urbanSTL

Not sure if this is the right thread, but WellBridge Athletic Club inside the Centene building announced this morning they are closing April 15th…pretty big loss for the area imo. Will be interested to see what happens to the space.


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Longtime Centene CEO Michael Neidorff dies

https://www.stltoday.com/business/local ... 5ae1b.html


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Hmmm.  https://www.stltoday.com/business/local ... -top-story

London said the company is beginning a long-term effort to consolidate its IT structure. Much of Centene's growth has come through acquiring other companies, but that has left it with a variety of different software and applications, London said.

She also reiterated the company's intention to increase hybrid and remote work options in an effort to attract and retain employees. She said she anticipates "a significant downsizing of our current leased space," but did not go into specifics.

Sounds like this will impact more of their satellite locations (e.g., the leased space in the county like along I64), but also should really temper any expectations of future phases being built in Clayton. If they're in downsizing mode, hopefully they'll sell the land where the future phases were to supposed to go to someone who will build on it.

sc4mayor wrote: ↑

Apr 26, 2022

I don’t see much of an issue for St. Louis here at all.  Most of their newest tower is already leased by other companies anyway, and I think their 270/Manchester building has already been put up for sublease.

I’d have much, much greater concerns if had given the handouts that NC and Charlotte gave them…

Just make them give up their land holdings in Clayton already.

leased space- not company owned space.   Leased like the space in Chesterfield or in City at highlands 

sc4mayor wrote: ↑

Apr 26, 2022

The company owned space in Manchester has supposedly been put up for sublease…and they lease out quite a bit of company owned space in Clayton already.

If I’m the state that gave them north of $400 million for the promise of 6,000 jobs I’d be a little concerned. California is already clawing back incentives since they’re not meeting job targets out there and now with a potential downsizing of space (leased or not) and a new hybrid work plan, I’m guessing NC isn’t going to end up with what they were promised either.

I’m under the impression NC already isn’t going as planned.

^They're shifting to a  more work from home model. (Apparently my spare bedroom is adequate even with the lackluster security and incessant noise pollution.)

Almost all Centene employees WFH for now on. The building is almost empty of Centene employees and they are leasing more and more space out to other companies.

^Yep. Of course, when your new office is in the same co-working space as a musician you get a soundtrack free of charge. (And often not a terribly polished one.) And there's about zero chance I'm going to upgrade the security on the spare bedroom. But the rent on WFH is hard to beat, so I guess it's worth it.

Centene has purchased the Ritz Carlton. I have to think that's a good sign for STL.

Oh.

Seems Centene will lose all its tax incentives. Giving up $75 million ok incentives to save $100 million construction of the auditorium.

Hopefully this will free up the lots around the Forsyth metro for development.

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NHampton wrote: ↑

Jun 17, 2022

Seems Centene will lose all its tax incentives. Giving up $75 million ok incentives to save $100 million construction of the auditorium.

Hopefully this will free up the lots around the Forsyth metro for development.

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I've been so incredibly frustrated by this for YEARS. It's maddening what they got away with. And the city of Clayton just simply doesn't care. They shrug it off, even though there very plainly were terms set in stone...I can just sense all the inaction to come here. 

StlToday - Centene kills plans for civic center in Clayton 'regardless of any incentives'

https://www.stltoday.com/business/local ... 54f2c.html

SRQ2STL wrote: ↑

Jun 17, 2022

I've been so incredibly frustrated by this for YEARS. It's maddening what they got away with. And the city of Clayton just simply doesn't care. They shrug it off, even though there very plainly were terms set in stone...I can just sense all the inaction to come here. 

Yeah, it's deeply frustrating, but I'm not sure what Clayton could really do. The terms are, as you say, set in stone. And those include the money that Centene will forfeit for not finishing the theatre. The difference isn't enormous percentage wise, but with numbers that big it's still a lot of money: $25M apparently. I suppose London  and company looked at the numbers and decided Centene didn't really need a theatre at that price. Even a 75% off de-luxe theatre. And honestly, I think I'm okay with that. I love theatres, but we have tons and every time you build a new one there's a risk of losing an old one. In the end, I think I'd rather see Centene invest that money into existing institutions. And this will probably come out fine, as I expect they'll sell the land and someone else will do something with it. They're in the middle of a big reorganization. I expect we'll see them unloading superfluous holdings shortly. They're not going to keep paying taxes on grass they don't need. (I honestly expect them to sell the hotel too . . . albeit with an agreement that they can rent rooms in certain numbers at a discounted rate.)

Honestly, I think it's all for the best. Clayton gets 75 mil in tax revenue. And we avoid more 1990s "urban planning" of lifeless street walls. Centene proved you can get variances for these parcels. Now bring that corner adjacent to Forsyth station what it deserves...... 3 high-rise, class A residential towers. 

^ no, Clayton cannot get money back that never existed. The incentive is derived from the building being built and the Incentive for Centene is not having to pay property taxes on it

^Did I read it wrong? It sounded like they will have to pay some extra taxes even just on the previous few years. (And more going forward as well.) I presume Centene will end up paying on all those parcels at least until they sell them and someone else pays instead. And maybe they also got some of the taxes abated on the parcels built?

Really don't understand the nuances on the tax deals that Centene got as yes on your not going to gain any taxes on a building that is not built.  What I don't understand fully is if Centene is giving up some of the tax credits on what is already built?  In other words, did Centene have to build out the full plan to get the full benefit tax credits on what was built?  Probably some truth in both.    

But the comment I can agree 100% with is symphonicpoet that the region is probably better off without another theater and those dollars going towards existing institutions.  My first two thoughts, fund relocation of a house behind Powell Hall and then reach out Black Rep Theater as I believe they are losing out of some rehearsal & practice space with Crescent city electric move in a Wash U buyout (if I got it right.)    I can think of a big lovely building that make some interesting studio and rehearsal space with imagination, a mover and a tenant   

^I like the way you think. Though I do think it will matter who owns/runs the house, should something like this come to pass. Black Rep might possibly have some hard feelings, given just how many major institutions have kicked them out of so many different venues of late. I think someone needs to just hand them the keys to the kingdom and a big enough endowment to keep the kingdom going in perpetuity. They're a pretty special institution and I get the feeling they've been ill served by our philanthropic community for some reason. Could be a good cause for WWT to adopt.

dbInSouthCity wrote: ↑

Jun 19, 2022

^ no, Clayton cannot get money back that never existed. The incentive is derived from the building being built and the Incentive for Centene is not having to pay property  taxes on it

Just read down to the park about the tax breaks being so far $160k. Is there anywhere reported/figured out how much in taxes Clayton will actually gain from what remains? 

Wow skyrocketing crime in Clayton kills another development!