Looks like construction has begun to extend Truman Parkway north of Chouteau.

Construction started on the Grattan/Truman Pkwy phase 2 a couple weeks ago. It's actually only going to extend a few hundred feet to connect the current terminus on Chouteau to 18th street near Ameren. 18th street will be vacated between Chouteau and where Truman Pkwy connects to 18th.

I noticed that they are digging up the area South of Chouteau, as if 18th Street will continue into Lafayette Square. I'm sure that's not going to happen, but does anyone know if they will at least open-up the street grid here, so that we can get into Lafayette Square without running a maze?

Chris_on_Kingsbury wrote:I think that the plan was made for an Interstate spur in the 1960's. The dotted line on my 1970's map seems to run right through the Lafayette neighborhood. The Truman Parkway would make a workable alternative.

The original plan was for an I-755 to connect 70, 40 and 44/55 in a western loop around downtown. That's why the 44/55 and 64/20th Street interchanges are so convoluted - they were built to accomodate that freeway. In fact, on Rand McNally downtown detail maps in their road atlases, they showed ramps from 40 at 20th south to Chouteau with some other stubs as well. I don't know if they've finally updated that map, but it was like that throughout the 90's. Probably confused the hell out of some drivers, trying to get on roads that never existed.

Thanks for the info jonkleinow. I'd always wondered about the 20th street exit on 40. Such a waste of land.

If you look at an aerial image of the interchange complex, it's very easy to spot all the "ghost ramps" and excessively wide pavement where I-755 would have gone and connected with Hwy 40. From the image, I count as many as 5 extraneous segments of pavement.



Google Maps of Hwy 40 at 20th



Edit

Wow! Found a map of the cancelled I-755.

Midwest Roads map of I-755

^No thanks.

Chris_on_Kingsbury wrote:Wow. Connect 755 with the new Mississippi bridge and we'd have a real highway system.

God save us from real highway systems, then.

I still think the plan is a good idea, but only if they place the entire system underground. (not likely) Its not worth dividing the neighborhoods anymore than they already are with downtown especially when we are finally trying to rebuild the connection.



If you look at google maps you can actually see where the state probably stills holds land for this project. There is a good stretch where you can see vacant lots this route would have followed. Another sad note is it appears they built the St. Louis Place park in north STL just to just bulldoze it with a freeway. [-X

ArchMadness wrote:I still think the plan is a good idea, but only if they place the entire system underground.

Me too, but I think Boston's Big Dig effectively killed the chances of any American city receiving federal dollars for a similar effort.



I regret that the Interstate system was built through Saint Louis and other major American cities. Many European cities are enclosed by a freeway loop, but the expressways leading to them stop short of the central business district in most cases.



Some have suggested eliminating Interstate routes through the city proper- and while I like that idea as it would provide the opportunity to reconnect severed neighborhoods- there's no way such an endeavor would receive broad public support or federal funding. And it'd be difficult if not impossible to change the commuting habits of area residents. Think of how many Illinois commuters rely on 64/40 to get to their Clayton or West County jobs, for example.



The Interstate system has already inflicted too much damage on the City of St. Louis IMHO. Since an underground route is probably nothing more than a pipe dream, I'm very glad that Interstate 755 will never be built. The Truman Parkway is acceptable IMHO, although correcting the lack of access between Interstates 64 and 55 would be nice at some point as long as it didn't disrupt more of the urban fabric.

With energy crisis looming, I don't think shutting down freeways inside the city are out of the question. But without a strong public transportation system, and a real effort from citizens to get rid of their vehicles, it won't happen. That day would be a good day.

ArchMadness wrote:I still think the plan is a good idea, but only if they place the entire system underground. (not likely) Its not worth dividing the neighborhoods anymore than they already are with downtown especially when we are finally trying to rebuild the connection.



If you look at google maps you can actually see where the state probably stills holds land for this project. There is a good stretch where you can see vacant lots this route would have followed. Another sad note is it appears they built the St. Louis Place park in north STL just to just bulldoze it with a freeway. [-X

In some ways, it's sad this plan wasn't completed. We lost many buildings and neighborhoods were separated (including the west end of downtown) -- all for nothing. At least the I-64 south to I-55 part should have been completed, if for no other reason than most of the necessary land was already acquired.



But really, the whole situation with the interstates in St. Louis shows us that the interstates should have converged WEST of downtown, and then only have one combined 44/55/64/70 running through DT to Illinois. In fact, the whole thing could have been run between Poplar and Chouteau by elevating it over the railyards. Might not have been pretty, but at least it would have put the interstate where the existing dividing line was.

Can someone please tell me what's going on just SOUTH of Chouteau, right where 18th street runs into it? They're doing lots of digging in the vicinity of the Gast Haus's parking area.



Hopefully, they're going to open-up the streets and re-connect Lafayette Square with everything to the North again? I really hate those barricades.

^Haven't seen the intersection recently, but I know the signals at 18th and Chouteau are to be nixed once the Truman Parkway is extended north of Chouteau. North of Chouteau, 18th will be vacated to Ameren. South may very well reopen to the business circle with the Gast Haus, but actually being a through-street further south is up to Lafayette Square residents, who still apparently like the barriers between the residential and commercial sections of 18th south of Chouteau.

shadrach wrote:The size of the surface grading made me think they're putting in a surface lot for the businesses.

This is what I'm afraid of! If so, I hope it's at least nicely landscaped etc. Such a waisted opportunity. This is the perfect spot to re-establish the street grid into Lafayette Square. Won't we ever learn?

Framer wrote:

shadrach wrote:The size of the surface grading made me think they're putting in a surface lot for the businesses.

This is what I'm afraid of! If so, I hope it's at least nicely landscaped etc. Such a waisted opportunity. This is the perfect spot to re-establish the street grid into Lafayette Square. Won't we ever learn?

Could this be for the beir garden that was talked about?

http://www.urbanstl.com/viewtopic.php?t=2649

I drove through there a few nights ago, and that roundabout is basically gone now.