What alderperson is going to have the courage to write up a bill instituting a moratorium on data center construction in the city limits?
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That would be bad. A data center would make sense on the north riverfront, along highway 70, south riverfront, a few other areas potentially. Not sure why a slow/no growth city would be against some investment in some real estate that has no real residential/commercial future.GoHarvOrGoHome wrote: ↑Aug 15, 2025What alderperson is going to have the courage to write up a bill instituting a moratorium on data center construction in the city limits?
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Classic StL. This is an untrue statement. But it’s passed off as an unassailable truth. When will St. Louisans choose to learn rather than loathe? It’s such an ugly look on us.mjbais1489 wrote: ↑Aug 15, 2025Not sure why a slow/no growth city would be against some investment in some real estate that has no real residential/commercial future.GoHarvOrGoHome wrote: ↑Aug 15, 2025What alderperson is going to have the courage to write up a bill instituting a moratorium on data center construction in the city limits?
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This is kind of where I'm at as well... we should figure out what positives we should get out of a data center getting built that would outweigh the negatives and then put that in writing somewhere. For example: any data center will require a full roof of solar panels, must have street trees surrounding the entire project, zero tax incentives, maybe the property tax is 1.5X, etc?mjbais1489 wrote: ↑Aug 15, 2025That would be bad. A data center would make sense on the north riverfront, along highway 70, south riverfront, a few other areas potentially. Not sure why a slow/no growth city would be against some investment in some real estate that has no real residential/commercial future.GoHarvOrGoHome wrote: ↑Aug 15, 2025What alderperson is going to have the courage to write up a bill instituting a moratorium on data center construction in the city limits?
This is what I would expect based on what information we have at this point. Oddly enough, also within a planned development district for Illinois Medical District.
https://medp.io/projects/
https://medp.io/projects/
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What jobs? There are temporary construction jobs but what are we left with full time? 1 plumber, 1 electrician, 1 hardware technician, and 1 custodian? Who else?
I would hate to see A/B, Sigma, P&G, etc. forgo future development in StL that actually employs people because the utilities are being gobbled up by a bunch of computers that want to make human labor obsolete.
^ a Job is a Job is a Job especially for a city that relies on earnings tax for part of its general fund & city services.. Passing them up whether it be in the teens or even a hundred or so for the larger data centers is meaningful. Not to mention property tax generation.
A/B, Sigma, P&G, etc. are all trying to figure out how to do more with automation and less with people... Don't think speculative hope is the answer to City future.
A/B, Sigma, P&G, etc. are all trying to figure out how to do more with automation and less with people... Don't think speculative hope is the answer to City future.
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I’m full of “speculative hope” while you’re being short sighted handing over valuable real estate and utility capacity to computers that don’t create meaningful local employment.
Do you have evidence that the strain these facilities put on infrastructure is overcome by the property tax revenue they generate? Will they even generate property taxes? Seems like they still get generous subsidies
Do you have evidence that the strain these facilities put on infrastructure is overcome by the property tax revenue they generate? Will they even generate property taxes? Seems like they still get generous subsidies
The jobs discussion for Data Centers is irrelevant. Of course the developer is going to tell you differently but review business journals and investor materials. The day-to-day maintenance will be automated within a decade. It will eventually be cheaper for companies to fly in the necessary technician to complete larger maintenance than to staff anyone at the facilities themselves.
These are the power substations of the 21st century. Eventually becoming lifeless voids of infrastructure that only produce value for those well outside of the region. Further, there is no competitive advantage to being closer to data centers. It doesn't ensure St. Louis competes or attracts talent.
These are the power substations of the 21st century. Eventually becoming lifeless voids of infrastructure that only produce value for those well outside of the region. Further, there is no competitive advantage to being closer to data centers. It doesn't ensure St. Louis competes or attracts talent.
100% Correct. AI and related infrastructure, like most industries with large amounts of liquid capital, are optimized to pump wealth out of local communities and into the hands of the transnational capitalist class. Yes, this sounds like a conspiracy, because it is, and they're actually very transparent about it if you know where to look.addxb2 wrote: ↑Aug 22, 2025The jobs discussion for Data Centers is irrelevant. Of course the developer is going to tell you differently but review business journals and investor materials. The day-to-day maintenance will be automated within a decade. It will eventually be cheaper for companies to fly in the necessary technician to complete larger maintenance than to staff anyone at the facilities themselves.
These are the power substations of the 21st century. Eventually becoming lifeless voids of infrastructure that only produce value for those well outside of the region. Further, there is no competitive advantage to being closer to data centers. It doesn't ensure St. Louis competes or attracts talent.
Ignore the "jobs!" "progress!" "the future!" marketing slop they feed to elected officials and the public and look at the investment materials and trade publications where they make this explicit.
It's too bad because I like that building, thought it looked pretty cool. But lots of homeless and drug activity around it, the environment around it is horrible, and there's just no real vision for fixing this area up at all. So it just rots, and eventually burns down I guess.
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Cool building. Interstate blight strikes. Letting buildings rot with zero action strikes. Interesting architecture continues to burn in our city. Only has happened 100 times on the north riverfront and patch.
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The former Jj’s nightclub spot was such a very popular spot for the LGBQT+ community so many fun memories were had there what a shame that the building couldn’t be saved & redeveloped
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I was wondering how bad the smoke looked over there, someone got it on video
Pour one out for when STL bar scene was fun and gritty. Not corporate putt putt bars.PlatinumBlues wrote: ↑Aug 27, 2025The former Jj’s nightclub spot was such a very popular spot for the LGBQT+ community so many fun memories were had there what a shame that the building couldn’t be saved & redeveloped
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And there was a new brewery opening every monthaddxb2 wrote: ↑Aug 28, 2025Pour one out for when STL bar scene was fun and gritty. Not corporate putt putt bars.PlatinumBlues wrote: ↑Aug 27, 2025The former Jj’s nightclub spot was such a very popular spot for the LGBQT+ community so many fun memories were had there what a shame that the building couldn’t be saved & redeveloped
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I think these fires will frequently continue until we stop allowing intersection begging. Between the trash they generate and the public funding their addiction, its a shame that a few are allowed to affect the whole.
Not sure if this rendering has ben posted before.
https://www.stlmag.com/news/aldermen-da ... =380210815
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https://www.stlmag.com/news/aldermen-da ... =380210815
Ew. Get lost Phil. No life. It’s better as a big empty lot.
If STL builds this, shut down MetroLink. STL doesn’t deserve it.
Notice how it’s at an angle as to take up THE ENTIRE AREA. Terrible.
If STL builds this, shut down MetroLink. STL doesn’t deserve it.
Notice how it’s at an angle as to take up THE ENTIRE AREA. Terrible.
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What an embarrassment. Really happy to see the alders in support of the moratorium, these things are a cancer.
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Is there a reason why they won’t just sell to another developer? It’s a large parcel with a rehabbed large building. There’s a chunk of change and move on
This is absolutely ridiculous for that location. Is Green Street trying to do this on a speculative basis or do they already have a user in tow?framer wrote: ↑Sep 12, 2025Not sure if this rendering has ben posted before.
https://www.stlmag.com/news/aldermen-da ... =380210815
Sunk cost fallacy?delmar2debaliviere2downtown wrote: ↑Sep 12, 2025Is there a reason why they won’t just sell to another developer? It’s a large parcel with a rehabbed large building. There’s a chunk of change and move on