urbanSTL

I just got a chance to thumb through a copy of the book at work. It is amazing how much has changed in the last 45 years. The part that saddens me most is looking at Jefferson Avenue (Market to the north anyway) before it was widened. There were so many buildings along it, not anymore. The other part that saddened me was seeing how Chouteau looked(just west of downtown) in the not so recent past.



It must have been something to live back then before TVs and internet boards



Another item of note was that in July 1953 most of the streets downtown became one-way.

I have the book as well, and it is fascinating. What also surprises me, and gives me some hope, is how ugly parts of the city -- including downtown -- looked in the mid 1960s. The influx of surface parking is, in my estimation, the primary reason. Some areas have actually improved since 40 years ago.

Wow, I just saw all these pictures for the first time. THANKS!



It really jarred me when I would see an intersection I'm familiar with today, and realized the main differance between then and now is the MISSING BUILDINGS! Especially on the corners. What a damn shame we lost so many of those! Thank god we still have so many left, though.



I'm gonna have to run out and get this book.

I've seen that book ... but personally I find the pictures almost too painfull to look at. Everytime I see them I'm just stunned at how much urbanity was lost. I just don't understand how our parenst generation could let all of that just crumble away. Didn't anybody gove a damn about their city? How could any city let gaslight square be demolished? What in god's name were they thikning when they took out the street car lines? I'm just dumb founded. Those pics show exactly the kind of enviroment that cities are crawling over themselves to develope today. Sadly I doubt we'll ever come close to equalling what we once had. ... makes me want cry.

I thought this was interesting...



MetroLink line compared to the Hodiamont streetcar line:







http://www.apta.com/research/info/onlin ... h2new3.cfm





Here is a map of the East St. Louis streetcar network at its peak:







http://hometown.aol.com/chirailfan/eslmapt.html





And finally, here's a map of the entire St. Louis streetcar system in 1920!







You can order it on EBay!!! Just type in "St. Louis streetcar" and you'll find it! What a treasure!

There was a streetcar that travelled between Sprinfield, Il and downtown StL. I believe it was taken out in the late fifties or early sixties, but I remember seeing it. It was blue with a silver roof and ran along the main RR tracks (in Illinois) that run up to Chicago and Detroit. Not a comuter train, but a regular electric streetcar.

Wish one day the streecars come roling down grand ave again,maybe futuristic cars in the newly created entertainment district at Grand centre.I think its agreat idea.Would attract younger people to move in the area.

It'd be nice, but that's a long ways off. Personally, I'd ride the MetroLink more often if there was street car service down Grand.

SWEET. I say scrap the ubber-retro/classic/wooden streetcars of Joe Edwards and bring back the Art Deco dreams!

Well, in the first pic, there's a "Grand-Franklin Drug" store. So I'd say it's a safe bet that that picture is of the N Grand and MLK intersection.

Hmm, my bad.

buhgmlubbuh::



sorry, I just threw up a bit in my mouth after seeing these and realizing how moronic city leaders were to get rid of these things. All in favor of overthrowing the city government and bringing back the gulfstream streetcars!?

TO THE BARRICADES . . . er, the STREETCARS!!!



Acutally, does anyone know how much of the system is intact? Busdad maybe? I've heard that many, if not most, of the tracks still exist and have just been paved over. Seriously though about the streetcars (does Joe Edwards check this site), don't go with 1920's - the 1960's+ cars were bigger and very cool.

Are we missing a unique style of architecture?



In the first photo the three story row houses look like a style that no longer exists in St. Louis. Are they a variation of urban Queen Anne?



I love the commercial buildings in the first photo with all the limestone and the shields and bird like statues.

This is one of the best threads ever! Great job, citylover.

In the first photo the three story row houses look like a style that no longer exists in St. Louis. Are they a variation of urban Queen Anne?



I also noticed those row houses. I haven't seen anything like them anywhere in the city. Where was this again?

Acutally, does anyone know how much of the system is intact? Busdad maybe? I've heard that many, if not most, of the tracks still exist and have just been paved over.

I did see a rail peaking out through a pothole on Pershing near DeBaliviere a few months ago.

I've seen them on Olive near the Superman Building - I wonder if the rails were removed when Gaslight Square was built.

PullyMan wrote:

Acutally, does anyone know how much of the system is intact? Busdad maybe? I've heard that many, if not most, of the tracks still exist and have just been paved over.

I did see a rail peaking out through a pothole on Pershing near DeBaliviere a few months ago.

Even if the entire system was still intact, but covered... could they be economically unearthed and made functional?

Citylover, what a fantastic thread!



I purchased this tome when it was first released (and it wasn't cheap for a paperback!). It's worth every penny though.



It alternately excites me, and depresses me, when I look at these pictures...



I'm excited by how much of our built environment and infrastructure remains, along with the possibility of attracting quality infill and perhaps reclaiming at least some of the original streetcar routes. (Trent, I agree that Grand would be a great place to start given the steady and significant volume of riders, and I would get a lot more use out of Metrolink if a streetcar line was available there).



I get rather depressed, though, when I see the pictures (especially of North Saint Louis and Midtown) where wanton and wholesale demolition has erased most if not all traces of our city's past. Even though the potential for interesting infill exists, unfortunately our city's leaders are often unwilling to accept denser, more modern development. Instead, we wind up with poorly-integrated developments that are usually insulting and cheap imitations of the past. Hopefully, given time and continued investment in the city, we can preserve more of our built environment and demand better quality with new construction.



BTW, if I had the $$$$$ to buy a block or two of city buildings, here's where I'd like to start. This stretch is amazingly intact, and Saint Anthony of Padua Catholic Church makes for a great neighborhood anchor IMHO.







I wouldn't mind having at least one of those 1950s cars in the picture either!

I found this site with old pictures of St. Louis streetcars. I did a search of our board and didn't get a hit, so I thought i'd post the link.



http://davesrailpix.com/stl/stl.htm