Apparently drunkrusski doesn't know that bonwich works for the post dispatch, and has, at his disposal, mountains of back articles that we don't have. Because he's stated who he is, and helped us with info in the past, I think he deserves the benefit of the doubt.
Direct quote from the P-D, 10/22/05. It can't be linked, because newspapers don't hold old articles online anymore. (Fair use, however, lets me quote a small portion as I did.)
The same numbers are cited in about ten other articles from the time. You could, rather than blathering without backup, simply Google "costello bridge '$150 million'," but I suppose it's easier to just post mindlessly. Your call.
The same numbers are cited in about ten other articles from the time. You could, rather than blathering without backup, simply Google "costello bridge '$150 million'," but I suppose it's easier to just post mindlessly. Your call.
- 120
Fine... I guess I was wrong. I think the paper I read only showed the earmarks in the Senate, where Missouri had more.
I still believe that how much each state managed to pull in matters. They stake their reputation on these bills, and probably gave up some other things to get this funding. If Illinois really is contributing more in federal, then Missouri should fork up a bigger part of the cost if they are really interested in doing this project. I still believe Illinois should pay the bigger part, being that it will benefit Illinois more than it will Saint Louis.
I still believe that how much each state managed to pull in matters. They stake their reputation on these bills, and probably gave up some other things to get this funding. If Illinois really is contributing more in federal, then Missouri should fork up a bigger part of the cost if they are really interested in doing this project. I still believe Illinois should pay the bigger part, being that it will benefit Illinois more than it will Saint Louis.
- 11K
So are we in fact getting the "designer" bridge with simply fewer lanes? This doesn't seem to add up when considering construction costs, traffic demands, etc. Anyone venture a guess as to what we're getting?
- 476
Ive thought about this for the past few days and Im honestly OK with half the lanes of the former bridge proposal. If we end up having a new bridge built across the Mississippi in the next 5 years I will be very happy indeed.
If you look at the renderings, the cable-staid bridge that is proposed has A-frame towers. My guess is that they will build identical towers to what is proposed but only put half the lanes of roadway that was originally asked for. These towers will be able to support much more weight. So additions may come afterwords. I think its a little late in the game to completely redesign the bridge so I think it just comes downt to cutting down the cost. As long as this bridge is built, despite its lowered size, I think it will relieve traffic and pressure on the poplar in a very substantial way. I think that our politicians and Illinois politians should really get behind this.
If you look at the renderings, the cable-staid bridge that is proposed has A-frame towers. My guess is that they will build identical towers to what is proposed but only put half the lanes of roadway that was originally asked for. These towers will be able to support much more weight. So additions may come afterwords. I think its a little late in the game to completely redesign the bridge so I think it just comes downt to cutting down the cost. As long as this bridge is built, despite its lowered size, I think it will relieve traffic and pressure on the poplar in a very substantial way. I think that our politicians and Illinois politians should really get behind this.
- 2,005
I don't know how they can build a bridge using the current design and just leaving lanes off. The current design is for eight lanes. There are some engineering concerns like the effects of the wind, lack of weight of a bridge deck that would make it very tough for the bridge to remain standing when the time comes for expansion. When they say future expansion it can only be another bridge ala the Blanchette or Boone. Luckily this part of the river is pretty wide so I hope the design remains the same, but scaled down.
As long as safety isn't compromised, I don't care how many lanes it has! Just get started before the cost of what they're going to do now balloons to over a BILLION DOLLARS 
- 69
Little Egyptian wrote:...I think the real question is whether or not Missouri should make a real contribution to this bridge or whether they should be allowed to get away with paying virtually nothing for a new symbol of Saint Louis and of their state.
To me, it depends on how much they hack up the original design for the new "symbol" of StL...I'd rather not pay anything for another PSB. That's just my opinion though.
Bi-state Mississippi Bridge deal awaits passage of Illinois capital bill
By ALAN J. ORTBALS
An agreement on the new Mississippi River Bridge could be announced soon, according to Cong. Jerry Costello.
He says that the Illinois Department of Transportation and the Missouri Department of Transportation have reached a tentative agreement on a free, non-toll bridge. Announcement of the agreement is pending passage of a capital bill by the
cont...
http://www.ibjonline.com/mississippi_br ... modot.html
the photo below is from www.newriverbridge.org...
![]()
By ALAN J. ORTBALS
An agreement on the new Mississippi River Bridge could be announced soon, according to Cong. Jerry Costello.
He says that the Illinois Department of Transportation and the Missouri Department of Transportation have reached a tentative agreement on a free, non-toll bridge. Announcement of the agreement is pending passage of a capital bill by the
cont...
http://www.ibjonline.com/mississippi_br ... modot.html
the photo below is from www.newriverbridge.org...
- 8,912
^
I'm confused. so we might finally be getting "a striking new addition to the regional riverfront.?"
