urbanSTL

^ I looked things up and it appears that those rear office buildings (along with the narrow one fronting 18th) are owned by another company out of Ft. Worth but LHM is leasing at least part of the spaces... anyway, I think there are some interesting things that could be done with residential.

Also, another question that I don't think has been addressed much.... what is going to happen with parking arrangements?

Those images are from Google Earth they updated their 3D models recently and I am pretty surprised by how good they are. Even in areas that I am not sure how they got a clear shot of some things.

symphonicpoet wrote:It's really going to depend on where you put the ferris wheel.





I trust they'll make the right decision . . .

(Besides, they really don't want to cut a hole in the roof at all. Who wants to lose their landmark money?)

These pics illustrate exactly why I would orientate the wheel facing north. You can see the whole central mega-downtown. Look left for Midtown and Clayton, right for Arch and Downtown. You might even be able to see planes landing at Lambert.

From these Google perspectives it looks like facing strictly East from just south of the trainshed might even block most of the Arch view. Anything West of 18th street would be a tough view looking back over your shoulder (unless you can move around in the enclosed cars).

I am assuming by the way the cars look that you will be able to move around and you can see out every direction.

I was going to point out that they're google earth. It never ceases to impress me what they've pulled off. Some spots are better than others. (They're terrible in Ho Chi Minh. Probably locked out by the government. But then HCM isn't the sexy part of East Asia . . . yet.) One of the beautiful things about the program is it tells you the "eye elevation," so they're from very approximately the top of a two hundred foot wheel. The one immediately south of the shed is a little more than two hundred feet and the one west of the shed where you can actually see the arch is a little less. The interface is a little crude, so I didn't spend a whole lot of time adjusting to get it exactly right, I just got "close" and then panned between locations . . . It seems Union Station is on a not inconsequential hill, with the headhouse at the top and the shed on the down-slope. That may even be by design, as it would help to limit the possibility of trains running away into the Midway, which happened precisely once, I think. (And of course Mr. W A Bash was guilty of the lapse. I . . . uh . . . am a member of that historical society. Kudos, Wabash, on your rockin' name.) Anyway . . .

As to the view, you lose more of it the further south you get from Market until it's gone at the south end of the shed and you don't get it back until you're nearly at the highway. Let's call it the Eagleton Eclipse. Which is pretty much why that building was so controversial when it went up: it blocks the view to some appreciable extent from the fancy folks corridor in and out of town. The degree to which it's blocked changes with perspective and the peculiarities of location. But hopefully the folks developing the building are smart enough to figure that out. Hopefully. Because I really don't want to see anyone cutting more holes in the train shed. I . . . uh . . . also knew some folks that cut some other holes there. At the request of the owners. In order to get MoT's Y6 under the bush sheds immediately west of the primary shed. (Small holes and not in the main shed itself, but the railfan irony of being asked to lop off parts of the station in order to put an oversize freight locomotive into a context it never would have seen was observed.)

So I'm excited to see the thing patched back up and open again, and hopefully vibrant and productive. But no more demolition than absolutely necessary please. Stick the wheel in a parking lot. And not the one to the south of the shed. That'd look awful and you can't see anything from there anyway. You're down in a hole and buried inside a wall of buildings. Of you're going to tear anything down, you'd want to tear down the building currently housing Maggie O's to get it right on Market. (And maybe you could offer Maggie O's a new location at a good deal to take the sting out.) Not that I am proposing demo, but better that or something like it than the train shed. Which is an NHR site. And direction won't matter too much. You'll have an unobstructed view in all directions from the top of the wheel and little view from the bottom no matter what way you put it. That's just sort of the nature of the beast.

When they start rehabbing the roof I'll be able to post some nice updates on it as my building has a perfect view of it. Can't wait

So I was listening to Bernie Miklasz(?) this morning and he dropped a few interesting little tidbits regarding the possible future soccer franchise here. Apparently the soccer leagues governing body has said that at this time St. Louis is clearly number 26 to receive a new team during the next round of expansion (teams 25, 26 & 27) with the current goal being a 28 team league. Furthermore, teams 25 and 26 (us) would not be expected to pay the possible $200 million expansion fee that is being thrown about but rather somewhere south of $150. Apparently this is due to the advanced state of talks between the possible ownership groups and the league and the fact that the Rams left money on the table for a project when they left. Speaking of ownership group, he said one of the leaders (sorry I can't remember his name ) of World Wide Technology, already a key player in local soccer efforts, was "not unsurprisingly" part of the ownership group. But the thing he mentioned that most likely will make everyone jump for joy is the increased possibility that the new stadium will become part of the Clark Street Sports Corridor with Busch Stadium, Scottrade and the new soccer venue opening somewhere west of Union Station. He was quoting a "reliable source" regarding an upcoming article that is supposed to be coming out soon from Sports Illustrated. I tried to find something/anything that could confirm or substantiate what he was quoting but I wasn't able to locate anything. So I guess for now we'll have to take him on his word.

