I guess this is the one time I have to root against a St Louis Cardinal.gary kreie wrote:Hoping the Cardinals can give us a winner. And Redbirds too. Why do I have this nagging fear that the Cardinals will elect The Mets Pope in a walk-off.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
- 975
- 914
MLB announced a full partnership with the Athletes Unlimited Softball League today. They will continue their model of barnstorming this year, then the plan is to install 6 teams in the traditional city model next year. St. Louis absolutely should be reaching out, as baseball is king in this market among women and youth. The Sauget Ballpark could work right away, and there’s a lot of land and space around BPV that could make for a great long term plan. How great would it be to have a pro softball field and Busch right next to each other. I think the women’s sports leagues frenzy is a tad bit of a trend that won’t be as huge a draw and moneymaker consistently that is getting probably a little overblown in the media but I think these corresponding leagues such as this softball league, the women’s hockey league, the women’s soccer league will do well enough to make it worthwhile to pursue for the city. I would love to see StL, BPV, and Cardinals put their heads together and get a team in the inaugural season of the city model. They aren’t barnstorming in StL this year so that makes me worry StL is not involved at all at this point. I think the most successful league to start out would be St. Louis, OKC, Atlanta, Chicago, Dallas and New York.
- 1,793
The Cardinals are not a forward thinking franchise anymore. Doubtful they’re in the first group.
Cardinals are significantly more progressive than the Blues and a number of other MLB teams. They still do DEI month stuff, for example.JaneJacobsGhost wrote: ↑May 29, 2025The Cardinals are not a forward thinking franchise anymore. Doubtful they’re in the first group.
- 1,610
Point of contention, that's not necessarily "progressive" but is labelled as such by certain audiences.
- 914
Forget progressive politically. It would be more about the foresight of the people that could bring downtown and to BPV and how a partnership with the Cardinals would be good for all parties financially. St. Louis is the perfect place for this trial run.
- 1,793
That’s not the kind of progressive I mean. Cardinals were once a franchise at the forefront of change in MLB. They’ve been a follower franchise since Lunhow, Pujols and Larussa leftAuggie wrote: ↑May 29, 2025Cardinals are significantly more progressive than the Blues and a number of other MLB teams. They still do DEI month stuff, for example.JaneJacobsGhost wrote: ↑May 29, 2025The Cardinals are not a forward thinking franchise anymore. Doubtful they’re in the first group.
The Cards have been on a hot streak lately. Nine games over 500, and only 2 1/2 out of first. Would be nice to see attendance pick up as well.
- 1,793
I’ve attended more games this season than I have in a long time. Management/ownership burned up a ton of goodwill with the fans over the last decade. It’s going to take more than a couple of hot streaks from a mediocre roster to win fans over.
- 9,529
mediocre roster doesn't go 33-19 (.635 win %) in the last 52
- 1,793
Sure it can. Just like it went 11-19 from 3/31 to 5/2
Swept without scoring a single run against one of the worst teams in the league.
- 975
It doesn’t make any sense to judge them based on 3 games when we have 88 total games to judge them on this year. They aren’t a mediocre team and they’ve got future upside because of young talent. They are right in the hunt for a playoff spot even though they have the 5th hardest strength of schedule played thus far.JaneJacobsGhost wrote:Swept without scoring a single run against one of the worst teams in the league.
- 1,793
I’m not judging them on 3 games. I’m judging them on their body of work and the overall collection of talent.
There is likely not a 5-win position player on the roster. There may not even be a 4-win position player on the roster.
Gray and Liberatore have been everything you could ask for but the SP gets bleak pretty quickly after that (and Liberatore has started to hit a wall). A 3/4/5 of Pallante, Fedde and Mikolas is among the worst in the league.
This has been the most fun season since 2022. The team is exceeding expectations and is about to have its highest draft pick in almost 30 years.
But let’s not lose sight of the fact that this team was pegged as mediocre at best with significant downside potential, and nothing about the performance or composition of the roster suggests those projections were far wide of the mark.
There is likely not a 5-win position player on the roster. There may not even be a 4-win position player on the roster.
