Black Wall Street St. Louis

quincunx · PostAug 03, 2020#12020-08-03T17:43+00:00

Stl Public Radio - Black Entrepreneurs Plan To Purchase North St. Louis Land For Black-Owned Businesses

Black Wall Street STL sent an application earlier this month to the LRA to purchase more than eight city blocks. LRA officials said the application will be discussed at the organization's August committee meeting.

https://news.stlpublicradio.org/2020-08 ... businesses

https://www.facebook.com/blackwallstreetstlouis/
https://blackwallstreetusa.wixsite.com/

courtland · PostAug 03, 2020#22020-08-03T19:08+00:00

^ It's a start!

SeattleNative · PostAug 03, 2020#32020-08-03T20:14+00:00

Hopefully SLDC helps them with this. Would go a long way in realizing the new equitable development framework.

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GoHarvOrGoHome · PostAug 04, 2020#42020-08-04T14:15+00:00

Something like the North Sarah project would be fantastic. Live/Work semi retail spaces need to be incorporated into every urban low income project moving forward.

flipz · PostAug 04, 2020#52020-08-04T14:22+00:00

I like the initiative and hopefully something comes of it but I think it is misguided to to just bring in black businesses and residents. We're in this situation largely due to segregation.

framer · PostAug 04, 2020#62020-08-04T14:37+00:00

^Yeah, I have some concerns too. I'm not familiar with the Black Wall Street movement; maybe someone could fill me in.

Do they intend to exclude people based on the color of their skin? Is that even legal? Won't they be cutting themselves off from various government assistance programs that specifically prohibit race-based restrictions? What if, say, an Arab-American business wanted to build a gas station/convenience store on one of their lots. Could they refuse to sell or lease to them because of their ethnicity?

Isn't this in effect a return to the outdated segregationist policies that we've spent decades trying to eliminate?

sc4mayor · PostAug 04, 2020#72020-08-04T16:55+00:00

^ The term Black Wall Street is in reference to Tulsa's Greenwood District which at one point was a wealthy, thriving African-American neighborhood nicknamed "Black Wall Street" because of the concentration of Black wealth there. Then whites came in and destroyed it, literally burnt it to the ground.

I don't believe there will be a concerted effort here to force "segregation" in this plan as some are suggesting here. But there aren't exactly a ton of white folks chomping at the bit to rebuild North St. Louis either. It's not this group's fault that whites fled and then purposely segregated themselves from North St. Louis.

What I'd like to see is some of those in the St. Louis power structure (cough, Centene, cough) who want to see this city become a better place for all financially back this program in some way. Help with rehabs, small business loans, financing new construction, maybe even some infrastructure repair.

The idea is to center this around the intersection of Carter and Grove streets which I think is a good place. The old Eliot School is right there and could be used as a small startup or business hub, maybe a cross between something like Delmar Divine and T-Rex. This intersection isn't far from Grand Boulevard or it's landmark water tower. Lots of vacancy, but also some decent building stock left too. Carter and Grove is also one of those St. Louis intersections with a goofy geometry. A statue of a prominent Black St. Louisan in the center, like a small traffic circle, would be cool too.

gone corporate · PostAug 05, 2020#82020-08-05T17:01+00:00

As a white Wall Street-type guy, I wish them Godspeed and all the support possible. Concurrently, I highly doubt the fears posted above that this group would or could avidly exclude participants who are not black. For example, I don't think they'd look to exclude Piekutowski's Sausage, which is two blocks south of their hub at Carter & Grove, from the scene they're building simply because they're Polish, i.e. non-black. The example given above of a potential Arab investor wanting to come in, buy, and built? That's exactly the capitalism I would think they hope for, wanting to take land considered nearly worthless or even a liability and making it worth something more in a tangible way.

Achieving economic self-determination from independent, entrepreneurial ventures is the best path forward for change.

MattnSTL · PostAug 06, 2020#92020-08-06T02:39+00:00

That's a bad example. I would hope they'd say no to a gas station no matter the owner. That's not what anyone needs if the goal of this project is to rebuild the community and build community wealth.

framer · PostAug 06, 2020#102020-08-06T04:25+00:00

^Yeah, I knew as I posted it that a gas station isn't ideal. I just used it as a realistic example of what might be proposed in the area. I'm mostly curious about how and to what extant the developers plan to focus the demographics.

dbInSouthCity · PostAug 06, 2020#112020-08-06T12:39+00:00

framer wrote: ↑
Aug 06, 2020
^Yeah, I knew as I posted it that a gas station isn't ideal. I just used it as a realistic example of what might be proposed in the area. I'm mostly curious about how and to what extant the developers plan to focus the demographics.

This area has been “open” for development for what? the last 20 years? And white, Asian, Arab and even black developers have been shy about jumping in and now this group of AAs decides to do something about it and all the sudden white and other developers will appear from the woodwork? Doubt it and if they did I’d question their motive, since as I said where have they been for the last 20 years

Black02AltimaSE · PostAug 06, 2020#122020-08-06T13:00+00:00

^I think they may be trying to take advantage of current events. The whole idea of Black Wall Street became a talking point after Tulsa was depicted in Watchmen on HBO and a lot of people realized they had never heard of it in their history classes. Secondly, there has been a sustained BLM movement over the past couple of months. You might be right and this won't make a difference, but there is definitely a little bit more momentum in their favor now than at most points in the last 20 years.

