I remembering hearing rumblings a few months back about this proposal. Could these be possible renderings in the Laclede's Landing TOD Draft Plan? If so it looks like a sizable proposal, at least 20 stories.




In the context of the form based district.

Alex Ihnen wrote:^ people who don't want an elevated Interstate roaring by? Just sayin'.

Alex,

What's your level of confidence that if we're patient we'll eventually see the tear down. Seems like you've accepted there's just no way it happens until this 2015 stuff passes.

But after that, do you think we'll see momentum build and leaders who are currently preoccupied join the push?

It sounded like Lewis Reed certainly intends to.

You and many others are far more connected than I am, but for whatever reason I've developed the impression that the tear down may not be super short-term, but that in 10-20 years it probably won't still be standing.

Does that seem about right? Or at least relatively plausible?

arch city wrote:

Alex Ihnen wrote:^ people who don't want an elevated Interstate roaring by? Just sayin'.

Your grievances are well-published.

Two words: Mansion House

Also, I think in EVERY major city across this country, there are residential high-rises overlooking highway and elevated freeways. In some cities, they are paying MILLIONS for units in them. A loud boulevard - no matter the traffic calming techniques implemented - would be no different in my opinion.

Keep in mind, too, that I like the boulevard concept.

Yeah I would imagine a project of this scale would have pretty good sound proofing. The views would be phenomenal.

arch city wrote:Also, I think in EVERY major city across this country, there are residential high-rises overlooking highway and elevated freeways. In some cities, they are paying MILLIONS for units in them. A loud boulevard - no matter the traffic calming techniques implemented - would be no different in my opinion.

That's very true. You're more familiar with Houston and Atlanta than me, but I know this is the case there. I suppose the difference is that it's driven by demand there, i.e., sometimes locations by the highway are the only practical places to put dense developments like these. That said, while demand in St. Louis is nowhere close to what it is in those cities or others in the Sunbelt, I think there are people that would overlook the negative presence of the elevated highway to be steps away from Laclede's Landing, the arch grounds, and the heart of downtown. And the views would be absolutely incredible.

I think the highway is here to stay for now, but I can't help but to hold out some hope that we get new leadership at the city and state levels that understand the cost benefits associated with removing that infrastructure as well as the economic opportunity that would arise from clearance of the highway and opening up new parcels for development along Memorial Drive. I'm no fan of the likely timeline for something like this, but I don't believe in giving up that vision, either.

The one good thing (if you can call it that) of building high-rises directly next to elevated routes is that there's a built-in reason to include interior parking versus an open-air lot. In a community meeting I was at in Chicago, a developer was sharing plans for a 24+ story residential tower directly next to an elevated train line. And sure enough, the enclosed parking ended about ten feet above where the trains' roofs would be. And that's basically true of most other buildings adjacent to high-volume routes, be those highways or train lines.

With that said, of course, the elevated highway needs to go (and Washington Avenue needs to stay open). If Drury is willing to move soon though on a mid-rise, more power to them! It could only help efforts to #buildtheblvd once and for all.

Edit: Inside info, so shhh! don't tell anyone, but in a previous job, I had access to some redevelopment/planning docs from 25+ years ago and a similar idea was there then too for this parcel. As well as a large full block building on the current Morgan Street parking lot. So if H3 Studio suggests a 30-year plan, hopefully those plans from 30 years ago are right on track to go up now!

gone corporate wrote:Let's assume that the project is being built based upon reasonable demand pull and expectations of selling, or expensively leasing, residences in the property they plan on building substantial enough to endure the costs of construction and risks of failure. Otherwise, they wouldn't build it.
Addendum: This isn't Roberts Tower.

Goat314: I think it's reasonable that these renderings reflect current plans, or some iteration of them. These Draft Metro Station Area Plans being passed around today have already noted future alignments in BPV rather similar to what is anticipated on their marketing docs what will one day be erected there. I would think that, if Metro is really thinking about how to reinvent these stations, then they're looking at both the near-term and the long-term. With that in mind, I'd doubt such clarity of vision in speculative long-term documents (that's maybe the rest of the Landing residential build-out) and would assume these particular schematics are a near-term project with something of a finalized vision with how it will be built. Maybe the cat really is out of the bag now.

And it looks great to me, a helluva lot better than the sloped parking lot there today.

Bingo! You are definitely beating around the proverbial bush lol, but I've had and overheard similar conversations around these TOD proposals. I'm sure you have different and even more info than me, but let's just say that many of these plans are closer to fruition than most of us realize and there are some big players that plan to corner the market.

matguy70 wrote:
Also, Could this be a Drury Hotel?

or both?

Parking garage with Drury hotel and residential floors topping off the tower. Drury markets the tower and depending on demand for residential adds more floors.

The economics of the proposal might be based on a the garage (Arch grounds dempand) and hotel going forward and see what happens for more floors if residential is marketed.

Wooooot!!

From June.

StlToday - City, Drury reach deal on Laclede's Landing road to improve access to district

To compensate Drury, a development arm of the hotel chain, the city agreed to offer it a larger property tax break on the half-vacant Witte Hardware building next to the parking lot at 701-719 North Second Street. The city’s LCRA passed a measure for 10 years of 90 percent abatement on the property improvements. Drury wants to renovate the historic structure into more offices to draw tech and creative firms to Laclede’s Landing.

The city’s Port Authority is also facilitating a 90 percent tax abatement for 22 years on Drury’s parking lot. That’s up from 20 years when the Port Authority first publicized the plan in May.

https://m.stltoday.com/business/local/c ... 0743e.html

I don't see anything happening here for a very long time. I honestly believe that Drury is waiting to see how the thousands of apartment units, currently under construction, end up filling up before they announce their project. They are already investing in Laclede's Landing by renovating the Witte Hardware Building. I certainly don't see them building a hotel here as they have a hotel 2 Blocks West. Now that the lot has been divided and a road will be built to 2nd, it makes development even more likely but a team like Lawrence Group and Drury just seems iffy. Yes, they can pull off something amazing but will eb it be part of this development cycle? Probably not. They'll hold onto the lot and tower idea for a long time till the time is right. I just want to see the renderings in order to get an idea of what's going on here.

As I have said on another Forum on this site, I have contacted Drury only to be hung up on or redirected. The one time I got through, they said that this is still planned but they can't comment at this time. That was several months ago. If only they could announce based on how Leasing at the Peper Lofts goes. What happens at Peper could determine future residential development on the Landing since the Landing is pretty disconnected from the rest of Downtown. I see Peer doing really well because of the views. The views from Laclede's Landing are top notch and offer something different. That should be the key to Drury. As said in a news story, they want the tower to be dramatic and a icon, I don't expect that as Drury has some pretty boring designs Hotel wise but they haven't done residential to my knowledge, so who knows.

Maybe it will be big, beautiful and skyline changing or just another voting Drury hotel design turned residential. I guess we will find out whenever they announce (if they announce).