If so, this is more GREAT news
New Mississippi River Bridge
The bridge's 1500-foot main span meets US Coast Guard requirements to maintain navigational safety on the Mississippi River. It will be one of the longest cable-stayed bridges in the U.S. It will provide four mainline traffic lanes in each direction with inside and outside shoulders, for a total of eight lanes. The shoulders are full lane width to accommodate emergency, maintenance and repair needs with the least impact on traffic flow. The redesigned structure and approaches represents a substantial cost savings while retaining a striking new addition to the regional riverfront.
I'm confused. so we might finally be getting "a striking new addition to the regional riverfront.?"
If so, this is more GREAT news
Those were the original plans. Who knows what we will get now besides a toll free bridge north of downtown.
The website is updated, but it includes a mix of the old and new plans. You have to check what you're reading, to make sure you you have the most recent update on the bridge. With the politicians constantly making changes, it's difficult to tell what is and isnt still on board.
- 362
But, I take it the latest design we have to go off of is the "M" design with the two major piers resembling 2 big white Ms. That is the last design that was released, right? Anyone got something different? As much of a step back as the M design was from the original design with the 2 central curved piers, I still would take the M design bridge in a heartbeat over something that looked like the PSB.
Yeah, if we're gonna build a bridge, it might as well look good, right? We don't need another concrete slab that spans the river, a la PSB.
That pic Xing posted is confusing. What we really need to do is make the highway system on the East side less confusing.
That pic Xing posted is confusing. What we really need to do is make the highway system on the East side less confusing.
- 2,386
If the final design is the M - design, then as far as I'm concerned we are getting a huge win. Just PLEASE GOD let there be lights. Bright, colorful lights. At the top, along the cables, whatever, just light the damn thing up. I still have no idea why the PSB and Eads arent much brighter than they are now. How bout some blue neon lights along the PSB. Anything to give the river some character.
jesus, if they can light the bridge at Alton you think they could at St. Louis...
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- 362
Finally. It is not what the doctor ordered, but it is a start and will certainly be an improvement.
So, according to the report it is a cable stay bridge, so we are probably getting the "M" design.
What is this 4-6 years to complete! If they could have this done in 6 years that would be fantastic, 4 years would be a miracle. With all the rerouting of interstate approaches and new intersections, I figured this was a 10 year project.
I hope this report is true. Hopefully KMOX has all their ducks in a row on this one because it looks like MoDot and IDot are ready to deny, deny, deny.
So, according to the report it is a cable stay bridge, so we are probably getting the "M" design.
What is this 4-6 years to complete! If they could have this done in 6 years that would be fantastic, 4 years would be a miracle. With all the rerouting of interstate approaches and new intersections, I figured this was a 10 year project.
I hope this report is true. Hopefully KMOX has all their ducks in a row on this one because it looks like MoDot and IDot are ready to deny, deny, deny.
- 2,005
It's a tentative agreement so I wouldn't have too much hope.
Can we merge this with the origianal thread.
http://www.urbanstl.com/viewtopic.php?t=263&start=735
Can we merge this with the origianal thread.
http://www.urbanstl.com/viewtopic.php?t=263&start=735
- 11K
Officials optimistic, but say no bridge deal in place yet
BY MIKE FITZGERALD
News-Democrat
Illinois and Missouri highway officials said there is growing optimism that a deal still will be struck to build a new multi-million-dollar bridge over the Mississippi River.
However, work remains on plans to build the long-stalled crossing. They said they could not verify reports circulated Monday by some news media that the two states have reached a tentative agreement to build a $600 million toll-free bridge north of downtown St. Louis.
The value of any bi-state agreement would depend on the Illinois General Assembly's approval of a proposed $24 billion capital improvements plan to be funded by a massive -- and controversial -- expansion of the state's gambling industry. The program has already passed in the Senate, but is awaiting a vote in the House.
If the legislature approves the capital works plan, "that will be a very positive development for the Mississippi River bridge project because it will provide funding," said Mike Claffey, a spokesman for the Illinois Department of Transportation.
So far the only money set aside for the bridge project -- whose latest price tag is $1 billion, including required highway realignments -- is coming from the federal government, in the form of a $164 million allocation to Illinois, and a $75 million earmark to Missouri.
A St. Louis radio station, citing anonymous sources, reported the two states have agreed to build a four-lane bridge that would cross the river in the same location where a larger, eight-lane bridge was first proposed -- north of the Martin Luther King Bridge.
.....................................
Kevin Killeen, the KMOX reporter who wrote the bridge story, stated in an e-mail message to the News-Democrat that a draft agreement exists between the two states, and that the station stands by the report.
.....................................
East-West Gateway, which represents cities and counties in Missouri and Illinois, earlier this year had proposed kicking in $20 million to the bridge project.
"Anything that Missouri commits to we'd have to support because they're committing money that we're allocating," Sterman said. "So as far as I know there can't be any deal without going through our board of directors."
Contact reporter Mike Fitzgerald at mfitzgerald@bnd.com or 239-2533.
trent wrote: What we really need to do is make the highway system on the East side less confusing.
