With all the Metrolink talk we've had lately, I wonder why there is no talk (in the media or from Metro, at least) of Commuter Rail in St Louis. Back after the completion on the current Metro Line (Red Line) Metro, then Bi-State, anounced that they would be implementing Commuter rail along two existing rail corridors using diesel engines and running 4-6 times in the morining and 4-6 times in the evening. The lines were to follow BNSF lines, one through South County to Arnold to Crystal City and Festus. The other would go through Webster Groves, Kirkwood, Valley Park Eureka to Pacific. They were to terminate at the Gateway Transportation Center (Multimodal Center that is still to be built.) I'm wondering if anyone knows why the project was never carried out or if it still is in the works and just waiting for the Gateway Transit Center to be completed. There is absolutely no info on Metro's website anymore and I can't find the articles online anymore. I think more transit would be great. Imagine when the Cross County line were finished. A transfer station could be built (Maplewood Junction!) for transfers between the Commuter lines and Cross County. Then commuters from S. County, Jefferson County and the Eureka Pacific area could take the train Downtown or to Clayton. I think it makes a ton of sense and for that reason will probably never get built.

If you have ever ridden Amtrak, you may understand just how difficult it is to share freight lines with other traffic and still maintain a schedule. Commuter rail along the I-44 and I-55 corridors was studied for feasiblity in the 1990s, but ultimately dropped due to poor performance estimates, uncertain funding and lack of political support.



Commuter rail works in congested regions where connecting densely populated yet sprawling urbanized area with a major downtown employment center. St. Louis is neither congested nor very centralized in its employment, for a one-way peak-hour service to financially work. Indeed, express buses, which are the bus version of commuter rail have the lowest fare recovery of all bus lines, or the most subsidized routes.



In contrast, MetroLink will carry folks in both directions to multiple destinations, not just Downtown, and still serve mostly walk-only transit users, while also attracting new park'n'ride users.

Metro on the Metro East side - travels far out like commuter rail.

Yes, east of Emerson Park, MetroLink very much functions like a commuter rail line. And the fare recovery of the overall light rail system actually worsened when the St. Clair extension opened (though has since slowly climbed back up and expected to take off with Cross-County). Simply put, many of the riders previously boarding in East St. Louis were essentially spread out along the new line. Though the St. Clair line has poor ridership per mile, it fortunately was significantly cheaper to build per mile than current or future Missouri extensions.



To compensate for the St. Clair's line low off-peak ridership, headways have been extended in off-peak times. When Cross-County opens next fall, Metro had planned to run trains from Lambert to Shiloh-Scott and trains from Shrewsbury to Emerson Park. But the St. Clair County Transit District believes more riders will want direct access to Clayton than their airport, and thus, are considering compensating Metro for changes such that trains might run from Shrewsbury to Shiloh-Scott and Lambert to Emerson Park. Luckily, since Illinois and St. Clair County more aggressively fund transit operations, they can afford this choice, while less subsidized Missouri service truly face Metro's tough budget decisions.



Learning lessons from the cornfield-reaching St. Clair line, future extensions will more than likely be built in much smaller increments. For example, when evaluated in 2000, 80 percent of Daniel Boone ridership came along the eastern half of the line between Clayton and Westport, while only 20 percent west of I-270 to Chesterfield Valley. Thus, to build west of Westport does not seem financially wise.



Likewise, even other corridors will likely be shortened as expansion goals. Southside and/or Metro South might only be recommended to Reavis instead of Butler Hill, and Northside only to Northland, instead of Flo Valley Community College. Even in more subsidized Illinois, Madison County may only realize a minimum operating segment to Granite City.



Plus, the Federal Transit Administration has changed its New Starts (major fixed guideway capital) program criteria, de-emphasizing new riders and now more so stressing travel time savings for transit users. Thus, light rail system expanison will now focus more on the transit-supportive urban core with higher riders per mile than suburban park'n'ride corridors.

southslider wrote:Thus, light rail system expanison will now focus more on the transit-supportive urban core with higher riders per mile than suburban park'n'ride corridors.

