^ the credit card machines most likely "aren't working" because the cabbie losses extra money to the cab company.
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*beating head against wall*dweebe wrote:Looks like you are I are wrong. St. Louis can't handle ridesharing unlike most other cities. Full steam ahead on our current course with no changes at all.pat wrote:With that logic, St. Louis should be being flooded with disgruntled cab drivers from every other major metropolitan area that already has Uber.Now that I think about it, putting Uber here would probably create a significant incentive for St. Louis area cab drivers to leave St. Louis for greener pastures.
A lot of other cities have Uber. Like evvery single major one besides us. Are you reading about a mass of taxi drivers making less pay or losing out in each of those cities? Uber and the like have been around for 4 years. I haven't heard of an epidemic of taxi drivers being pushed out of the market.
Again, I don't think this is a question of what St. Louis as a whole can or can't handle. I don't think allowing UberX into St. Louis will destroy the city or cause a cataclysm or anything along those lines.
I think the reality is, it will be bad for the working class. Much like so-called "Right-To-Work" legislation, Uber's model is predicated on the right-wing principles of deregulation, cheap labor, and incentivizing the working class to compete against itself in a race to the bottom for marginal benefits to consumers and big benefits to foreign investors.
An embarrassing number of St. Louisans are living in poverty. Many cab drivers in the City depend on their wages to pay for their own housing, food, school, and kids. UberX is going to disrupt many of those drivers' ability to do that. I think it will put more people into poverty, thereby exacerbating what is already St. Louis's worst problem holding it back. All in order for other people to have faster, cheaper cab service in which you can listen to your spotify playlist.
Whoopee.
Therefore, I support the MTC in its efforts to protect the locally owned businesses and their employees. I really do understand UberX would be more convenient for you all, and me too. But I think the societal cost for our City makes it not worth it.
It is what it is.
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Las Vegas doesn't have Ride sharing and I hear never will. Any other U.S. metros taking the European stance?
I'm not that frequent, but I went 5 rides in a row where they claimed they couldn't do credit cards. Just pull the damn MC/Visa stickers off the car windows.mjbais1489 wrote:I might be in favor of the MTC standing its ground if the taxis and taxi drivers in St Louis weren't so routinely awful.
Their Apps don't work -their phone lines don't work and their drivers don't know where they are going. I take 3-4 taxi rides a week.
And nothing pisses me off more then a taxi driver whose credit machine "Isn't Working" which happens all too often with taxis around here.
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That's a valid stance MoundCity and I might be on your side if the actual product and service were anywhere close from my experiences.
In Las Vegas you can't hail a cab. You can only be picked up at a hotel/casino taxi stand.moorlander wrote:Las Vegas doesn't have Ride sharing and I hear never will. Any other U.S. metros taking the European stance?
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How much do they lose? I have gotten this before. Please explain.roger wyoming II wrote:^ the credit card machines most likely "aren't working" because the cabbie losses extra money to the cab company.
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Yeah, again, I guess that's part of it too. I've been taking cabs regularly in the City of St. Louis for eight years, now (holy sh*t, has it been that long?), and in that time period, yes, I've had the odd occurrence where a cab failed to show up, or refused to take my credit card, but my experience taking cabs has largely been a neutral one. I'm not gung ho about how great our city's cab service is, but I also don't have the hatred that everyone posting in these threads do. I guess I just haven't had as bad of an experience as everyone else.mjbais1489 wrote:That's a valid stance MoundCity and I might be on your side if the actual product and service were anywhere close from my experiences.
I dunno.
It makes me wonder about how the drivers and/or taxi companies are cooking the books by trying to do little credit card business and keeping as much as possible with cash.downtown2007 wrote:How much do they lose? I have gotten this before. Please explain.roger wyoming II wrote:^ the credit card machines most likely "aren't working" because the cabbie losses extra money to the cab company.
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I just don't buy into MoundCity's stance that cabbies get good pay while Uber drivers don't.... that is not the case with what I've seen. I think the most likely economic impact is that we'd have more overall employment and income earned within the driving industry but a greater percentage of part-time employees over full-timers. And there is nothing to prevent the traditional cab industry to adapt to the modern world, which it just simply will have to do.
Also, a benefit of the cheaper fares uber is able to provide is the same as services like WeCar... less reliance on personal automobiles; with good transit options and reliable and convenient access to the convenient car service, a young person is less in need of having to purchase an auto. Plus less drunk driving.
But clearly Uber provides a more customer-focused experience.
Also, a benefit of the cheaper fares uber is able to provide is the same as services like WeCar... less reliance on personal automobiles; with good transit options and reliable and convenient access to the convenient car service, a young person is less in need of having to purchase an auto. Plus less drunk driving.
