3rd if we want to get technicalmoorlander wrote: ↑Nov 02, 2017A 2nd SBUX is opening in T2 so unfortunately I think that rules out a Kaldi's there.
but yea, I agree, I wish they would have brought in someone local. Plus I like their logo better.
I find it interesting that all of a sudden people here are so interested in AA and the company's operations at Lambert Fields after years of bitterness from 2003 cuts the focus here is mainly Southwest. But here we are now.
For anyone interested, the company for now is keeping the 200 F/A SLT (not a typo) base, along with in-house fleet service (ramp/"baggage handlers") and line maintenance plus stores. As for the contractual obligations:
APFA Flight Attendants: CBA would not prevent SLT from closing, but there is clear language on how transfer bids are awarded
TWU aircraft maintenance and stores: flight activity and CBA currently does not allow contracting out the operation, but a reduction in force is certainly possible
TWU fleet service: flight activity and CBA currently does not allow contracting out, but the activity is lurking the threshold and could trigger contracting out but everything will likely stay in steady state until a new joint agreement is reached, and one of the negotiators on the TWU side is a STL TWA guy.
Meanwhile, AA still has more active employees based in STL than WN, but then again AA is burdened by onerous and unnecessary arbitration awards from the TWA transaction and TWU agreement.
https://www.swamedia.com/media_storage/ ... ts/STL.pdf
For anyone interested, the company for now is keeping the 200 F/A SLT (not a typo) base, along with in-house fleet service (ramp/"baggage handlers") and line maintenance plus stores. As for the contractual obligations:
APFA Flight Attendants: CBA would not prevent SLT from closing, but there is clear language on how transfer bids are awarded
TWU aircraft maintenance and stores: flight activity and CBA currently does not allow contracting out the operation, but a reduction in force is certainly possible
TWU fleet service: flight activity and CBA currently does not allow contracting out, but the activity is lurking the threshold and could trigger contracting out but everything will likely stay in steady state until a new joint agreement is reached, and one of the negotiators on the TWU side is a STL TWA guy.
Meanwhile, AA still has more active employees based in STL than WN, but then again AA is burdened by onerous and unnecessary arbitration awards from the TWA transaction and TWU agreement.
https://www.swamedia.com/media_storage/ ... ts/STL.pdf
Actually not necessarily. There is a number of TW guys who came out remarkably well in the deal and took nAAtive jobs at MIA and there are Airbus, 737, 757/767 captains along with 777 F/Os who have displaced nAAtives. There are TW guys based in Miami flying the 777 to places like Barcelona, Buenos Aires, Chicago, Dallas-Ft. Worth, London, Los Angeles, Madrid, Paris, Santiago de Chile, Sao Paulo, etc. While the forum here is very much STL centered, not everyone from TW was an STL person and many are still in the New York and Los Angeles basin areas so the more desirable flying at another base is vastly desirable to commuting to STL (not easy) and doing 3-day trips on the S80.matguy70 wrote: ↑Nov 01, 2017On the subject of pilots relocating. My guess is that over half of these former TWA pilots will retire from AA and remain in STL. Most were senior pilots with TWA and are probably near retirement and most are probably unwilling to learn or wish to retrain on flying commercial new jets.
At least half if not more.
The TW seniority list integration was fair, IMO, when you consider TW was a basket case in its final years and had AMR not closed on the deal they were not in a cash position to maintain payroll and pay fuel suppliers.
There was a similar situation with Canadian Airlines and Air Canada that is still being fought over, only the CP crews got awarded full credit for their Canadian service-effectively cheapening years of service at Air Canada and AC seniority.
Airline seniority is like politics and religion. Bringing it up in airline circles is bound to fire someone up, and by its very nature is zero sum-whereby elevating one person's relative position means demoting someone elses.
The bottom line is after years of furlough, sacrifice, the TWA LLCers that are now active employees are in a solid place working for a solvent, well capitalized and resilient company which should remain that way for the rest of their careers. Thats not to say they will end their careers in STL or another city of their choice, but things today are much more secure than they were on 4/9/2001.
There was a similar situation with Canadian Airlines and Air Canada that is still being fought over, only the CP crews got awarded full credit for their Canadian service-effectively cheapening years of service at Air Canada and AC seniority.
Airline seniority is like politics and religion. Bringing it up in airline circles is bound to fire someone up, and by its very nature is zero sum-whereby elevating one person's relative position means demoting someone elses.