I totally agree! Major simplification is needed. Motorist headed westbound jump lanes continually. No fault to them, the area is rather poorly marked. The backup created at the 55 southbound exit only lane on the PSB is quite dangerous as cars come around the curve and meet stopped traffic. I think some metro-Illinois resident are confused about the Eads and MLK bridge and opt to use PSB because it's easier to navigate. I've been involved in two accident in this area, both times by an out of town motorist abruptly changing lanes to make their intended exit.
Lighting would be very nice too. Something bold to create life and give the area a presence. Even the boring concrete bridges can benefit greatly from creative uses of light.
- 362
I was just looking at the whole project again and their website, and I am still confused about this lane thing. I just read on the website (which I assume is out of date) that in the new (M) design, the plan was to build 4 traffic lanes with 2 emergency lanes on each side of each direction of traffic, for a total of 8 lanes.
I assume that was the so called "8 lane plan." But, if the plan was only to build 4 traffic lanes all along and all we are losing are the emergency lanes (with the potential for expansion), it doesn't seem as bad. We really needed more than 4 lanes of traffic, but it looks like that is all Missouri is willing to agree upon, even though Illinois is funding it. It is certainly an attempt to limit the flow of traffic into Saint Louis.
I don't know. I wish they would just announce this thing and get it started.
I assume that was the so called "8 lane plan." But, if the plan was only to build 4 traffic lanes all along and all we are losing are the emergency lanes (with the potential for expansion), it doesn't seem as bad. We really needed more than 4 lanes of traffic, but it looks like that is all Missouri is willing to agree upon, even though Illinois is funding it. It is certainly an attempt to limit the flow of traffic into Saint Louis.
I don't know. I wish they would just announce this thing and get it started.
- 2,772
Billkn wrote:trent wrote: What we really need to do is make the highway system on the East side less confusing.
I totally agree! Major simplification is needed. Motorist headed westbound jump lanes continually. No fault to them, the area is rather poorly marked. The backup created at the 55 southbound exit only lane on the PSB is quite dangerous as cars come around the curve and meet stopped traffic. I think some metro-Illinois resident are confused about the Eads and MLK bridge and opt to use PSB because it's easier to navigate. I've been involved in two accident in this area, both times by an out of town motorist abruptly changing lanes to make their intended exit.
Every day on the way to work I am slowed to about 10-15 miles per hour for (close to) 1 mile so the last second 55/44 travelers can make their merge on to the ramp. I am always sure to stay in the left hand lane until I pass that area. So basically 64 turns in to a 1 lane highway for a mile or so.
Optimism rising on bridge plan, but bi-state leaders can't confirm deal
Proposed Mississippi River bridgeBut bi-state leaders can't confirm report of deal reached
BY MIKE FITZGERALD
News-Democrat
Illinois and Missouri highway officials said there is growing optimism that a deal still will be struck to build a new multimillion-dollar bridge over the Mississippi River.
However, work remains on plans to build the long-stalled crossing. They said they could not verify reports circulated Monday by some news media that the two states have reached a tentative agreement to build a $600 million toll-free bridge north of downtown St. Louis.
The value of any bi-state agreement would depend on approval by the Illinois General Assembly of a proposed $24 billion capital improvements plan to be funded by a massive -- and controversial -- expansion of the state's gambling industry. The program has already passed in the Senate, but is awaiting a vote in the House.
If the legislature approves the capital works plan, "that will be a very positive development for the Mississippi River bridge project because it will provide funding," said Mike Claffey, a spokesman for the Illinois Department of Transportation.
So far the only money set aside for the bridge project -- whose latest price tag is $1 billion, including required highway realignments -- is coming from the federal government, in the form of a $164 million allocation to Illinois, and a $75 million earmark to Missouri.
cont...
http://www.bnd.com/homepage/story/154029.html
Proposed Mississippi River bridgeBut bi-state leaders can't confirm report of deal reached
BY MIKE FITZGERALD
News-Democrat
Illinois and Missouri highway officials said there is growing optimism that a deal still will be struck to build a new multimillion-dollar bridge over the Mississippi River.
However, work remains on plans to build the long-stalled crossing. They said they could not verify reports circulated Monday by some news media that the two states have reached a tentative agreement to build a $600 million toll-free bridge north of downtown St. Louis.
The value of any bi-state agreement would depend on approval by the Illinois General Assembly of a proposed $24 billion capital improvements plan to be funded by a massive -- and controversial -- expansion of the state's gambling industry. The program has already passed in the Senate, but is awaiting a vote in the House.
If the legislature approves the capital works plan, "that will be a very positive development for the Mississippi River bridge project because it will provide funding," said Mike Claffey, a spokesman for the Illinois Department of Transportation.
So far the only money set aside for the bridge project -- whose latest price tag is $1 billion, including required highway realignments -- is coming from the federal government, in the form of a $164 million allocation to Illinois, and a $75 million earmark to Missouri.
cont...
http://www.bnd.com/homepage/story/154029.html