Gray and Liberatore have been everything you could ask for but the SP gets bleak pretty quickly after that (and Liberatore has started to hit a wall). A 3/4/5 of Pallante, Fedde and Mikolas is among the worst in the league.
This has been the most fun season since 2022. The team is exceeding expectations and is about to have its highest draft pick in almost 30 years.
But let’s not lose sight of the fact that this team was pegged as mediocre at best with significant downside potential, and nothing about the performance or composition of the roster suggests those projections were far wide of the mark.
- 975
I’m not sure what a 5 win or 4 win position player refers to, but if you look at the total picture on the season thus far, the Cardinals have a top 10 offense in all of baseball and their pitching is slightly above average. They allow a fair amount of hits, but give up very few walks or home runs.JaneJacobsGhost wrote:I’m not judging them on 3 games. I’m judging them on their body of work and the overall collection of talent.
There is likely not a 5-win position player on the roster. There may not even be a 4-win position player on the roster.
Gray and Liberatore have been everything you could ask for but the SP gets bleak pretty quickly after that (and Liberatore has started to hit a wall). A 3/4/5 of Pallante, Fedde and Mikolas is among the worst in the league.
This has been the most fun season since 2022. The team is exceeding expectations and is about to have its highest draft pick in almost 30 years.
But let’s not lose sight of the fact that this team was pegged as mediocre at best with significant downside potential, and nothing about the performance or composition of the roster suggests those projections were far wide of the mark.
Given this, it should be no surprise they are 6 games above 500.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
A truly good team doesn't get swept by one of the worst teams in the league while scoring 0 runs across 27 innings.
It's just a prerequisite to being considered good. Losing the series? Sure. Maybe even getting swept? Sure. Getting swept + shut out? It's just not something a good team does.
It's just a prerequisite to being considered good. Losing the series? Sure. Maybe even getting swept? Sure. Getting swept + shut out? It's just not something a good team does.
- 975
If you think saying a team isn’t good by looking at 3 games in a 162 game season makes any sense, you don’t know baseball.
Many of the top teams in the league have gone on longer losing streaks with more lopsided results.
Many of the top teams in the league have gone on longer losing streaks with more lopsided results.
- 1,793
It’s a reference to the statistic Wins Above Replacement (aka WAR) as published by Fangraphs.Debaliviere91 wrote: ↑Jul 02, 2025I’m not sure what a 5 win or 4 win position player refers to, but if you look at the total picture on the season thus far, the Cardinals have a top 10 offense in all of baseball and their pitching is slightly above average. They allow a fair amount of hits, but give up very few walks or home runs.JaneJacobsGhost wrote:I’m not judging them on 3 games. I’m judging them on their body of work and the overall collection of talent.
There is likely not a 5-win position player on the roster. There may not even be a 4-win position player on the roster.
Gray and Liberatore have been everything you could ask for but the SP gets bleak pretty quickly after that (and Liberatore has started to hit a wall). A 3/4/5 of Pallante, Fedde and Mikolas is among the worst in the league.
This has been the most fun season since 2022. The team is exceeding expectations and is about to have its highest draft pick in almost 30 years.
But let’s not lose sight of the fact that this team was pegged as mediocre at best with significant downside potential, and nothing about the performance or composition of the roster suggests those projections were far wide of the mark.
Given this, it should be no surprise they are 6 games above 500.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
The offense is average to slightly above as you say but the pitching is not above average.
The offense is 13th in wRC+ and 15th wOBA.
The pitching staff is 17th in ERA, 14th in xFIP, and 20th in SIERA.
- 975
Oh I see. I’ve never seen WAR described in that way. Donovan, Gray and Scott will probably finish above a 4 WAR. A 5 WAR player is a top 50 player in the league. Our roster isn’t built like that and that’s ok. Our talent is less reliant on superstars and more spread out.JaneJacobsGhost wrote:It’s a reference to the statistic Wins Above Replacement (aka WAR) as published by Fangraphs.Debaliviere91 wrote: ↑Jul 02, 2025I’m not sure what a 5 win or 4 win position player refers to, but if you look at the total picture on the season thus far, the Cardinals have a top 10 offense in all of baseball and their pitching is slightly above average. They allow a fair amount of hits, but give up very few walks or home runs.JaneJacobsGhost wrote:I’m not judging them on 3 games. I’m judging them on their body of work and the overall collection of talent.