The bottom line is after years of furlough, sacrifice, the TWA LLCers that are now active employees are in a solid place working for a solvent, well capitalized and resilient company which should remain that way for the rest of their careers. Thats not to say they will end their careers in STL or another city of their choice, but things today are much more secure than they were on 4/9/2001.
Decatur switching from Air Choice One to Cape Air.
http://herald-review.com/news/local/cap ... 68a40.html
http://herald-review.com/news/local/cap ... 68a40.html
I also saw this today. The 2 pasta houses in the airport are now Priority Pass Restaurants.
"Well, Priority Pass has just announced their newest location in the US. Specifically. St. Louis Airport is getting two Priority Pass restaurants — The Pasta House in Terminal 1, and The Pasta House and Schlafly Beer in Terminal 2. At both locations, Priority Pass members can spend up to $28 each (so if you’re traveling with two others, $84 will be taken off your final tab)."
http://onemileatatime.boardingarea.com/ ... estaurant/
"Well, Priority Pass has just announced their newest location in the US. Specifically. St. Louis Airport is getting two Priority Pass restaurants — The Pasta House in Terminal 1, and The Pasta House and Schlafly Beer in Terminal 2. At both locations, Priority Pass members can spend up to $28 each (so if you’re traveling with two others, $84 will be taken off your final tab)."
http://onemileatatime.boardingarea.com/ ... estaurant/
I updated my Departure Spreadsheet for the last time of the year. It gets a little crazy around the holidays so I won't update it again until mid January.
Weekly Departure Changes from my October sheet. Keep in mind this doesn't take into account plane size/seats just flights.
American - (-14)
Delta - no change
United - +1
Frontier - (-5)
Southwest - +9
Allegiant - (-2)
Alaska - (-7)
Total STL only (-16)
A few notes:
I added plane type notes to the legacy airlines starting on this one.
I tried to use the numbers for AA,UA, and Delta that made the most sense over the next 2 months. It varies for holidays. Southwest also varies, but not as much.
Delta is all mainline from MSP, ATL, SLC. ATL being all mainline is normal but the other two aren't. MSP goes to all RJs except 1 daily flight in January so that seems weird. SLC goes back to its normal 1 mainline and 1 RJ in January.
Seattle is only 1x daily most of the time now into spring on Alaska. They still do run it 2x around the holiday weeks but once you get into January it is 1x until mid March (same week PDX is supposed to return). This probably is subject to change (as in last longer). Might be more issues stemming from pilot shortages. Usually it just went down to 1 RJ and 1 mainline. They might not have the RJ available at the moment.
Alaska is ending Portland at the end of the month. It picks back up again in March. This one is for sure pilot shortage related.
Alaska to San Diego starts next month.
Cancun on Southwest starts in a weekend.
Southwest has a handful of Saturdays over the next two months that it isn't running the Seattle flight.
Southwest is running a second daily to SFO a few days around the holidays. It leaves STL at 11 pm and arrives at SFO after 1 am. Odd timing, probably related to plane shortages and fitting in the routes when they can. 11 pm is about the latest departure I have seen from them here though.
Southwest is running a nonstop to Orange County, CA some of the Saturdays over the next two months plus some other days around Christmas. 8 days total.
Weekly Departure Changes from my October sheet. Keep in mind this doesn't take into account plane size/seats just flights.
American - (-14)
Delta - no change
United - +1
Frontier - (-5)
Southwest - +9
Allegiant - (-2)
Alaska - (-7)
Total STL only (-16)
A few notes:
I added plane type notes to the legacy airlines starting on this one.
I tried to use the numbers for AA,UA, and Delta that made the most sense over the next 2 months. It varies for holidays. Southwest also varies, but not as much.
Delta is all mainline from MSP, ATL, SLC. ATL being all mainline is normal but the other two aren't. MSP goes to all RJs except 1 daily flight in January so that seems weird. SLC goes back to its normal 1 mainline and 1 RJ in January.
Seattle is only 1x daily most of the time now into spring on Alaska. They still do run it 2x around the holiday weeks but once you get into January it is 1x until mid March (same week PDX is supposed to return). This probably is subject to change (as in last longer). Might be more issues stemming from pilot shortages. Usually it just went down to 1 RJ and 1 mainline. They might not have the RJ available at the moment.