But clearly Uber provides a more customer-focused experience.
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When I lived in Soulard next to Mcgurcks or on 13th and Washington I never had a problem with the promptness because of where I lived. I still had the credit card thing tried on me a fair amount.Mound City wrote:Yeah, again, I guess that's part of it too. I've been taking cabs regularly in the City of St. Louis for eight years, now (holy sh*t, has it been that long?), and in that time period, yes, I've had the odd occurrence where a cab failed to show up, or refused to take my credit card, but my experience taking cabs has largely been a neutral one. I'm not gung ho about how great our city's cab service is, but I also don't have the hatred that everyone posting in these threads do. I guess I just haven't had as bad of an experience as everyone else.mjbais1489 wrote:That's a valid stance MoundCity and I might be on your side if the actual product and service were anywhere close from my experiences.
I dunno.
But when you try to use their apps (Curb), which I presume they developed to compete with Uber, on a Friday/Saturday night they literally never assign you a cab. I have gotten it to work like 1/10 times.
Ive had friends sit and wait for Cabs to pick up phone calls or app requests and after 10 minutes everyone is just like - screw it lets just drive. Which seems to me to defeat the point of having cabs. Rarely do I schedule a cab in advance of when I want one so that may be a difference between how I use and you use it.
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That's more or less it... the taxi company takes a good percentage of the fare to process the credit card transaction; more than what the actual cost is to them in a lot of cases. Also, we have to remember that a lot of taxi cab drivers are immigrants who get exploited by the taxi cab companies. They aren't making good money; it is a job for them but there is no wage advantage over uber.dweebe wrote:It makes me wonder about how the drivers and/or taxi companies are cooking the books by trying to do little credit card business and keeping as much as possible with cash.downtown2007 wrote:How much do they lose? I have gotten this before. Please explain.roger wyoming II wrote:^ the credit card machines most likely "aren't working" because the cabbie losses extra money to the cab company.
I get what you're saying. But the purpose of the MTC is not to protect existing businesses and employees. Its not a union. It is created for the public purposes of recognizing taxicab service as a public transportation system, improving the quality of the system, and exercising primary authority over the provision of licensing, control and regulations of taxicab services within the district. That's from the Missouri statute. Its job is to improve the system and regulate it.An embarrassing number of St. Louisans are living in poverty. Many cab drivers in the City depend on their wages to pay for their own housing, food, school, and kids. UberX is going to disrupt many of those drivers' ability to do that. I think it will put more people into poverty, thereby exacerbating what is already St. Louis's worst problem holding it back. All in order for other people to have faster, cheaper cab service in which you can listen to your spotify playlist.
Whoopee.
Therefore, I support the MTC in its efforts to protect the locally owned businesses and their employees. I really do understand UberX would be more convenient for you all, and me too. But I think the societal cost for our City makes it not worth it.
I wish there were statistics to see how much if any of a societal cost there is when Uber enters a market. In San Francisco, cab rides have gone down dramatically, but I have no idea if that's put those cab drivers into a worse position financially.
How many cab drivers are there in St. Louis? Are we talking about a huge loss if Uber enters the market? Hard to say.
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I found this article to be pretty representative of the experience of the one Uber driver (he'd been laid off as a cab driver) that I know.
https://www.jacobinmag.com/2014/09/against-sharing/
https://www.jacobinmag.com/2014/09/against-sharing/
We should all be embarrassed that our city is living up to its stodgy, risk-averse reputation and can't figure out a way to welcome Uber into the market when literally EVERY OTHER CITY larger and smaller figured it out. It makes us look like a bunch of bumbling, provincial yahoos. The fact that the head of our taxi commission, who claims that "professionalism" is of utmost importance, is resorting to trash-talking those in disagreement via Twitter, is absolutely pathetic.
The bottom line is, the absence of Uber in St. Louis IS hindering our ability to attract talent. Take it from Gabe Lozano of Lockerdome, who lays it out plain and simple-- prospective applicants turn down offers here because we don't have BASIC infrastructure that EVERY OTHER CITY has. This is humiliating. These are the people who will create new jobs and new opportunities, rebuild neighborhoods and contribute to the tax base. The impression St. Louis leaves because of this myopic, spiteful, vindictive inaction is killing our competitiveness on a national level, and that's not good for ANYONE'S livelihood-- cabdrivers, janitors, entrepreneurs, corporate CEOs and everyone in between included.
The bottom line is, the absence of Uber in St. Louis IS hindering our ability to attract talent. Take it from Gabe Lozano of Lockerdome, who lays it out plain and simple-- prospective applicants turn down offers here because we don't have BASIC infrastructure that EVERY OTHER CITY has. This is humiliating. These are the people who will create new jobs and new opportunities, rebuild neighborhoods and contribute to the tax base. The impression St. Louis leaves because of this myopic, spiteful, vindictive inaction is killing our competitiveness on a national level, and that's not good for ANYONE'S livelihood-- cabdrivers, janitors, entrepreneurs, corporate CEOs and everyone in between included.
