Kirkwood Looks to Demo Downtown Buildings for Parking

mill204 · PostOct 07, 2011#12011-10-07T16:34+00:00

As originally reported by the Post-Dispatch and then nextSTL and Gateway Streets, Kirkwood has entered into a contract to purchase two downtown buildings on West Jefferson with the intention of demolishing them and turning the land into a parking lot. Combined with an adjacent 44-space city owned lot, the new expanding parking lot will have room for 90 vehicles. Total cost, about $1.46 million or about $32000 per new parking space. One of the buildings was formerly the home of Mel Bay Music Center.

At the city council meeting yesterday, the mayor and many of the council members spoke of the availability of -two- buildings as a "rare and great" opportunity to increase parking for the historic downtown core. Parking in downtown Kirkwood was said to have been a problem going back to the 1950s. Business groups seem to all be in favor of more parking.

One councilman indicated he was unsure whether the quoted number of existing parking spaces included the spaces already on the property of the two buildings suggesting that the new lot may only increase total parking by 34 spaces or fewer. Another councilman got a ballpark figure for creating a two level parking garage on the parking lot on East Jefferson across from the library. Estimated cost of $2 million for 48 additional parking spaces.

The city council passed the first reading by a 5-2 vote with 2 abstentions. Two of the yea votes were undecideds indicating their votes were only for moving the process forward and not for support of the building demolition and increased parking.

Alex Ihnen · PostOct 07, 2011#22011-10-07T16:39+00:00

^ Thanks for the update. It needs to be pointed out that while the garage option appears more expensive, demolished usable buildings for a city-owned free parking lot forgoes future revenue from sales/property tax. I've heard for a couple Kirkwood residents who were unaware this was occurring. It seems there may be some vocal opposition in the near future.

PostOct 07, 2011#32011-10-07T16:49+00:00

Great anonymous comment from the Gateway Streets post:

As a Kirkwood resident i think there is a parking problem in downtown but tearing down this building (it is not historic) is not the answer. Most of the people who are trying to park downtown are local Kirkwood residents but the sidewalks, walking or biking infrastructure is so bad in Kirkwood that people will drive 5 blocks rather than walk. Take the money and improve the sidewalks, widen then, put in crosswalk buttons. slow the traffic on Kirkwood Rd. In my opinion kill the parking on Kirkwood Rd and widen the sidewalks on add more crosswalks and crosswalk signals along Kirkwood Rd., especially down by McDonalds. This would make it more inviting for people to walk or ride there bike rather than drive.

There is a parking lot across from Highland's that is private use but is rarely used. Why does the city just buy the rights to to the lots. It is at least 20 spots that could be used. Make it public parking after a certain hour when the businesses are closed.

dredger · PostOct 07, 2011#42011-10-07T18:34+00:00

Alex Ihnen wrote:Great anonymous comment from the Gateway Streets post:

As a Kirkwood resident i think there is a parking problem in downtown but tearing down this building (it is not historic) is not the answer. Most of the people who are trying to park downtown are local Kirkwood residents but the sidewalks, walking or biking infrastructure is so bad in Kirkwood that people will drive 5 blocks rather than walk. Take the money and improve the sidewalks, widen then, put in crosswalk buttons. slow the traffic on Kirkwood Rd. In my opinion kill the parking on Kirkwood Rd and widen the sidewalks on add more crosswalks and crosswalk signals along Kirkwood Rd., especially down by McDonalds. This would make it more inviting for people to walk or ride there bike rather than drive.

There is a parking lot across from Highland's that is private use but is rarely used. Why does the city just buy the rights to to the lots. It is at least 20 spots that could be used. Make it public parking after a certain hour when the businesses are closed.

Their is some private metered parking lots in my new hometown, Walnut Creek, CA. The owners simply painted numbers between the strips and installed a payment machine. You pay, print out the reciept and slip on the dash board. You have no idea if the honor system is working but recovering a car is a lot more expensive, or at least it is with City of Berkeley. I wondered if the owner of the private lot if considered or aware that their is money to be made when demand is sufficient.

debaliviere · PostOct 07, 2011#52011-10-07T19:22+00:00

I visit downtown Kirkwood frequently, at various times of the day/week. Sometimes I'm able to get a spot in one of the lots, sometimes I can't. Even when I can't, I'll park on one of the side streets within a few blocks of whichever establishment I'm visiting, and it's no big deal because the walk is pleasant. There's just no need for this demolition.

gary kreie · PostOct 07, 2011#62011-10-07T20:25+00:00

There is a nearly-new large parking garage right behind Bar Louie and behind where Ben and Jerry's used to be -- just East of the plaza and fountain that is just South of the railroad tracks. Parking is free there, and I have never seen it even remotely full. Is two blocks too far to walk to get do Deweys? Parking can be a little tight on weekends off Jefferson, but I eat there frequently, and have never had to walk more than two short blocks, and usually a lot less than that. I guess that sounds like a long ways in a small town. I'd rather keep the buildings -- people don't frequent Kirkwood to take in the parking.

Alex Ihnen · PostOct 07, 2011#72011-10-07T21:09+00:00

^ I hope that people here opposed to the demolition will voice your opinion to the Kirkwood Mayor and City Council:

http://www.ci.kirkwood.mo.us/content/Ci ... uncil.aspx

mill204 · PostOct 31, 2011#82011-10-31T16:09+00:00

The Kirkwood City Council will meet Nov 3 at 7pm to further discuss the issue.