Alaska is ending Portland at the end of the month. It picks back up again in March. This one is for sure pilot shortage related.
Alaska to San Diego starts next month.
Cancun on Southwest starts in a weekend.
Southwest has a handful of Saturdays over the next two months that it isn't running the Seattle flight.
Southwest is running a second daily to SFO a few days around the holidays. It leaves STL at 11 pm and arrives at SFO after 1 am. Odd timing, probably related to plane shortages and fitting in the routes when they can. 11 pm is about the latest departure I have seen from them here though.
Southwest is running a nonstop to Orange County, CA some of the Saturdays over the next two months plus some other days around Christmas. 8 days total.
While I am underwhelmed with Pasta House, this is definitely something I will get good value out of.jshank83 wrote: ↑Nov 03, 2017I also saw this today. The 2 pasta houses in the airport are now Priority Pass Restaurants.
"Well, Priority Pass has just announced their newest location in the US. Specifically. St. Louis Airport is getting two Priority Pass restaurants — The Pasta House in Terminal 1, and The Pasta House and Schlafly Beer in Terminal 2. At both locations, Priority Pass members can spend up to $28 each (so if you’re traveling with two others, $84 will be taken off your final tab)."
http://onemileatatime.boardingarea.com/ ... estaurant/
There are a number of premium credit cards which offer Priority Pass as a benefit.
While it may seem ridiculous to pay $450/year for a credit card like the Citi Prestige card, they offer benefits which can make it profitable in the end, such as a $250 airline credit, 4th night free on hotel stays and Priority Pass membership.
Greg
September Numbers are out.
Not great
up 0.8% on the month
up 5.7% on the year
Passenger Aircraft departures were up 8.6% though
I know some other airports had some of their first negative months in a long time in September. I am assuming the hurricanes had an influence on the numbers.
https://www.flystl.com/uploads/document ... 7_ATAS.pdf
Not great
up 0.8% on the month
up 5.7% on the year
Passenger Aircraft departures were up 8.6% though
I know some other airports had some of their first negative months in a long time in September. I am assuming the hurricanes had an influence on the numbers.
https://www.flystl.com/uploads/document ... 7_ATAS.pdf
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I’m sure it did. CMH, MCI, and others posted pretty large deficits.jshank83 wrote:September Numbers are out.
Not great
up 0.8% on the month
up 5.7% on the year
Passenger Aircraft departures were up 8.6% though
I know some other airports had some of their first negative months in a long time in September. I am assuming the hurricanes had an influence on the numbers.
https://www.flystl.com/uploads/document ... 7_ATAS.pdf
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Airport Councils MarComm conference is being held in St. Louis this week. Hopefully some good press for our airport.
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Well, I finally got that East Terminal experience under my belt properly. I'm . . . not quite sold on the WN kool-aid. It's not too bad, and the service truly does seem quite nice, but I miss picking my seat and I just can't make myself love 737s. (Which I suppose I knew.) Anyway . . . so long as they keep serving the station well I will wish them the best. Their people seem genuinely content. It actually does seem like a happy ship, as it were, and there's a lot to be said for that. Anyway . . . there will be pictures in a few days, I expect. And I'd say we really do compare pretty favorably to places like Midway and Nashville. LaGuardia is obviously more busy, which is still fun, but other than that I have no complaints. (And yes, I know I am indeed EXCEPTIONALLY odd for intentionally flying into LaGuardia,but I had to see the Marine Air Terminal. And I wanted to see the place before it's all spruced up.)
http://www.missourinet.com/2017/11/07/m ... ing-audio/
Link to an interview with Jeff Lea. Not really anything new but I wanted to post it. He says Alaska will be be adding a 2nd daily flight to San Diego starting in December. This isn't accurate. They are launching a flight (as in 1) and its is the 3rd flight a day to San Diego for the airport. 1x with Alaska 2x with Southwest. They talk about cargo a little bit. They also mention the Southwest Cancun flight that is starting this week. Sidenote: I will be on the flight, so I plan to take pictures of anything interesting.
