Sansone group is looking to bring Amazon Fresh to a mostly vacant Sunset Hills strip mall. Specifically, the box left by Toys R Us.  Apologies for the paywall.

https://www.bizjournals.com/stlouis/new ... hills.html

I thought it was time for a dedicated grocery store thread because it seems grocery store discussion litters threads throughout the board. A central location for discussion seems useful. 

^Good idea. People like speculating about grocery stores because it's about the only brick-and-mortar retail that is thriving. That, and grocery stores bring activity all day long. Activity promotes other retail.

Amazon Fresh does like converting vacant big box stores rather than building new. They certainly will have plenty from which to choose.  A couple of their Chicago and California stores are in former Toys R Us stores, so the rumor makes sense.

Schnucks closing another former Shop N Save location. This time Shrewsbury. not even three years since the Schucks purchase of Shop N Save, 9 of the 19 stores have been closed.  

https://www.supermarketnews.com/retail- ... save-store

This is a serious problem that regional leaders need to address. The Grocery market in StL desperately needs more competition.

BellaVilla wrote: ↑

Jun 12, 2021

Schnucks closing another former Shop N Save location. This time Shrewsbury. not even three years since the Schucks purchase of Shop N Save, 9 of the 19 stores have been closed. This time it's Shrewsbury. 

https://www.supermarketnews.com/retail- ... save-store

This is a serious problem that regional leaders need to address. The Grocery market in StL desperately needs more competition.

There's a Dierberg's in the neighboring strip mall. There's an Aldi in the one after that. There's a Wal-Mart in the one after that. There's also another Schnucks a mile and a half away at Hampton & Chippewa. You also have the rise of grocery delivery services like Instacart and Amazon Prime.

wabash wrote: ↑

Jun 12, 2021

BellaVilla wrote: ↑

Jun 12, 2021

Schnucks closing another former Shop N Save location. This time Shrewsbury. not even three years since the Schucks purchase of Shop N Save, 9 of the 19 stores have been closed. This time it's Shrewsbury. 

https://www.supermarketnews.com/retail- ... save-store

This is a serious problem that regional leaders need to address. The Grocery market in StL desperately needs more competition.

There's a Dierberg's in the neighboring strip mall. There's an Aldi in the one after that. There's a Wal-Mart in the one after that. There's also another Schnucks a mile and a half away at Hampton & Chippewa. You also have the rise of grocery delivery services like Instacart and Amazon Prime.

And yet we continue to pay far more than we should for groceries

Commodities from food to metal are soaring
Source: Bloomberg April 30 2021
JPMorgan Chase & Co. said this week it sees a continued rally in commodities and that the “reflation and reopening trade will continue.”  On top of that, the Federal Reserve and other central banks seem calm about inflation, meaning economies could be left to run hot, which will rev up demand even more.
China, a crucial source of supply and demand for raw materials, is playing a big role, particularly as the government tries to reduce production of key metals like steel and aluminum. It’s also buying up massive amounts of grains. Food prices are also being affected as poor weather in key growing nations like Brazil and France hits harvests.
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-05-01/the-price-of-the-stuff-that-makes-everything-is-surging

I don't think instacart and amazon prime are moving the needle much for the roughly 1/3 of city residents without quality internet access. 

Schnucks and Dierbergs have monopolized the St. Louis grocery market for a long long time. i'm all for supporting local businesses, but their monopoly allows them to charge higher prices for limited options (even today, few of their stores offer decent vegetarian and vegan options) and, IMO, a comparatively unenjoyable shopping experience.

I'm not buying that - St. Louis has Aldi's, Trader Joe's, Whole Foods, Fresh Thyme, Fields Food, Straubs, plus your other big box options like Target & Walmart. Are Schnucks and Dierbergs the most prevalent? Sure, but there's a ton of variety.

Laife Fulk wrote: ↑

Jun 14, 2021

I'm not buying that - St. Louis has Aldi's, Trader Joe's, Whole Foods, Fresh Thyme, Fields Food, Straubs, plus your other big box options like Target & Walmart. Are Schnucks and Dierbergs the most prevalent? Sure, but there's a ton of variety.

Ruler Foods, Sav A Lot and Costco can be added to the list. A lot of options out there.

St. Louis is no different than any other major market when it comes to grocery. At least the two chains that dominate the business are locally owned where most major cities have their flagship brands owned by national monsters like Kroger, Publix or Safeway. 

Laife Fulk wrote: ↑

Jun 14, 2021

I'm not buying that - St. Louis has Aldi's, Trader Joe's, Whole Foods, Fresh Thyme, Fields Food, Straubs, plus your other big box options like Target & Walmart. Are Schnucks and Dierbergs the most prevalent? Sure, but there's a ton of variety.

but some of those are exclusively located in the suburbs and most have comparatively few locations. In terms of full-service supermarkets with locations across the city, St. Louis has Schnucks and that's it. Fields Foods is trying to expand, so that's good, but not sure how well that's going for them.

i've lived in a couple of smaller cities where the grocery options are quite a bit more diverse.

urban_dilettante wrote: ↑

Jun 14, 2021

Laife Fulk wrote: ↑

Jun 14, 2021

I'm not buying that - St. Louis has Aldi's, Trader Joe's, Whole Foods, Fresh Thyme, Fields Food, Straubs, plus your other big box options like Target & Walmart. Are Schnucks and Dierbergs the most prevalent? Sure, but there's a ton of variety.

but some of those are exclusively located in the suburbs and most have comparatively few locations. In terms of full-service supermarkets with locations across the city, St. Louis has Schnucks and that's it. Fields Foods is trying to expand, so that's good, but not sure how well that's going for them.

i've lived in a couple of smaller cities where the grocery options are quite a bit more diverse.

