No they haven’t announced it. I’d guess they want to build the next gen fighter there if they win the contractSTLinCHI wrote: ↑Mar 09, 2025Do we know what is going to be built in the huge new plant? Tried searching for answers and found nothing.symphonicpoet wrote: ↑Mar 09, 2025No, but production is only just starting on the T-7 and MQ-25 lines, so both of those will need more people as they ramp up. And if Boeing can win either or both the USAF NGAD or USN F/A-XX program that would also add jobs. They're one of two bids on both of those, so they've got decent odds of landing at least one. They're building two new plants here. I expect there will be new hires to fill those plants. (And maybe rehires of some of the folks laid off. Maybe.) We'll see how it goes, but I'm pretty hopeful about this in the long term.
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My buddy works at Boeing and basically everything about the new facility requires a security clearance to know about
If that's true then this has to be Boeing's to lose, right? There's no way they give the B-21 and F/A-XX to one company if Boeing's proposal is in the same ballpark.
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The F/A-XX is a purely Navy competition and both Northrup-Grumman and Boeing and their predecessors have some serious history making great Navy aircraft going back three quarters of a century without interruption. (Grumman has probably made the majority of the Navy's fighters over its history, Douglas most of its bombers, and McDonnel has just possibly made most of its jets.) I wouldn't guess that Boeing is a shoe-in, but the Phantom Works knows their business. Of course, so does the Grumman Iron Works. I'm honestly inclined to think it would be a sad day when both companies didn't have aircraft flying from carrier decks. So it's probably more like the two serious contenders are getting down to it and the also ran dropped out. (Lockheed has never made a terribly successful navy aircraft with which I'm familiar. The Lightning II might be their first large Navy contract, and . . . the Navy didn't really want it. I feel like the F-35 spawns F/A-XX is a repeat of the F-111 inspires the Tomcat story.)
I still think that they should separate the production from the competition. Let them all compete for the concept and then again for production or let them share in the production.
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There's precedent for a joint venture between Boeing/McDonnell Douglas and Northrop Grumman: The F/A-18. Consider the design on Northrop's YF-17 prototype for the USAF:
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Sure looks familiar, doesn't it? Having lost that USAF contract to the F-16, Northrop partnered with McDonnell Douglas to create the F/A-18 for the Navy. This included Northrop building out the center and aft fuselage. Perhaps a JV could bring in these contracts for both manufacturers?
In the end, I'm hopeful the NGAD gets built. Lord knows the USAF needs it.
Sure looks familiar, doesn't it? Having lost that USAF contract to the F-16, Northrop partnered with McDonnell Douglas to create the F/A-18 for the Navy. This included Northrop building out the center and aft fuselage. Perhaps a JV could bring in these contracts for both manufacturers?
In the end, I'm hopeful the NGAD gets built. Lord knows the USAF needs it.
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^And the Navy needs F/A-XX. Desperately. If we can only have one of those two programs I think the Navy program is honestly the more important and impactful for our defense needs.
And yes, YF-17 to F-18 is a great example of defense cooperation.
And yes, YF-17 to F-18 is a great example of defense cooperation.
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Boeing wins the USAF NGAD competition. This is huge for St. Louis.
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https://www.wsj.com/business/airlines/b ... d-4c415b0f
Boeing BA 4.83%increase; green up pointing triangle scored a contract to build the Pentagon’s next-generation jet fighter, beating out rival Lockheed Martin LMT -6.85%decrease; red down pointing triangle. The deal has big implications for Boeing’s bottom line, its beleaguered defense unit and the jet maker’s strained relationship with the Trump administration. Boeing shares rose 5% following the decision Friday, while Lockheed shares fell 6%.
What is the project?4
The Pentagon wants the new jet fighter to replace the stealthy F-22, a Lockheed aircraft, and fly alongside semiautonomous drones that are already well into development. The Pentagon hasn’t released cost estimates for the program. Experts say the total research, development and acquisition costs could top $50 billion.
Boeing BA 4.83%increase; green up pointing triangle scored a contract to build the Pentagon’s next-generation jet fighter, beating out rival Lockheed Martin LMT -6.85%decrease; red down pointing triangle. The deal has big implications for Boeing’s bottom line, its beleaguered defense unit and the jet maker’s strained relationship with the Trump administration. Boeing shares rose 5% following the decision Friday, while Lockheed shares fell 6%.
What is the project?4
The Pentagon wants the new jet fighter to replace the stealthy F-22, a Lockheed aircraft, and fly alongside semiautonomous drones that are already well into development. The Pentagon hasn’t released cost estimates for the program. Experts say the total research, development and acquisition costs could top $50 billion.
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There's some chatter that the F/A-XX and the NGAD might be one and the same, or at least two very closely related models ala the F-35 variants.
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Biggest economic news for our region in a while and this gets like, 5 posts about it. I wonder why. Hmmmmm….
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Yes only 5 posts on a multi year discussion that started under the Obama admin, the Trump admin, where most of the leg work Happened under the Biden admin and left in a bow wrapped box for Trump to announce
Maybe I could gather this by reading the article, but how many NEW jobs are we talking here?