I really wish we had someone like KC has with Justin Meyer at our airport. Someone who is active on social media and keeping everyone up to date with airport happenings. He has been a little consumed with the vote their at the moment, and rightly so, but he always is letting people know when an interesting flight is coming in, schedule changes, interesting stats, or teases of flight announcements. We have nothing like that that I am aware of right now. Our airport twitter account tweets out a random pictures and then its one new article at the end of the week. That is about it. The guy doing the interview today said he had no clue Alaska was adding a flight. I am not surprised since it seems like no one promotes much at the airport. Most of the stuff I find I do a lot of digging to get to it. I think the people working there are doing a great job getting flights and attracting business, I just wish their PR was a little better to passengers. Sometimes someone will add a flight and you never hear a peep from them. I still don't think they ever said anything about the new flight to Tampa on Frontier. You would think someone in the marketing department would be a little more active.
If there is someone doing this for our airport please let me know their social media handle so I can follow them. Thanks!
Link to an interview with Jeff Lea. Not really anything new but I wanted to post it. He says Alaska will be be adding a 2nd daily flight to San Diego starting in December. This isn't accurate. They are launching a flight (as in 1) and its is the 3rd flight a day to San Diego for the airport. 1x with Alaska 2x with Southwest. They talk about cargo a little bit. They also mention the Southwest Cancun flight that is starting this week. Sidenote: I will be on the flight, so I plan to take pictures of anything interesting.
I really wish we had someone like KC has with Justin Meyer at our airport. Someone who is active on social media and keeping everyone up to date with airport happenings. He has been a little consumed with the vote their at the moment, and rightly so, but he always is letting people know when an interesting flight is coming in, schedule changes, interesting stats, or teases of flight announcements. We have nothing like that that I am aware of right now. Our airport twitter account tweets out a random pictures and then its one new article at the end of the week. That is about it. The guy doing the interview today said he had no clue Alaska was adding a flight. I am not surprised since it seems like no one promotes much at the airport. Most of the stuff I find I do a lot of digging to get to it. I think the people working there are doing a great job getting flights and attracting business, I just wish their PR was a little better to passengers. Sometimes someone will add a flight and you never hear a peep from them. I still don't think they ever said anything about the new flight to Tampa on Frontier. You would think someone in the marketing department would be a little more active.
If there is someone doing this for our airport please let me know their social media handle so I can follow them. Thanks!
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^ A little more help on the PR and public relations would help. If for no other reason than to clear up misconceptions a lot of locals have still. Then again, those who tend to still have those are the more provincial mindset people who tend to rarely if ever travel by air.
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I have some pretty mixed feelings about Justin Meyer actually. I find him to be more a liability to MCI than a benefit. He's tweeted some things about airline happenings at MCI that seem...odd. For example, I just find it really bizarre how he almost advertises cuts out of MCI. He also has tweeted things alluded to airline negotiations. He pretty much exposes MCI's competitive information to other airports. Ahem, STL.
For example:
He often touts how MCI is not performing well, yet is also pursuing additional flights. Okay, well what is to prevent an airport commission like St Louis from using his own stats against him? He said it himself: MCI is a terrible airport. It's really self-defeating.
For example:
He often touts how MCI is not performing well, yet is also pursuing additional flights. Okay, well what is to prevent an airport commission like St Louis from using his own stats against him? He said it himself: MCI is a terrible airport. It's really self-defeating.
There can be a happy medium. Someone here isn't going to be trying to get a new airport built, so they aren't going to be tweeting about bad things with the current airport. I don't need a person to tell us EVERYTHING but just keep people up to date on things. Things like, Airline A extended their schedule today and we are getting another flight to x city. Ie, Southwest extended their schedule last week. No one has said a word. Just because we don't have any new destinations doesn't mean someone could be tweeting out how we have record x number of flights now from Southwest and the CHS/PNS seasonal flights are back and ready to book! Even someone on twitter doing questions and answers would be good. I don't need to know every detail but I don't think it hurts to have a social media spokesperson to give a little hype to things.Chalupas54 wrote: ↑Nov 07, 2017I have some pretty mixed feelings about Justin Meyer actually. I find him to be more a liability to MCI than a benefit. He's tweeted some things about airline happenings at MCI that seem...odd. For example, I just find it really bizarre how he almost advertises cuts out of MCI. He also has tweeted things alluded to airline negotiations. He pretty much exposes MCI's competitive information to other airports. Ahem, STL.
For example:
He often touts how MCI is not performing well, yet is also pursuing additional flights. Okay, well what is to prevent an airport commission like St Louis from using his own stats against him? He said it himself: MCI is a terrible airport. It's really self-defeating.