I hope this is true. If they get the urban core better connected first, it will give more reason for the commuters to get connected later. After all, why take a commuter train into the city, if it doesn't take you many places once you get there.

True, True, & True



I am very pleased with the Illinois line. They have opened themselves up to some very exciting possibilities. Belleville has put itself a step ahead of many other suburbs. St. Charles County has denied itself these same opportunities. So, hats off to Metro East. It does help to have Chicago influencing state government.



DC didn't start building its subway system until the 1970s. They went to the poorest neighborhoods last. I suspect it has something to do with getting the buy-in with middle-class and wealthy. If the people with money & power (decision makers) don't have a stake in it, they are less likely to support it. And if they don't support it, it isn't going to happen.



My personal wish would be to start a cross-city line next. Not just Northside, or just Southside, but Cross City. In other words, the Northside & Southside line at the same time. But, I would be happy with any expansion that would cause more people to embrace the system and would spur the most development. Spurred development will cause more people to support quick expansion.

Cross-County is not being built in Clayton, Mid-County and nearby Southwest City because that is where white wealthy folks live.



Cross-County serves Clayton because outside of Downtown and the Central West End, it is the largest transit-supportive employment center in our region. IOW, it is a major destination that is pedestrian-oriented.

Essentially then, the Clayton and Forsyth stations aren't located really to serve Clayton residents but more so folks of all income brackets working in Clayton, including folks living in the City or Illinois.



Similarly, Skinker and Big Bend really aren't located to serve the pricy homes along Lindell or private U-City streets, but Washington University and neighboring apartments. Richmond Heights is for folks shopping and working in nearby retail. Brentwood I-64 is for folks working in nearby retail as well as moderate to middle income folks driving from nearby locations. Maplewood-Manchester is a bus transfer point for the working class Manchester corridor from FPSE to Rock Hill. Sunnen is a future TOD site. Shrewsbury-Lansdowne I-44 is for moderate and middle income folks driving from nearby locations as well as a major bus transfer for the dense residential Chippewa corridor.



So anyone thinking that the Cross-County corridor got prioritized for expansion because it's where white wealthy folks live is fooling themselves. In addition to the central corridor from Forest Park to East St. Louis already served by MetroLink, the Cross-County corridor is extremely ridership rich for its density of major activities, employment, population and multiple bus connections.

Southslider, thanks. This makes a lot of sense.

I wonder why all of the Metrolink study areas have to be separated? In other words, why could Metro not have simultaneously studied/planned/constructed the Cross County and the North or South Side lines?



I guess I could answer my own question with the issue of financing the lines. I suppose the hope of the Cross County extension is a massive boom in ridership due to better connectivity. This would put more public money and confidence in the system, I suppose. Still, even with a larger capital investment necessary, a simultaneous North Side/South Side line to be completed alongside Cross County might seem to only amplify connectivity, funds and confidence...

The corridors are now separated for higher level planning, but that hasn't always been the case.



From 1984 to 1991, system planning was evaluated. At that time, all corridors were compared and contrasted by need, cost, ease of implementation and civic support. As of 1991, the prioritization of corridor planning was:

Tier I: St. Clair, St. Charles, Cross-County

Tier II: Daniel Boone, Northside, Southside

Tier III: Southwest

Tier IV: Madison and Northeast



Since no area leaders have stepped up to the plate to revisit and possibly revise these priorities, corridors without any recent action like St. Charles or Metro North are now being superceded by Northside-Southside and Madison for further planning.



Metro South and Metro North were once part of Cross-County as Segments II and III, but the decision to build Cross-County to Shrewsbury entirely with local funding necessitated that the other portions be considered as separate corridors if seeking federal funds.



Madison (Edwardsville) and Northeast (Alton) were combined for the recent early planning stage of a feasibility study.



However, on any of the corridors, the system portions certainly function within the greater system. Cross-County trains will continue east of Forest Park-DeBaliviere, using the same tracks as the original line. A Metro South extension, if built, would essentially extend the Cross-County line south of Shrewsbury. A Madison extension would have trains split between it and St. Clair in East St. Louis, similar to the Forest Park split between Lambert and Cross-County in Missouri.



