^ I'll wait and see what is shared at the meeting. I provided my feedback to BMO in a meeting several weeks ago. IMO - more pressure needs to be applied to get a better result.
If there is a god, the neighbors will riot before they let that bank come down.
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Who's leading the community effort?^ I'll wait and see what is shared at the meeting. I provided my feedback to BMO in a meeting several weeks ago. IMO - more pressure needs to be applied to get a better result.
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^^ My take would be that many people have provided feedback that the corner building must stay. I expect it to stay. The rest of the large site is the question.
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^ does "corner building" include the one-story wings that front Kingshighway and Southwest? I'm guessing not.
I reserved my ticket for the open house on Monday-hope to see everyone there.
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No.urban_dilettante wrote:^ does "corner building" include the one-story wings that front Kingshighway and Southwest? I'm guessing not.
It's on the prelim preservation board agenda:
Address: 2301 S. KINGSHIGHWAY
Project Description: Partial demolition for new construction and partial renovations for new BMO Harris Bank.
Jurisdiction: Reber Place National Register District Ward: 8
Owner: BMO Harris Bank
Applicant: Randy Coakley
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Yea it seems like the walgreens portion will retain the feel of the historic corner building correct? I hope they keep the entire stretch one connected building and keep the parking in the rear.
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^ i am pretty sure, i could be wrong, but walgreens isn't just putting up stores for the sake of putting them up.
i am perfectly fine with this...its what happens when people meet in the middle.
i am perfectly fine with this...its what happens when people meet in the middle.
^ You go to places like SF, Chicago, etc. and there is a Walgreens/CVS on seemingly every other block. I'd rather have Walgreens every 1/2 mile than QT.
Will they close the other one?
edit:
Make that intersection more pedestrian friendly and will probably even walk over there.
edit:
Make that intersection more pedestrian friendly and will probably even walk over there.
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The new Walgreens isn't even on the corner so why not tear down the existing Walgreens across the street and build there? Why tear down part of this historic building?
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in New Orleans there is a Walgreen's at 900 Canal Street and 801 Canal Street
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^yep. I've been to both of those Walgreens in NOLA. How many old buildings did they tear down for these?
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^ exactly. other cities manage to persuade Walgreens to occupy old buildings instead of razing them. not in St. Louis, though. i mean, Walgreens are boxes. there is absolutely no reason they can't use the existing building. if need be they could expand in the back. the only reason they're insisting on demo is so they can add curb cuts and more parking which, like most Walgreens parking lots, will never be completely full.
well of course. they've got it down to a science to ensure that they make money. but what's good for Walgreens' bottom line isn't necessarily good for St. Louis.dbInSouthCity wrote:^ i am pretty sure, i could be wrong, but walgreens isn't just putting up stores for the sake of putting them up.
I attended last night.
I always assumed all those irrational/hysterical STLToday commenters lived way out in the County or St. Charles.
I was wrong. So very wrong.
I always assumed all those irrational/hysterical STLToday commenters lived way out in the County or St. Charles.
I was wrong. So very wrong.
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shadrach wrote:I attended last night.
I always assumed all those irrational/hysterical STLToday commenters lived way out in the County or St. Charles.
I was wrong. So very wrong.
can you elaborate? I'll go get the popcorn.
I'll indulge a little.
First, I'm not a fan of the project. I don't hate it, but I don't really like it either.
The good is that the entrance to Walgreen was pushed to Kingshighway, windows will be along Kingshighway. The Walgreens will be as tall as the existing bank building (according to a private conversation with the developer.)
The bad is too much of the original building is being demoed. The fourth building (an outbuilding in the middle of the parking lot) should be moved to front along Southwest. The design (which may be tweaked?) had yet another dumb, hip-roof clock tower. The proportions were suburban. The materials were faux fake, standard off-the-shelf crap. All of the trees on Kingshighway are coming down (replaced by twigs.) Too much leeway given to cars, traffic flow and parking. Most of it felt 'mailed in/going through the motions.' The plan, reflecting "Chesterfield Valley's Best Practices" could be thought out much better.
The reaction was about as the same as Centene. Too much increased traffic. Added congestion. Dangerous right-hand turns. Concerns over headlights facing the houses on Botanical as they park. The brightness of light posts in the parking lot. The signage on Walgreens—too big, too bright. Added noise, people congregating.
It was pointed, heels were dug in and you could feel the anger. Over what? Living in a city?