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That's a really good point, actually.jshank83 wrote: ↑Nov 07, 2017There can be a happy medium. Someone here isn't going to be trying to get a new airport built, so they aren't going to be tweeting about bad things with the current airport. I don't need a person to tell us EVERYTHING but just keep people up to date on things. Things like, Airline A extended their schedule today and we are getting another flight to x city. Ie, Southwest extended their schedule last week. No one has said a word. Just because we don't have any new destinations doesn't mean someone could be tweeting out how we have record x number of flights now from Southwest and the CHS/PNS seasonal flights are back and ready to book! Even someone on twitter doing questions and answers would be good. I don't need to know every detail but I don't think it hurts to have a social media spokesperson to give a little hype to things.Chalupas54 wrote: ↑Nov 07, 2017I have some pretty mixed feelings about Justin Meyer actually. I find him to be more a liability to MCI than a benefit. He's tweeted some things about airline happenings at MCI that seem...odd. For example, I just find it really bizarre how he almost advertises cuts out of MCI. He also has tweeted things alluded to airline negotiations. He pretty much exposes MCI's competitive information to other airports. Ahem, STL.
For example:
He often touts how MCI is not performing well, yet is also pursuing additional flights. Okay, well what is to prevent an airport commission like St Louis from using his own stats against him? He said it himself: MCI is a terrible airport. It's really self-defeating.
https://www.bizjournals.com/stlouis/new ... round.html
Locked article on retail at the airport. Just curious if it says anything of note. Thanks.
Locked article on retail at the airport. Just curious if it says anything of note. Thanks.
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MCI vote passes.
Again, means very little for STL, but will be interesting to watch.
Many MCI posters are already exclaiming how STL's WN flights will all be relocating to the new MCI
Again, means very little for STL, but will be interesting to watch.
Many MCI posters are already exclaiming how STL's WN flights will all be relocating to the new MCI
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You're probably right, but personally I still would've felt a bit more comfortable with the results had SW already opened a crew base here - just to solidify us even more. Still, not likely to have any effect at all on STL. In any case, good for KC.Chalupas54 wrote: ↑Nov 08, 2017MCI vote passes.
Again, means very little for STL, but will be interesting to watch.
Of course they areMany MCI posters are already exclaiming how STL's WN flights will all be relocating to the new MCI
. 4 years (minimum) before the new terminal opens is a long time in the world of aviation, though.Let me put it this way... airlines don't pick airports because of glitzy lights, fountains, tiles and amenities.
Airlines pick airports for destinations, locations (flight times), passenger volumes / originating traffic , connections ease and schedules, landing costs, and bottom dollars (filling flights).
Let's break that down for STL and MCI.
Destinations: STL has 10 Fortune 500 companies, MCI has 1 on the Kansas side (Sprint) which looks to being bought by Tmobile soon and literally disolved because of diplications. Not to mention nearly 200 more Fortune 1000 companies than the MCI area. STL is centered perfectly for east coast short hauls and west coast medium hauls. In addition, cities like Tulsa, Wichita, OKC and Omaha are major areas that SWA in now connecting through STL... all of which are too close to MCI... airlines have eliminated most of their short haul flights.
Passenger Volumes / Originating traffic: STL Metro has almost a million more people than the immediate MCI area. Originating traffic will not only allow SWA to provide and fill nonstop flights but then provide the connections from other cities through STL. Originating traffic has to be there for nonstops in the first place. In 4 or even 10 years time, STLs originating traffic will continue to exceed that of the MCI area served.
Connections / schedules: Southwest LITERALLY has their own terminal and now international gates in STL... with room to grow. Their investment in STLs Terminal 2 expansion and growth has been enormous in recent years and continues. MCI's new terminal is a single terminal of 30 gates. SWA will be "sharing' this terminal and gates around theirs with all airlines. This is where SWA "luvs" STL in many ways. They have their own operations (and most likely to add a crew base soon) in STL. SWAs major "hubs" all have this.... Chicago Midway, Phoenix (concourse), Denver (concourse), Dallas LUV, Houston Hobby, Baltimore (concourse), Orlando (concourse), Atlanta (concourse), see the trend.