flipz · PostAug 06, 2020#132020-08-06T13:23+00:00

dbInSouthCity wrote: ↑
Aug 06, 2020
framer wrote: ↑
Aug 06, 2020
^Yeah, I knew as I posted it that a gas station isn't ideal. I just used it as a realistic example of what might be proposed in the area. I'm mostly curious about how and to what extant the developers plan to focus the demographics.
This area has been “open” for development for what? the last 20 years? And white, Asian, Arab and even black developers have been shy about jumping in and now this group of AAs decides to do something about it and all the sudden white and other developers will appear from the woodwork? Doubt it and if they did I’d question their motive, since as I said where have they been for the last 20 years

That's a terrible excuse to exclude someone. This project seems to be geared towards small businesses and not developers. I get that they are trying to promote black businesses and that is great. We need more leadership like this as small business is the way to move up in social class IMO. There is an issue with the naming though. It sounds exclusive and nowhere in the article was it mentioned that all small businesses are welcome. I would think that during these divisive times the leadership would at least mention something about it.

dbInSouthCity · PostAug 06, 2020#142020-08-06T14:00+00:00

^ there is nothing in my post to excuses anything. North city is open for any small or large business right now for anyone. Only people that complain about the name of this group are the same ones that get hot and bothered during the month of February each year

flipz · PostAug 06, 2020#152020-08-06T14:58+00:00

dbInSouthCity wrote: ↑
Aug 06, 2020
^ there is nothing in my post to excuses anything. North city is open for any small or large business right now for anyone. Only people that complain about the name of this group are the same ones that get hot and bothered during the month of February each year

Stop projecting. Your excuse for exclusion was that there has been plenty of time for others to do something and somehow this makes it acceptable. A terrible, illogical argument. People want to be part of diverse neighborhoods and we should encourage that.

sc4mayor · PostAug 06, 2020#162020-08-06T15:07+00:00

^ They’re not excluding anyone though. The only place I’ve seen anyone mention only Black folks could open up a business here are people on UrbanSTL, and I’m guessing none of us are directly involved in this. No one else, including the organizers are making those claims.

This is a nascent effort that is just getting off the ground. Let’s cool it with the talk of segregation lol.

And for what it’s worth DB is right. The North Side has been open for anyone to come in and develop. Look what it’s gotten us so far. If a group of Black business owners and community members want to purchase a few blocks worth of abandoned buildings and vacant lots to try and start a new business district in THEIR community...they have every right to do so. I have no doubt they will entertain offers from anyone who wants to participate as well.

dbInSouthCity · PostAug 06, 2020#172020-08-06T18:30+00:00

flipz wrote: ↑
Aug 06, 2020
dbInSouthCity wrote: ↑
Aug 06, 2020
^ there is nothing in my post to excuses anything. North city is open for any small or large business right now for anyone. Only people that complain about the name of this group are the same ones that get hot and bothered during the month of February each year
Stop projecting. Your excuse for exclusion was that there has been plenty of time for others to do something and somehow this makes it acceptable. A terrible, illogical argument. People want to be part of diverse neighborhoods and we should encourage that.

One more time- anybody regardless of skin color or national origin can open a business in north city. This particular group is focusing on growing black businesses, which are by any objective measure at a disadvantage at getting loans, funding, investments etc. what’s the issue?

aprice · PostAug 06, 2020#182020-08-06T19:35+00:00

I didn't think this needed to be reiterated but nothing about db's post read as exclusionary. This "black only" assumption is extremely out of touch with North St. Louis IMO

symphonicpoet · PostAug 07, 2020#192020-08-07T09:02+00:00

Thank you SC4 and APrice for stepping in to defend DB and dial back the rhetoric.

gone corporate · PostAug 07, 2020#202020-08-07T17:53+00:00

^Speaking of rhetoric, all this conversation has definitely veered off-topic.

/rant/
IDGAF about these subjective thoughts on potentialities that rely on points of view not backed up by known facts but strictly upon conjecture. I do very much GAF on seeing economic turnaround and furthering entrepreneurs who are doing things for themselves, especially recognizing and furthering those who are historically economically disenfranchised coming together to increase total output and regional quality of life.

What should we be talking about here? Personally, I want to know what I can do to help...

Does anyone have any knowledge on what they are seeking for mentorship, capital, or marketing?
Who here can volunteer?
Are any products or services currently being promoted that directly tie into this?

So can we stop worrying about potential optics of theoretical Arabian investors investing in businesses proximate to the conceptualized Black Wall Street STL? This whole thing is about uplift of those that need it, in a neighborhood that can use it, all while no one else has done squat. I'd much rather learn about how I can throw some equity at this, sweat or otherwise, than proselytize on new political correctness standards.

Eyes on the prize, y'all.
//rant//

So... How do we start to help? What do they need, and what can we do?

quincunx · PostAug 07, 2020#212020-08-07T18:30+00:00

A reduction to the barriers to entry would be good area to examine. Zoning, parking mins, permits, fees, etc

There was a forum at some place on Cherokee street a few years ago wherein some small business people ripped into the frustrations they go through with the city. I can't find the reportage on that. If anyone can dig it up, I'd appreciate it.

addxb2 · PostAug 07, 2020#222020-08-07T19:37+00:00

Does anyone have a list of the property they’re seeking?

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ebo · PostAug 11, 2020#232020-08-11T17:58+00:00

quincunx, I'm pretty sure it was this:

https://news.stlpublicradio.org/economy ... in-the-lou

quincunx · PostAug 11, 2020#242020-08-11T18:05+00:00

Yes, thanks. Wow, 7 years ago!