Well, the "Field's Foods" is oxymoronic, at least considering its Delmar location. That place is nothing but a convenience store and is the reason I chose not to consider living at the Lofts@Euclid

urban_dilettante wrote: ↑

Jun 14, 2021

Laife Fulk wrote: ↑

Jun 14, 2021

I'm not buying that - St. Louis has Aldi's, Trader Joe's, Whole Foods, Fresh Thyme, Fields Food, Straubs, plus your other big box options like Target & Walmart. Are Schnucks and Dierbergs the most prevalent? Sure, but there's a ton of variety.

but some of those are exclusively located in the suburbs and most have comparatively few locations. In terms of full-service supermarkets with locations across the city, St. Louis has Schnucks and that's it. Fields Foods is trying to expand, so that's good, but not sure how well that's going for them.

I'd add Sav A Lot to that list. 

Well that’s not the same as Schnucks or Dierbergs having some kind of monopoly. That’s just another symptom of the city needing to turn around the population losses.

wabash wrote: ↑

Jun 15, 2021

urban_dilettante wrote: ↑

Jun 14, 2021

Laife Fulk wrote: ↑

Jun 14, 2021

I'm not buying that - St. Louis has Aldi's, Trader Joe's, Whole Foods, Fresh Thyme, Fields Food, Straubs, plus your other big box options like Target & Walmart. Are Schnucks and Dierbergs the most prevalent? Sure, but there's a ton of variety.

but some of those are exclusively located in the suburbs and most have comparatively few locations. In terms of full-service supermarkets with locations across the city, St. Louis has Schnucks and that's it. Fields Foods is trying to expand, so that's good, but not sure how well that's going for them.

I'd add Sav A Lot to that list. 

i'm not very familiar with Sav A Lot, but i generally think of them as somewhere between Aldi's and Shop N Save. do they have bakeries? meat and seafood counters? full stock of fresh produce?

The StL area with the most competition is near the farty/170 interchange. There’s a Straubs, 4 Schnucks, Dierbergs, Aldi, Walmart, Target, Sams, Trader Joe’s, Whole Foods within roughly 2 miles.

urban_dilettante wrote: ↑

Jun 15, 2021

Laife Fulk wrote: ↑

Jun 15, 2021

Well that’s not the same as Schnucks or Dierbergs having some kind of monopoly. That’s just another symptom of the city needing to turn around the population losses.

maybe. but, again, i've lived in two cities with less than a third the population of St. Louis City that have significantly more supermarket diversity. one was Boulder, CO, and the other is a small Mid Atlantic city.

As Moorlander points out, there are areas with a ton of competition. The city does have an example of this as well in the CWE where there’s a Whole Foods, Schnucks, and Straubs close to each other. But if we want to focus on specific areas like north StL where there are food deserts, then we can’t just compare those neighborhoods to Boulder or some mid Atlantic city.

Laife Fulk wrote: ↑

Jun 15, 2021

urban_dilettante wrote: ↑

Jun 15, 2021

Laife Fulk wrote: ↑

Jun 15, 2021

Well that’s not the same as Schnucks or Dierbergs having some kind of monopoly. That’s just another symptom of the city needing to turn around the population losses.

maybe. but, again, i've lived in two cities with less than a third the population of St. Louis City that have significantly more supermarket diversity. one was Boulder, CO, and the other is a small Mid Atlantic city.

As Moorlander points out, there are areas with a ton of competition. The city does have an example of this as well in the CWE where there’s a Whole Foods, Schnucks, and Straubs close to each other. But if we want to focus on specific areas like north StL where there are food deserts, then we can’t just compare those neighborhoods to Boulder or some mid Atlantic city.

The CWE is a good example of no competition for Schnucks. Schnucks and Straubs/Whole Foods are not competing for the same customers.

And there’s an Aldi a few blocks north on Kingshighway…

My main point here is that 1) as a region there are a lot of options other than Schnucks or Dierbergs and 2) if there is a desire to bring in other chains into the city and (I assume) ideally have them open locations outside of the central corridor, then the city needs to focus on gaining residents to increase demand.

Smaller footprint full service stores dot Chicagoland and keep prices much more competitive than St. Louis.  Meats and fresh vegetables are much cheaper due to the small indy stores.  Staple items are also less than STL overall by 10-15% in my estimation.  Always aggressive sales/discounts/promotions due to the competition which I really don't see much in STL.  I'd say overall my cost is between 15-20% higher in STL.   

Laife Fulk wrote: ↑

Jun 15, 2021

And there’s an Aldi a few blocks north on Kingshighway…

My main point here is that 1) as a region there are a lot of options other than Schnucks or Dierbergs and 2) if there is a desire to bring in other chains into the city and (I assume) ideally have them open locations outside of the central corridor, then the city needs to focus on gaining residents to increase demand.

okay, but it's a big region. having to drive from one end to the other to access variety isn't ideal and probably doesn't do much to moderate prices (at least it seems that way when i shop at the Fenton Dierbergs—yikes!). there's little diversity in the city, and therefor little competition among grocers to keep prices competitive. regarding the bold part, the two cities that i mentioned demonstrate that diversity is not proportional to population size. St. Louis has a larger population than both of them, yet they each have more supermarket chains than St. Louis.

P.S. call me old-fashioned, but i don't buy groceries at Walmart, Target, or Sams. and none of them are full-service supermarkets.

P.P.S. i'm proud of Schnucks and Dierbergs and i want them to be successful. i have fond memories of my parents taking me to the Schnucks Station House Restaurant at Hampton and Gravois for Sunday brunch when i was a kid. but i also think the lack of competition in the region has made them lazy. i wish they would focus less on expanding locations and more on expanding their stock and making their existing stores pleasant.