SWAs growth in STL over the past 15 years has been carefully cultivated. Their route network in the past 20 years (mainly in the past few years with acquiring AirTran) has boomed. They have been strong in crafting a profitable schedule and have grown to be the largest domestic USA carrier. They have went from (with growing pains) as a "low cost" and "focus city" airline to a big contender and legacy (almost 50 years) airline now having to position themselves a little differently moving connections through more less "hubs." They have trimmed fat and have / are luring the business travelers. Overall, they have done an amazing job IMO and STL has not only faired well... They have been poised by SWA for SWAs future growth.
Landing Costs: The new MCI will be funded completely by private dollars and the airlines. They haven't said how much yet.... but the airlines will be paying higher landing costs and gate costs in the new single terminal. Those will be higher, no matter who you ask, than STLs SWA fees. In addition, STL has a larger runway capacity and ability to land / take off during busy times/schedules for all airlines and in inclement weather.
I personally think our hundred of millions of dollars in renovations at STL in all terminals and concourses looks great. No too mention that STL will continue to upgrade.
I think that it is long overdue for a new MCI, but it may be a little too late when looking at airline expansion. The airlines serving MCI now are doing just that "serving" MCI and the demand and traffic they are warranting. The new airport will give travelers a better view and amenities but service will most likely stay the same (as long as the airlines bottom dollars and planes are filled). NEW airports (ask Indy and many others) bring little if any new service or routes. If an airline felt there was money to be made in MCI right now.... They will put their plane on schedule NOW. The "new airport" more service is a myth and the airlines will tell you that too.
But overall, it will be a much better "welcome to KC" than the craphole over there now.
Feel free to repost this in any other forum if you wish
Airlines pick airports for destinations, locations (flight times), passenger volumes / originating traffic , connections ease and schedules, landing costs, and bottom dollars (filling flights).
Let's break that down for STL and MCI.
Destinations: STL has 10 Fortune 500 companies, MCI has 1 on the Kansas side (Sprint) which looks to being bought by Tmobile soon and literally disolved because of diplications. Not to mention nearly 200 more Fortune 1000 companies than the MCI area. STL is centered perfectly for east coast short hauls and west coast medium hauls. In addition, cities like Tulsa, Wichita, OKC and Omaha are major areas that SWA in now connecting through STL... all of which are too close to MCI... airlines have eliminated most of their short haul flights.
Passenger Volumes / Originating traffic: STL Metro has almost a million more people than the immediate MCI area. Originating traffic will not only allow SWA to provide and fill nonstop flights but then provide the connections from other cities through STL. Originating traffic has to be there for nonstops in the first place. In 4 or even 10 years time, STLs originating traffic will continue to exceed that of the MCI area served.
Connections / schedules: Southwest LITERALLY has their own terminal and now international gates in STL... with room to grow. Their investment in STLs Terminal 2 expansion and growth has been enormous in recent years and continues. MCI's new terminal is a single terminal of 30 gates. SWA will be "sharing' this terminal and gates around theirs with all airlines. This is where SWA "luvs" STL in many ways. They have their own operations (and most likely to add a crew base soon) in STL. SWAs major "hubs" all have this.... Chicago Midway, Phoenix (concourse), Denver (concourse), Dallas LUV, Houston Hobby, Baltimore (concourse), Orlando (concourse), Atlanta (concourse), see the trend.
SWAs growth in STL over the past 15 years has been carefully cultivated. Their route network in the past 20 years (mainly in the past few years with acquiring AirTran) has boomed. They have been strong in crafting a profitable schedule and have grown to be the largest domestic USA carrier. They have went from (with growing pains) as a "low cost" and "focus city" airline to a big contender and legacy (almost 50 years) airline now having to position themselves a little differently moving connections through more less "hubs." They have trimmed fat and have / are luring the business travelers. Overall, they have done an amazing job IMO and STL has not only faired well... They have been poised by SWA for SWAs future growth.
Landing Costs: The new MCI will be funded completely by private dollars and the airlines. They haven't said how much yet.... but the airlines will be paying higher landing costs and gate costs in the new single terminal. Those will be higher, no matter who you ask, than STLs SWA fees. In addition, STL has a larger runway capacity and ability to land / take off during busy times/schedules for all airlines and in inclement weather.
I personally think our hundred of millions of dollars in renovations at STL in all terminals and concourses looks great. No too mention that STL will continue to upgrade.