Alex Ihnen · PostOct 31, 2011#92011-10-31T17:10+00:00

The nextSTL story for reference: http://nextstl.com/st-louis-county/self ... or-parking

moorlander · PostNov 01, 2011#102011-11-01T02:57+00:00

I frequent Dowtown Kirkwood. I can't remember ever really having a problem finding a parking spot. Weird

quincunx · PostDec 15, 2011#112011-12-15T04:19+00:00

The vote of the city council is tomorrow. $1.5M for 31 parking spaces is crazy.

Alex Ihnen · PostDec 15, 2011#122011-12-15T04:38+00:00

I just sent the following nextSTL article to everyone on the city council:

http://nextstl.com/st-louis-county/self ... or-parking

(Kirkwood City Council email addresses)
griffite@kirkwoodmo.org
yuanih@kirkwoodmo.org
biedengj@kirkwoodmo.org
jaksetgm@kirkwoodmo.org
wardpw@kirkwoodmo.org
searsjr@kirkwoodmo.org
mcdonnaj@kirkwoodmo.org

quincunx · PostDec 15, 2011#132011-12-15T18:35+00:00

Gerry Biedenstein and Gina Jaksetic oppose.

Here's the KSDK story from last night.

"You just have to learn to walk a block or so," Trevino said.

http://www.ksdk.com/news/local/story.as ... yid=291218

Alex Ihnen · PostDec 15, 2011#142011-12-15T19:25+00:00

Hopefully enough pressure can be brought to stop this.

rbeedee · PostDec 17, 2011#152011-12-17T02:49+00:00

Kirkwood council oks razing buildings

5-2 vote, $1.2 million for the demolition of 2 buildings for 45 parking spaces, sold as a way to "enhance downtown development." Absurd.

framer · PostDec 17, 2011#162011-12-17T05:38+00:00

Sigh.

Alex Ihnen · PostDec 18, 2011#172011-12-18T04:26+00:00

The best (worst) quote was from a "yes" councilman who said, "Kirkwood doesn't stand still." What does that even mean. It's very very difficult to see this as anything other than Kirkwood thinking it's competing with new ultra-car centric developments on the basis of parking. They're going to lose. But the time they realize it let's hope they haven't bulldozed all of downtown Kirkwood.

mill204 · PostDec 19, 2011#182011-12-19T07:33+00:00

rbeedee wrote:Kirkwood council oks razing buildings

5-2 vote, $1.2 million for the demolition of 2 buildings for 45 parking spaces, sold as a way to "enhance downtown development." Absurd.

Or as one of the council members pointed out, it's actually $1.2 million for ~31 spaces as the building lots already have "private" parking spaces.

Alex Ihnen · PostDec 19, 2011#192011-12-19T19:23+00:00

^ AND the $1.2M is only the purchase price of the buildings, not the demo cost, or the cost of building/surfacing a parking lot.

moorlander · PostAug 15, 2012#202012-08-15T16:54+00:00

onecity · PostAug 15, 2012#212012-08-15T18:12+00:00

This doesn't have to suck. Has anyone been to downtown Lawrence, KS? Mass St. is a very strong and dense business district, full of 2-3 story storefront/office/restaurant buildings for 5 blocks from 6th to 11th St., with adjoining Vermont and NH streets being similarly business-dense. In Lawrence all the public parking is concentrated into a few large lots on the west side of NH (including a multilevel garage between 9th and 10th) and the east side of VT, while leaving Mass St. completely intact. It works pretty well, and though I do not know what buildings were razed in order to build the lots, VT and NH don't feel like vast expanses of surface parking or like they are particularly missing anything, since the lots occur about every other block. And although there is often a slight lack of parking at peak times, you can park two blocks out in the surrounding neighborhoods, spend another 1 or 2 minutes on your feet, and be on your way. No problems.

That said, Lawrence has I believe banned the construction of indoor shopping malls in the city limits in order to protect its central business district, which I am sure has helped its downtown remain vibrant and urban.

quincunx · PostNov 16, 2021#222021-11-16T18:27+00:00

NextSTL - Leverage The Lots, Balance the Books in Kirkwood

https://nextstl.com/2021/11/leverage-th ... -kirkwood/

symphonicpoet · PostNov 17, 2021#232021-11-17T04:26+00:00

^Generally fantastic ideas. I'd add to this adjusting the real estate tax to charge by land value rather than building value. (Assuming Kirkwood can do that without everyone getting run out of city hall on a rail.)

gary kreie · PostNov 17, 2021#242021-11-17T14:05+00:00

I live just across the tracks on the South side of the blue bridge, and earlier I lived in Station Plaza Apartments along the South side of the tracks for 4 years. For some reason, folks are psychologically reluctant to park South of the tracks and walk across to restaurants on the other side of the tracks.

Of the two large free garages behind Station Plaza, only one ever fills up - and only if there is a rare concert right on the plaza. And the other one is never full. There are small signs at their entrances that say "public parking", but I think most folks think those are for apartment and condo residents only. Also, the free parking lot across from the Police Station on Madison is never full after working hours -- except for a rare concert at Station Plaza. Private parking lots behind businesses on Monroe sit empty after 5. Street parking is always available along Madison and Clay just over the blue railroad bridge.

Maybe we need some signage along Argonne by Billy Gs, Clementine's, and later 4 Hands informing drivers that there is more free parking just across the blue bridge then left down Madison to lots, garages, and street parking.

We either need to push parking to the periphery and expect non-disabled folks to walk a block or two, or build a single large garage in the center of Kirkwood hidden behind new retail.

MarkHaversham · PostNov 17, 2021#252021-11-17T21:07+00:00

Okay, who volunteers to check the Park Kirkwood app six times a day and record the amount of open parking?