There is likely not a 5-win position player on the roster. There may not even be a 4-win position player on the roster.
Gray and Liberatore have been everything you could ask for but the SP gets bleak pretty quickly after that (and Liberatore has started to hit a wall). A 3/4/5 of Pallante, Fedde and Mikolas is among the worst in the league.
This has been the most fun season since 2022. The team is exceeding expectations and is about to have its highest draft pick in almost 30 years.
But let’s not lose sight of the fact that this team was pegged as mediocre at best with significant downside potential, and nothing about the performance or composition of the roster suggests those projections were far wide of the mark.
Given this, it should be no surprise they are 6 games above 500.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
The offense is average to slightly above as you say but the pitching is not above average.
The offense is 13th in wRC+ and 15th wOBA.
The pitching staff is 17th in ERA, 14th in xFIP, and 20th in SIERA.
I didn’t say the offense was average, I said it was top 10 and they rank in the top 10 in baseball in Runs Scored, Hits (4th!), RBIs, fewest strikeouts, Batting Average, and OBP.
Their pitching is average based on team rankings when factoring in ERA, Runs Allowed, HR’s allowed (3rd fewest), Walks allowed (5th fewest), and WHIP.
A top 10 offense and average pitching against a tough schedule thus far.
- 1,793
It’s not about what you’ve done for me today, it’s what can I expect out of you tomorrow. And as nice as it is to see that we are doing well in a number of counting stats as a team, that’s not what I (or anyone in any front office in MLB) is relying on to predict where we will be at the end of the season.
- 975
But the stats I’ve shared above don’t represent today, they represent the first 3 months of the season.JaneJacobsGhost wrote:It’s not about what you’ve done for me today, it’s what can I expect out of you tomorrow. And as nice as it is to see that we are doing well in a number of counting stats as a team, that’s not what I (or anyone in any front office in MLB) is relying on to predict where we will be at the end of the season.
I’m fairly certain front offices do consider the first half of the season when trying to predict the 2nd half. That’s pretty basic.
Vegas has us projected to win like 86 games currently. Pretty good to me.
The Cardinals are barely hanging onto a playoff spot right now, thanks in large part to a 9 game winning streak. They aren't bad, but they also aren't good. Much like last season.Debaliviere91 wrote: ↑Jul 02, 2025If you think saying a team isn’t good by looking at 3 games in a 162 game season makes any sense, you don’t know baseball.
Many of the top teams in the league have gone on longer losing streaks with more lopsided results.
I don't know for sure, but you'd be hard pressed to find another playoff team who has been shut out 3 games in a row by one of the worst teams in the league.
- 1,793
Angels blanked the Yankees in three straight in June. Padres did it to the Rockies. Those are the only examples of three consecutive shutouts I can find this season.
- 975
You are both a fixating on one very specific outcome of a 3 game set that doesn’t necessarily correlate to a team being good or bad over a 162 game series. You are being very reactionary.
Of the top 10 teams in baseball:
Yankees lost 6 in a row to sub .500 teams and got shut out 3 in a row.
Blue Jays lost 8 of 9. They also got swept in a series and gave up 19 runs while scoring 2.
Rays lost 5 in a row to sub .500 teams.
Phils lost 9 of 10 including a sweep from the Pirates.
Brewers started off the season losing 4 in a row by a margin of 47 to 15.
The Mets lost 10 of 11 and played the Pirates before us and lost by a margin of 30 to 4. That’s far worse than we fared vs the Buccos.
Of the top 10 teams in baseball:
Yankees lost 6 in a row to sub .500 teams and got shut out 3 in a row.
Blue Jays lost 8 of 9. They also got swept in a series and gave up 19 runs while scoring 2.
Rays lost 5 in a row to sub .500 teams.
Phils lost 9 of 10 including a sweep from the Pirates.
Brewers started off the season losing 4 in a row by a margin of 47 to 15.
The Mets lost 10 of 11 and played the Pirates before us and lost by a margin of 30 to 4. That’s far worse than we fared vs the Buccos.