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I had an Uber driver who was on hiatus from a NON-SPEAKING role on Brooklyn Nine Nine. If that's not helping the downtrodden I don't know what is. She couldn't even get her SAG card!
Also had a young Asian student who really really had to pee. I let him pee at my place. LA traffic can be hard on your bladder!
Also had a young Asian student who really really had to pee. I let him pee at my place. LA traffic can be hard on your bladder!
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Bless you for your kindness. I'm serious. I've had Uber drivers who said they hadn't peed all morning and afternoon because they can't afford it.leeharveyawesome wrote:I had an Uber driver who was on hiatus from a NON-SPEAKING role on Brooklyn Nine Nine. If that's not helping the downtrodden I don't know what is. She couldn't even get her SAG card!
Also had a young Asian student who really really had to pee. I let him pee at my place. LA traffic can be hard on your bladder!
This is like the people who say the absence of the NFL would hinder St. Louis's ability to attract corporations. For the record, I don't find either case compelling.stlgasm wrote: The bottom line is, the absence of Uber in St. Louis IS hindering our ability to attract talent.
I applaud Gabe Lozano for all he's done with LockerDome, but again, in my opinion it's not in St. Louis's best interests to just bend over and appease the technocrat class. People not moving to St. Louis because we don't have UberX? Good riddance.
We need better policy decisions that benefit the people who need it the most.
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From everything I've read from other cities Uber is a terrible, exploitative company and I won't lose any sleep over not having them in St. Louis, regardless of whether our local taxicabs are somehow even worse.stlgasm wrote:We should all be embarrassed that our city is living up to its stodgy, risk-averse reputation and can't figure out a way to welcome Uber into the market when literally EVERY OTHER CITY larger and smaller figured it out. It makes us look like a bunch of bumbling, provincial yahoos. The fact that the head of our taxi commission, who claims that "professionalism" is of utmost importance, is resorting to trash-talking those in disagreement via Twitter, is absolutely pathetic.
The bottom line is, the absence of Uber in St. Louis IS hindering our ability to attract talent. Take it from Gabe Lozano of Lockerdome, who lays it out plain and simple-- prospective applicants turn down offers here because we don't have BASIC infrastructure that EVERY OTHER CITY has. This is humiliating. These are the people who will create new jobs and new opportunities, rebuild neighborhoods and contribute to the tax base. The impression St. Louis leaves because of this myopic, spiteful, vindictive inaction is killing our competitiveness on a national level, and that's not good for ANYONE'S livelihood-- cabdrivers, janitors, entrepreneurs, corporate CEOs and everyone in between included.
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C'mon, man, uber isn't paving the streets in gold for drivers but do you really think cab companies are? Heck, a driver just had to sue the commission so he could wear his Islamic attire. What bullsh*t. Here are a couple things to take a look at:Mound City wrote:I found this article to be pretty representative of the experience of the one Uber driver (he'd been laid off as a cab driver) that I know.
https://www.jacobinmag.com/2014/09/against-sharing/
How Taxi Companies Rip Off Their Drivers
http://www.forbes.com/sites/marcweberto ... r-drivers/
Uber's remakable growth could end the era of poorly paid cab drivers
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/inn ... b-drivers/
(this may overstate uber pay but still shows cabbie low pay)
Uber Reveals How Much Its Drivers Really Earn... Sort Of
http://time.com/money/3678389/uber-drivers-wages/
BLS Data
http://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes533041.htm
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No, I don't think Cab companies are paving the streets in gold for their drivers. But if I'm in the business, then I like my chances as a taxi cab driver more than an UberX driver.
mound city- maintaining status quo and "business as usual" has really been working out great for STL. Please! I've said this before and I'll say it again- there's no such thing as holding steady-- if we're not moving forward, we're falling behind. Other metros will continue to suck talent and jobs as long as we make every excuse not to adapt to the 21st century. And dismissing "technocrats" is rather ignorant- increasing the upwardly-mobile educated class will enhance the quality of life for all residents regardless of income level. As a metro area, we have been circling the drain in most metrics compared to other metros. But hey, at least our water tastes good and we have a free zoo. The sad reality is, St. Louis needs Uber a lot more than Uber needs St. Louis. It's astonishing they haven't given up on us already.
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Do you realize how much you sound like Ronald Reagan right now?stlgasm wrote:And dismissing "technocrats" is rather ignorant- increasing the upwardly-mobile educated class will enhance the quality of life for all residents regardless of income level.