broader point is that Mayor Spencer and City leadership should all over the idea of incorporating data center space as part of an overall downtown development plan and an elegant solution to adding tech infrastructure & while dealing with an urban core built environment that simply has too much space & not enough demand. Pencil something, anything to at least get a reaction or feedback, something to argue cons and pros, so forth.
An even broader point. Target some old industrial sites in the city if no one wants it downtown, midtown or part of CORTEX. The failing in city leadership IMO is in letting exburbs argue over who wants or doesn't want up to a half billion dollars or more in investment without putting some skin in the game seems completely nonsensical to me. I get the point of not a lot of jobs. But it is still private investment/capital into the city, its still construction jobs and materials, its still a paying user of city water and most importantly for city residents it is tax revenues!! Maybe it is happening behind the scenes, maybe DB can give some insight.
The workhouse site is sitting there ripe. Displaces no one. Don't have to do the extensive environmental clean up that resident would require. No I vestments in transit or other non-car modes squandered. It would get some tax exempt land off the city's ledger.
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@dredger 100% agree with your sentiments, including potential constructive reuse of part of 909 Chestnut. FYI I've spoken on that specific idea with people recently, just casual conversation on the City and what's feasible. It was put back to me as difficult because 1) the weight of all that equipment and 2) the infrastructure needs for the site, including electric, water, and HVAC. Still, I like this idea - keeping in mind that we already have multiple data center buildings in Downtown!!! We're not gonna be able to replace all that old Class B office space with apartments, so let's look at filling them with stacks of racks.
Has there been any explanation for why these projects are not being pursued or pushed for the north riverfront? There's a substation a couple blocks north of the casino (as there is adjacent to these properties and I assume is desirable for this kind of project). The land is mostly vacant and surely cheaper than midtown. I don't believe there's been flooding there in my life.
If each of these is really generating tens of millions in local taxes annually, build a whole campus up there.
If each of these is really generating tens of millions in local taxes annually, build a whole campus up there.
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It's probably a racial and economic thing that keeps discussion of building north silent. Activists will accuse the city of putting these facilities north when other wealthier and whiter neighborhoods have rejected them.