I'm surprised they didn't complain about Metro buses, fire trucks and that damn Amtrak train that rumbles by one a day. It was simply resistance to change. But the irony is the current site has already lost a dozen or more homes'/buildings for the current, massive parking lot. Some had been in the neighborhood for 50 years. But the area has been crumbling and morphing around them for 50 years. There has been so much loss—Magic Chef, American Can, Hanneke Hardware, the closing of city schools, the building of a BP, the current Walgreens, a Public Storage. I think the residents forgot what it was like when the area was busy and bustling back in 1970s.
First, I'm not a fan of the project. I don't hate it, but I don't really like it either.
The good is that the entrance to Walgreen was pushed to Kingshighway, windows will be along Kingshighway. The Walgreens will be as tall as the existing bank building (according to a private conversation with the developer.)
The bad is too much of the original building is being demoed. The fourth building (an outbuilding in the middle of the parking lot) should be moved to front along Southwest. The design (which may be tweaked?) had yet another dumb, hip-roof clock tower. The proportions were suburban. The materials were faux fake, standard off-the-shelf crap. All of the trees on Kingshighway are coming down (replaced by twigs.) Too much leeway given to cars, traffic flow and parking. Most of it felt 'mailed in/going through the motions.' The plan, reflecting "Chesterfield Valley's Best Practices" could be thought out much better.
The reaction was about as the same as Centene. Too much increased traffic. Added congestion. Dangerous right-hand turns. Concerns over headlights facing the houses on Botanical as they park. The brightness of light posts in the parking lot. The signage on Walgreens—too big, too bright. Added noise, people congregating.
It was pointed, heels were dug in and you could feel the anger. Over what? Living in a city?
I'm surprised they didn't complain about Metro buses, fire trucks and that damn Amtrak train that rumbles by one a day. It was simply resistance to change. But the irony is the current site has already lost a dozen or more homes'/buildings for the current, massive parking lot. Some had been in the neighborhood for 50 years. But the area has been crumbling and morphing around them for 50 years. There has been so much loss—Magic Chef, American Can, Hanneke Hardware, the closing of city schools, the building of a BP, the current Walgreens, a Public Storage. I think the residents forgot what it was like when the area was busy and bustling back in 1970s.
Walgreens should really just put this box at Arsenal and kingshighway. Pull it to the corner to hug that intersection. Leave these historic storefronts for some small business opportunity in the future.
I sometimes wonder at what point do we reevaluate just how desperate we are for zero sum retail development at the expense of what makes St. Louis great.
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Southwest Garden has been trying for a very long time to improve the crosswalk experience across Kingshighway at Southwest, Magnolia, and Reber. They want to be able to walk to the Botanical Garden and Tower Grove Park. A large part of the neighborhood west of Brannon should probably just be annexed as part of the Hill, but Reber Place and the "Gardenside" part have been trying to hold together a cohesive neighborhood with a very large road between them.shadrach wrote: It was pointed, heels were dug in and you could feel the anger. Over what? Living in a city?
You will remember that these are the same people that attempted a road diet on the stretch of Vandeventer south of Shaw to slow traffic down. They do live in a city, but they're a little tired of being told that they have to put up with through traffic from other neighborhoods. Honestly, I think Southwest between Sublette Park and Kingshighway would be a lot easier to focus on. The neighborhood association office could lift the blinds every once in a while, Park Avenue Coffee could turn their store around and put the front door in the front, etc.
Honestly it would all work a lot better if there was a MetroLink station on Shaw and another on Reber...
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I wasn't there so I can't comment on what was said, but it appears that this design is going to increase the auto-oriented nature of that corner and that is not exactly the same thing as "city living". With good design, that area can increase neighborhood vibrancy and safety. Also, while that area has lost some things, it also has gained others.... Three Flags Tavern immediately adjacent for one. Also Park Avenue Coffee, the new biz at the old Hanneke's, etc.shadrach wrote: It was pointed, heels were dug in and you could feel the anger. Over what? Living in a city?
I'm surprised they didn't complain about Metro buses, fire trucks and that damn Amtrak train that rumbles by one a day. It was simply resistance to change. But the irony is the current site has already lost a dozen or more homes'/buildings for the current, massive parking lot. Some had been in the neighborhood for 50 years. But the area has been crumbling and morphing around them for 50 years. There has been so much loss—Magic Chef, American Can, Hanneke Hardware, the closing of city schools, the building of a BP, the current Walgreens, a Public Storage. I think the residents forgot what it was like when the area was busy and bustling back in 1970s.