FrankRider wrote:So I was listening to Bernie Miklasz(?) this morning and he dropped a few interesting little tidbits regarding the possible future soccer franchise here. Apparently the soccer leagues governing body has said that at this time St. Louis is clearly number 26 to receive a new team during the next round of expansion (teams 25, 26 & 27) with the current goal being a 28 team league. Furthermore, teams 25 and 26 (us) would not be expected to pay the possible $200 million expansion fee that is being thrown about but rather somewhere south of $150. Apparently this is due to the advanced state of talks between the possible ownership groups and the league and the fact that the Rams left money on the table for a project when they left. Speaking of ownership group, he said one of the leaders (sorry I can't remember his name ) of World Wide Technology, already a key player in local soccer efforts, was "not unsurprisingly" part of the ownership group. But the thing he mentioned that most likely will make everyone jump for joy is the increased possibility that the new stadium will become part of the Clark Street Sports Corridor with Busch Stadium, Scottrade and the new soccer venue opening somewhere west of Union Station. He was quoting a "reliable source" regarding an upcoming article that is supposed to be coming out soon from Sports Illustrated. I tried to find something/anything that could confirm or substantiate what he was quoting but I wasn't able to locate anything. So I guess for now we'll have to take him on his word.

Here is the article:

http://www.si.com/planet-futbol/2016/08 ... -san-diego

"St. Louis, meanwhile, has a stadium site identified on the edge of downtown but still is finalizing its ownership group. Jim Kavanaugh, the co-founder and CEO of Worldwide Technology and the owner of second-year USL team St. Louis FC., is one of the investors involved in the MLS bid. The league wants St. Louis and its deep-rooted soccer culture and is bullish on the prospect of accessing some of the public funding left on the table by the now-Los Angeles Rams."

^good news!

I'm excited to see the design for the stadium, I really hope they go with a unique and something that really pulls attention toward itself, something that really makes you stop and look (something iconic).

I wonder if "edge of downtown" means west of union station or south of busch


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Yea the rumors have been just west of union station. They're going to be redoing the Jefferson/64 interchange due to the NGA deal so that 22nd exit interchange is going to have to be redone or removed and MoDOT has been talking about that for ages just no funding so hopefully this all gets put together in one package

...the prospect of accessing some of the public funding left on the table by the now-Los Angeles Rams."

what public funding has been "left on the table"?

^ State and County help likely will be off the table and City will have to address Scottrade and Dome/Convention Center upgrades. Don't think there will be much beyond TIF/property tax/amusement tax subsidies.

I really hope the new stadium & Union Station improvements spur some development on all those empty parking lots just north of the proposed site.

STLrainbow wrote:^ State and County help likely will be off the table and City will have to address Scottrade and Dome/Convention Center upgrades. Don't think there will be much beyond TIF/property tax/amusement tax subsidies.

exactly. nothing's been left on the table.

Why do you think state and county help is off the table?

^ Sure... County had nothing on the table to begin with. And what State had on the table is completely gone, now, with the Nixon administration history. A new table may be set up, but it is going to be a completely different process.

Mikes Shannon's to be Ferris Wheel?

A Ferris wheel at the old Mike Shannon’s? Hilton owner cries foul
http://www.bizjournals.com/stlouis/news ... ilton.html



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One Ferris wheel is good. Two is pushing it. Why not put a taller building there instead.


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Ferris wheels are pretty gimmicky, but definitely a draw for many so it's cool if someone wants to build one in the downtown area. However, I'd be beyond disappointed if this spot became a ferris wheel instead of a tall apartment/office/hotel building. Another ballpark village bar-mall would be a better use of space.

Building competing Ferris wheels would be the most St. Louis thing to do.

St. Louis - City Of Ferris Wheels

Dumb Idea, IMO. Putting it next to the hotel rooms is a bad move especially when they already are putting one at Union Station. There are a bunch of way better uses. I am happy Coatar agrees and it sounds like this will get blocked.

There will only be one Ferris Wheel. To be determined if it's a Mike Shannons or Union Station.

Bob OLoughlin's only reason to fight the Ferris Wheel at Mike Shannons is because he wants it at Union Station. Guess he thinks he has a monopoly on entertainment in St Louis.

Mike Shannons property does not block the view of his hotel as its directly west of his property. His customers will still see the Arch, CBD and Busch Stadium. This was just some made up complaint to distract people from the real reason he opposes the Ferris Wheel at Mike Shannons.

Lastly, the purpose of a Ferris Wheel is to give a good fun view of the surrounding area. There's nothing around Union station to see. At Mike Shannons, you'll see CityGarden, Busch, activity at BPV, CBD up close, Arch, old State Capital, etc.

Lastly, from the old Busch Stadium days to not allow buildings to look over onto the field like Wrigley, there was a 35 ft height restriction imposed on the Mike Shannons property controlled by Cardinals and Cordish. They will not waive this restriction for any type of project that would compete with BPV like a office tower, hotel, residential tower, etc. So, you guys have a point of wanting some amazing mixed use tower on this site but it's highly unlikely to ever get the blessing of Cards/Cordish.

That's my case for the Ferris Wheel at Mike Shannons.

Kevin,

Is this the Shannon's plan you were referring to when you said it would be released by year end? Or PLEASE tell me this is in addition to what you know? There is no possible way this can be the highest and best use for that site. I would rather have a parking lot there (which at least can be developed later) than a ferris wheel.