^ At least 500 per the tax breaks they were given but we don't yet know what work will be done here. From the PD article:
https://www.stltoday.com/news/local/bus ... p-homepage
https://www.stltoday.com/news/local/bus ... p-homepage
Boeing declined to answer a question about how much of the work on the Next Generation Air Dominance program will be done in the St. Louis region. But defense aerospace analyst Richard Aboulafia said final assembly, at least, is likely to happen here.
The St. Louis County Council approved about $155 million in tax breaks for the project in September 2023, and the company broke ground that winter.
Boeing will get half off real and personal property taxes for 10 years in exchange for the investment and creating 500 jobs. The deal includes a clawback measure if Boeing doesn’t keep the new jobs — plus at least 12,100 total jobs — in the region over the plan’s lifespan.
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All hyperbole aside, it's hands-down the biggest win for STL since the Blues won the Stanley Cup. Hundreds of billions in future revenues, with around $20BB in direct near-term economic gains for the STL region. Anticipating 250-300+ F-47s being built, at a cost north of $300MM apiece. Thousands of new jobs. Boeing's $1.8BB expansions at the airport will almost definitely all be built, with some expanded upon. A very potent and direct economic development boost to North County. Full validation of the region's efficacies for advanced manufacturing, now and for decades ahead.
@Trololzilla I am exceedingly hopeful that those rumors you heard on the F/A-XX and NGAD are correct. Fingers crossed.
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^ This is the greatest GIF of all time.
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I'm assuming that's just the next number up after all the test bed stuff is accounted for. I'm not sure what X/Y-36 through 46 would have been. The gap suggests there was a lot of quiet development going on. (Much like the gap between F-22 and F-35. We know what some of those were, of course. YF-23 and X-32, for instance. ) Some folks are suggesting Thunderbolt, but that's a Republic name. I don't think we need to bring back everything from WWII anyway. Banshee and Voodoo are both great names. If you want a new name the F-47 Reaper has a nice ring to it, and feels somewhat on theme. Best to stay away from the last Seattle designed fighter, though. I think that was the P-26 "Peashooter."quincunx wrote: ↑Mar 22, 2025F 47 is spot on
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I saw they decided to call it F-47 cause Trump is the 47th president kid you notsymphonicpoet wrote:I'm assuming that's just the next number up after all the test bed stuff is accounted for. I'm not sure what X/Y-36 through 46 would have been. The gap suggests there was a lot of quiet development going on. (Much like the gap between F-22 and F-35. We know what some of those were, of course. YF-23 and X-32, for instance. ) Some folks are suggesting Thunderbolt, but that's a Republic name. I don't think we need to bring back everything from WWII anyway. Banshee and Voodoo are both great names. If you want a new name the F-47 Reaper has a nice ring to it, and feels somewhat on theme. Best to stay away from the last Seattle designed fighter, though. I think that was the P-26 "Peashooter."quincunx wrote: ↑Mar 22, 2025F 47 is spot on
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Your rose colored glasses SP, lol. Maybe I should get a pair.
How about
F-47 Destroyer
F-47 Dodger
F-47 Raider
F-47 Bully
F-47 Slasher
F-47 Verrückter
F-47 Aufstand
F-47 Orangener Mann
F-47 Greifer
How about
F-47 Destroyer
F-47 Dodger
F-47 Raider
F-47 Bully
F-47 Slasher
F-47 Verrückter
F-47 Aufstand
F-47 Orangener Mann
F-47 Greifer
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Ich denke "Verrukter" richtig sind.
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Und warum ist ein neues Flugzeug Verrukt? Der Chef ist ganz Veruckt. Ganz böse, erlich. Und er hat ein Witze erzählt wan er hat gesagt es ist für ihn genomen, aber ich glaube das nicht. Es macht kein Sinn. Ich gebe ihn echte Schwäbisch Grussen: Lech mir am Arsch.
Look, I get that the idiot thinks it got the 47 number for some reason, but I don't buy it. Sure, it's a rumor that's floating around, but it just doesn't make a lick of sense if you know how the military works. It'd make sense for Boeing to do something like that to appease the manchild, but they don't get to pick the number. It's automatically assigned according to a standardized scheme that started in the fifties or sixties when the DoD forced the Navy and Airforce to use the same numbers. (Previous to that the same plane might have two completely different designations depending on which service was using it.)
Anyway, maybe the plane is utterly screwed up, but I think it's a bit early to say and based on past experience I have some faith the folks up by the airport can design and build a pretty darn good aircraft. It's . . . frustrating, to say the least that the current idiot is going to attempt to steal credit, but that doesn't necessarily make it a bad plane. And he'll be long gone by the time it enters service anyway.
Look, I get that the idiot thinks it got the 47 number for some reason, but I don't buy it. Sure, it's a rumor that's floating around, but it just doesn't make a lick of sense if you know how the military works. It'd make sense for Boeing to do something like that to appease the manchild, but they don't get to pick the number. It's automatically assigned according to a standardized scheme that started in the fifties or sixties when the DoD forced the Navy and Airforce to use the same numbers. (Previous to that the same plane might have two completely different designations depending on which service was using it.)
Anyway, maybe the plane is utterly screwed up, but I think it's a bit early to say and based on past experience I have some faith the folks up by the airport can design and build a pretty darn good aircraft. It's . . . frustrating, to say the least that the current idiot is going to attempt to steal credit, but that doesn't necessarily make it a bad plane. And he'll be long gone by the time it enters service anyway.