The exciting thing for Northside and Southside is that their trains could conceivably share lines with sections of the Daniel Boone and Metro South corridors in Northwest and South St. Louis County. However, since these shared sections haven't been built, for the first time in MetroLink planning history, we can consider alternative technologies like low-floor light-rail vehicles and different design standards like hybrid in-street running. Even if Northside-Southside trains would someday share tracks on portions of the system, these newer sections could be built as exclusive rights-of-way for higher speeds and there could be multi-level platforms for different trains. Still, it is not a foregone conclusion that Northside-Southside will use different technology, but it really is the only time such opportunity has seriously arrived for the entire regional system.



But ultimately, why corridors are planned and not the system as a whole is because a light-rail line is not always the solution. For example, previous Cross-County studies not only produced the line under construction but also New I-64. Most transportation studies are multi-modal weighing a variety of solutions to identified problems. Indeed, as part of the Northside-Southside study, bus rapid transit will be evaluated as well. But corridors share common travel demands, so if having to assess what your problem might be, you first need to look at a geographic sub-area to access needs, model trends, and evaluate alternative facility improvements as possible solutions.

Xing, South City is no longer the white enclave it once was. In 1980, or as late as 1990, Census data did show a very polarized City. But in 2000, South City had become greatly diverse, including a large Bosnian population and growing Asian and Hispanic populations. In fact, today, more African-Americans live in St. Louis County than St. Louis City, and more African-Americans live south of Delmar within the City than north of Delmar. Only, a small cresent of neighborhoods from the Hill to St. Louis Hills to Holly Hills remain as largely white areas, now commonly collectively called Southwest City.



However, looking at the conceptual Southside alignment, only the Loughborough station and points south if extended into South County would be within largely white populated areas. All 8 conceptual stations north of Loughborough along the Southside line serve diverse neighborhoods. From Downtown, the conceptual Southside line serves the diverse neighborhoods of Darst-Webbe, Lafayette Square, The Gate District, Tiffany, McRee Town, Southwest Garden, The Hill, Tower Grove South, Bevo, Dutchtown, Holly Hills, Carondelet, and Boulevard Heights. Of these neighborhoods, only The Hill, Holly Hills and Boulevard Heights can be seen as largely white. Lafayette Square is largely affluent but diverse.



Still, the stations serving The Hill, either Shaw/Vandeventer or Arsenal are actually located in more diverse Southwest Garden and are more accessible to Shaw and Tower Grove South than The Hill. Likewise, the station serving Holly Hills and Boulevard Heights at Loughborough is actually in more diverse Carondelet. Ironically, Xing, some may view the northside alignment and its service to Old North St. Louis as supporting a City neighborhood with a growing white population.



Fortunately, these days, you really can't think of the City in terms of strictly black and white anymore, but such a more diverse City will likely help us achieve a growing City.

southslider wrote:Xing, South City is no longer the white enclave it once was. In 1980, or as late as 1990, Census data did show a very polarized City. But in 2000, South City had become greatly diverse, including a large Bosnian population and growing Asian and Hispanic populations. In fact, today, more African-Americans live in St. Louis County than St. Louis City, and more African-Americans live south of Delmar within the City than north of Delmar. Only, a small cresent of neighborhoods from the Hill to St. Louis Hills to Holly Hills remain as largely white areas, now commonly collectively called Southwest City.

Neighborhoods Mostly or Entirely North of Delmar:



Summary Data For Neighborhoods (West End/Visitation Park/Wells / Goodfellow/Academy/Kingsway West/Fountain Park/Lewis Place/Kingsway East/The Greater Ville/The Ville/Vandeventer/JeffVanderLou/St. Louis Place/Carr Square/Columbus Square/Old North St. Louis/Near North Riverfront/Hyde Park/College Hill/Fairground Neighborhood/O'Fallon/Penrose/Mark Twain / I-70 Industrial/Mark Twain/Walnut Park East/North Point/Baden/Riverview/Walnut Park West/Covenant Blu / Grand Center/Hamilton Heights/North Riverfront)



Total Population: 120,712



Race:

White alone 5,191 4.30%

Black or African American alone 113,738 94.22%

American Indian and Alaska Native alone 221 0.18%

Asian alone 219 0.18%

Native Hawaiian and Other Pacific Islander alone 14 0.01%

Some other race alone 224 0.19%

Population of two or more races: 1,105 0.92%



Neighborhoods Mostly or Entirely South of Delmar:



Summary Data For Neighborhoods (Carondelet/Patch/Holly Hills/Boulevard Heights/Bevo Mill/Princeton Heights/South Hampton/St. Louis Hills/Lindenwood Park/Ellendale/Clifton Heights/The Hill/Southwest Garden/North Hampton/Tower Grove South/Dutchtown/Mount Pleasant/Marine Villa/Gravois Park/Kosciusko/Soulard/Benton Park/McKinley Heights/Fox Park/Tower Grove East/Compton Heights/Shaw/McRee Town/Tiffany/Benton Park West/The Gate District/Lafayette Square/Peabody, Darst, Webbe/La Salle/Downtown/Downtown West/Midtown/Central West End/Forest Park Southeast/Kings Oak/Cheltenham/Clayton / Tamm/Franz Park/Hi-Point/Wydown / Skinker/Skinker / DeBaliviere/DeBaliviere Place)



Total Population: 227,477



Race:

White alone 147,475 64.83%

Black or African American alone 64,528 28.37%

American Indian and Alaska Native alone 729 0.32%

Asian alone 6,672 2.93%

Native Hawaiian and Other Pacific Islander alone 80 0.04%

Some other race alone 2,559 1.12%

Population of two or more races: 5,434 2.39%



------------------------------------------------



How could there be more African Americans south of Delmar than north, judging by these 2000 Census numbers? Unless areas that have an overlap (Downtown and Downtown West) constitute the discrepancy...but we're talking about 4 blocks here. That can't account for the difference between North of Delmar's black population (113,000) and South of Delmar's (64,000).



Also, is this how you would define Southwest City?...



Summary Data For Neighborhoods (Boulevard Heights/Princeton Heights/South Hampton/St. Louis Hills/Lindenwood Park/Ellendale/Clifton Heights/The Hill/North Hampton/Cheltenham/Clayton / Tamm/Franz Park/Hi-Point)



Total Population: 66,220



Race:

White alone 61,197 92.41%

Black or African American alone 2,371 3.58%

American Indian and Alaska Native alone 169 0.26%

Asian alone 956 1.44%

Native Hawaiian and Other Pacific Islander alone 22 0.03%

Some other race alone 428 0.65%

Population of two or more races: 1,077 1.63%





[EDIT: Oops...I snuck the Gate District in the Southwest City group and it skewed the percentages. Southwest City is largely white apparently.]



By the way, here is the study that Mayor Slay always references when he says that St. Louis is one of the least segregated major cities on a block-by-block basis:



www.uwm.edu/Dept/ETI/integration/integration.pdf

OK, south of Delmar doesn't have more African-American residents than north of Delmar, at least not as recorded on April 1, 2000. But here's an interesting tidbit... South City, when excluding Southwest City and far South City, was more black than white in 2000.



The rough boundaries for such "Central South City" area are generally Chouteau on the north, the River on the east, Delor on the south, and UP railroad and Kingshighway on the southwest.



Summary Data For Neighborhoods (Tower Grove South/Dutchtown/Mount Pleasant/Marine Villa/Gravois Park/Kosciusko/Soulard/Benton Park/McKinley Heights/Fox Park/Tower Grove East/Compton Heights/Shaw/McRee Town/Tiffany/Benton Park West/The Gate District/Lafayette Square/Peabody, Darst, Webbe/La Salle/Forest Park Southeast)



Total Population: 94,732



Race:

White alone 40,366 42.61%

Black or African American alone 46,546 49.13%

American Indian and Alaska Native alone 347 0.37%

Asian alone 3,438 3.63%

Native Hawaiian and Other Pacific Islander alone 31 0.03%

Some other race alone 1,318 1.39%

Population of two or more races: 2,686 2.84%



Hispanic Or Latino: 2,952 3.12% of Total Population



Race For The Population 18 Years And Over: Total: 66,005 100.00%

White alone 33,645 50.97%

Black or African American alone 27,279 41.33%

American Indian and Alaska Native alone 263 0.40%

Asian alone 2,494 3.78%

Native Hawaiian and Other Pacific Islander alone 24 0.04%

Some other race alone 833 1.26%

Population of two or more races 1,467 2.22%



Some interesting notes are that Hispanics and Bosnians are largely counted as whites, so the actual non-immigrant white population is actually even less than what the Census conveys. Also, black out-migration had increased on the northside, so such trend resulted in more African-Americans already living in St. Louis County than the City by 2000, but the rate of change in population in North City and South City could likely result in more African-Americans living south of Delmar than north of Delmar by 2010.



Though saying south of Delmar was erroneous, the fact remains that South City is no longer a white enclave, only Southwest City. And interestingly, the Southside MetroLink line, where along the UP railroad south of I-44, follows closely to where diverse South Central City and white Southwest City meet. And ultimately, the blocks about this line are some of the diversest parts of South St. Louis, with many foreign-born residents on top of a diverse racial population.

I noticed, southslider, that my own neighborhood is conspicuously absent from all of your unofficial designations. I smell gerrymandering...



If Bevo is not Southwest, and is not Central South--then what is it?



Plus, you included Holly Hills in with the Southwest crowd, which, geographically speaking, should include Bevo as well in that case.



Carondelet seems missing too.



Regardless, back to the topic of commuter rail or Metrolink as it relates to race...



It's not too hard to see why some people believe that Metrolink's priority lines (say, Cross County over North City) may reflect racism or classism. Metrolink is focusing on dense employment hubs which would benefit from light rail transit more so than they would need it. By not focusing initial efforts on a transit-dependent core, such as North and South City, you are setting yourself up for accusations of bias.

No gerrymandering. Folks generally think of Southwest City as the 2nd Police District (though not the Wydown-Skinker portion), but these days look through any real estate ads, and many from Bevo, Holly Hills and Boulevard Heights in the 1st District also advertise as "Southwest City."



Bevo certainly is where white Southwest City and diverse South Central City meet. Closer to Chippewa, or north of Delor, Bevo is very much an immigrant neighborhood, but around St. John the Baptist, or south of Delor, Bevo is more like Southwest City. Also, Southwest Garden is more like Southwest City west of Kingshighway but like South Central east of Kingshighway. So, I threw Bevo and Southwest Garden out of what I used as "South Central City."



As for the class/race issues surrounding Cross-County being built as the first Missouri extension, it's all spin. St. Charles would have actually been built first if their voters hadn't turned down their version of a Prop M in 1996. Reaching Clayton has always been a MetroLink goal, since it is the second largest employment center in our region and the largest bus transfer center in St. Louis County.



The first line would have gone via Clayton between the airport and downtown except the ease of implementation along the Forest Park Parkway corridor was too difficult for a federally funded project. Thus, the Wabash line was used instead. Why then Cross-County turns south, instead of north beyond Clayton then is due to adding new service areas to MetroLink's system. The original line added MetroLink access to North County, plus building to Shrewsbury adds MetroLink access for the first time ever to the I-64 and I-44 corridors.



In locating and prioritizing alignments and their stations, transit planners seek out density for reliable trip generators (major origins and destinations). But at the same time, the mighty dollar limits where lines can go. Shrewsbury certainly isn't a major transit hub. If we could be in Webster Groves or elsewhere along I-44 with higher density, we would. But Shrewsbury just lucked out to be where an abandonned rail corridor came closest to I-44, and I'll bet you that many transit-dependents using the Chippewa bus, often called the Baby Grand for its high ridership, will use what many fail to see as only a suburban park'n'ride station.

I understand that Metrolink is not deliberately trying to avoid transit-dependent areas. I understand that studies were conducted separately. But, southslider, I also know that people who don't know as much about the history and politics of the various proposed Metrolink alignments--which is about everyone compared to you--may see Metro's priorities as reflecting the interests of business hubs rather than lower income residents of the City.



As long as North and South City lines are ready to go next, criticism should die off.