I think that it is long overdue for a new MCI, but it may be a little too late when looking at airline expansion. The airlines serving MCI now are doing just that "serving" MCI and the demand and traffic they are warranting. The new airport will give travelers a better view and amenities but service will most likely stay the same (as long as the airlines bottom dollars and planes are filled). NEW airports (ask Indy and many others) bring little if any new service or routes. If an airline felt there was money to be made in MCI right now.... They will put their plane on schedule NOW. The "new airport" more service is a myth and the airlines will tell you that too.
But overall, it will be a much better "welcome to KC" than the craphole over there now.
Feel free to repost this in any other forum if you wish
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^Thank you for the insight. I was going to ask this exact question, as I had concerns that this would take away some of the momentum here.
http://www.kansascity.com/news/politics ... 21881.html
This article makes it sound like KC's current crap-port is holding it back and STL is the beneficiary.
From the article, referring to KCI:
http://www.kansascity.com/news/politics ... 21881.html
This article makes it sound like KC's current crap-port is holding it back and STL is the beneficiary.
From the article, referring to KCI:
It’s off-putting enough that Southwest has added flights at St. Louis Lambert International Airport, even though the cost per passenger in St. Louis is about double what it is in Kansas City.
“Yet we’re adding more services there because the customer experience at KCI is so bad,” Sisneros said.
I agree with everything Matguy said. I think KC will see some more Southwest flights because they will be able to funnel some traffic thru their but they won't be taking flights from here. They can't really start a route there without the O&D to support it at the moment. Once they have the new airport anything that is 100 PDEW they could probably start the route up and make work. Like Matguy said they aren't going to be moving our feeder flights there because it is too short of a flight. 4 years from now we will even be built up more. We hopefully will have that Southwest base by then.
I actually think once they have a new airport a different airline (not southwest) "COULD" move in and expand. I could see Alaska using them as a mid con focus-ish city if they ever decide to fill in the middle of the country better. They can run E175s to both coasts from KC so it makes a good central point. There wouldn't be many good other options for a central focus city, that aren't already taken by someone else. Not saying they would do it but I could see the appeal. If that were to happen, Southwest would probably shrink there.
Either way I don't think it should have much of an impact on us.
I actually think once they have a new airport a different airline (not southwest) "COULD" move in and expand. I could see Alaska using them as a mid con focus-ish city if they ever decide to fill in the middle of the country better. They can run E175s to both coasts from KC so it makes a good central point. There wouldn't be many good other options for a central focus city, that aren't already taken by someone else. Not saying they would do it but I could see the appeal. If that were to happen, Southwest would probably shrink there.
Either way I don't think it should have much of an impact on us.
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^ This also is based on if its done on time and on budget, which for terminals many times is not. Also the landing fees will be much higher than present there while by then it will be even lower than it is now here.
Also as of right now it seems there the issue is more not losing service due to weak demand. Any losses here are often temporary and is for reasons other than demand. So idea of losing flights to there is a bit off as it is now. Adds there would likely be in addition to already existing flights here and likely timed similarly. If you look at numbers there seems to be healthy local demand increase here and its not all connections driving growth.
Biggest thing is what will Southwest be in the 5-10 year timeframe in terms of how it works and fleet size and composition. it seems near certain they will be noticably larger here than now irregardless of KC due to inability to grow much if any more than now in Chicago or Dallas.
Also as of right now it seems there the issue is more not losing service due to weak demand. Any losses here are often temporary and is for reasons other than demand. So idea of losing flights to there is a bit off as it is now. Adds there would likely be in addition to already existing flights here and likely timed similarly. If you look at numbers there seems to be healthy local demand increase here and its not all connections driving growth.
Biggest thing is what will Southwest be in the 5-10 year timeframe in terms of how it works and fleet size and composition. it seems near certain they will be noticably larger here than now irregardless of KC due to inability to grow much if any more than now in Chicago or Dallas.
I also just noticed that on my phone it also shows a picture caption that says "Rhonda said more international flights will be added over the next year"jshank83 wrote: ↑Nov 07, 2017https://www.bizjournals.com/stlouis/new ... round.html
Locked article on retail at the airport. Just curious if it says anything of note. Thanks.
Not sure if that means what has been announced or more announcements to come. I am hoping at some point they unlock the article or stltoday does a report or something.
EDIT: I found someone that gave me the transcript.
More international flights — a lack of which has long been a complaint of travelers — also is on the horizon over the next 12-18 months, she added.
The wing tips lounge will open in Terminal 2 next month.