DC's public schools are national tragedy brought to you by the education reform movement. The amount of money they waste for poor quality education makes St. Louis look good.
why are young educated whites leaving STL region is it the jobs market or the belief the grass is greener somewhere else?
If you want to pursue an education (non-med/law), it isn't like the city of STL offers a ton of choices or that many openings to begin with. In the city limits, there is SLU, H-S, and Wash U (marginally in the city), with a combined undergrad enrollment of about 17,000 students. There aren't enough institutions, offering a broad enough array of degrees, for a large enough student population to be resident in the city. If there were actually a sizeable number of student openings inside the city limits, say 50-75k, more kids would have the option to actually study in STL, there would be more thriving student districts, more culture and nightlife, and more of these kids would stick around, having discovered there is a habitable city in their back yard, not just the endless Judgment Night depicted on evening news. That said, the 20-something demographics did grow last census.
both.True_dope wrote:why are young educated whites leaving STL region is it the jobs market or the belief the grass is greener somewhere else?
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My daughter is a high school senior, so for the last year we've been touring parts of the country visiting colleges -- mostly in urban areas. In Boston, Northeastern University and Boston U are both in the Fenway district just West of the downtown area. Northeastern is a private college that has grown tremendously. They developed a strong reputation for putting kids into internships with businesses and getting them lots of practical experience while in college -- and getting college credit for that. That goes a long way toward getting them local connections and offers for the top students coming right out of college. I think they have one of the highest placement rates for kids coming out of college, and a lot of that is local in the place they interned around Boston.onecity wrote:^In the universe in which affordability and quality of life matters. MPLS is a city where you really can have it all without sacrificing much: nature, parks, no months of summer scorch, top notch arts institutions including the Walker Art Institute, MIA, McKnight Center for Photography and numerous others, an affordable house near the urban core chosen from a beautiful and well-maintained stock of craftsman styles, top-notch university education out the wazoo, good public schools, strong diversity including many races and the foreign born, great dining and brewing, cycling EVERYWHERE, a diverse and healthy economy with a lot of knowledge work, one of the nation's best music scenes, tons of Fortune 500s, tons of patents per capita, public radio powerhouse, progressive politics, lack of redneckery, cleanliness, and an extremely high quality of life in a city that is safe around the clock. Did I miss anything?
In order to do that, our kids need to be able to study in St. Louis, and not just those 15,000 whose families are loaded, get near perfect scores on ACT/SAT, and study law and medicine. Where are the big unis to make that happen?What is interesting is that we would probably have a similar growth rate to Minneapolis if we were able to retain some of those college educated, young whites, because that is who is leaving the region in droves. In fact, we could do better in educated our homegrown black population, who actually has an affinity for the city.
Northeastern has grown so much that they have quietly taken over many of the neighborhood buildings near Symphony Hall including leasing most of the buildings on the Christian Science Center site. They are acquiring the back sides of buildings along Huntington Ave, like the YMCA, and building high rise student housing. And the demand to get in has moved Northeastern up the selectivity ranks.
I'd love to see Webster U. make internships and placement their claim to fame in their campus downtown and do the same thing as Northeastern U.
^ Important points. Boston, like MPLS, has a ton of colleges and universities in close proximity to one another, and those institutions supply interns to the numerous Fortune companies that are also in close proximity to the colleges and also to one another, and those kids continue to live in Boston or MPLS after graduation. And all that layered proximity generates enormous social and human capital through network effects, that translates into a diverse powerhouse economy. This lack is a huge part of the STL anti-miracle.
Re Webster: It has only 5000 undergrads, and the main campus in in WG. The DT campus is a start, I suppose, but unless significant undergrad action in a wide range of degrees starts happening in the downtown campus, its impact will also be below the radar. Currently over half the undergrad programs they offer there are law and medicine. If there's *anything* STL is lacking in, it's people with law and med degrees.
Re Webster: It has only 5000 undergrads, and the main campus in in WG. The DT campus is a start, I suppose, but unless significant undergrad action in a wide range of degrees starts happening in the downtown campus, its impact will also be below the radar. Currently over half the undergrad programs they offer there are law and medicine. If there's *anything* STL is lacking in, it's people with law and med degrees.
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^ I recall cybertech will be one of the flagship programs Webster will be offering at the Gateway campus, which would be good. I believe it will have a capacity of about 1,000 students once its up and running. As you say it is a start and hopefully Webster's campus will be a success and encourage other colleges to move in the downtown or midtown area.
One thing I'll mention about UMSL; while I do hope they open a city campus, it is only 3.5 miles and a few minutes from the Delmar Loop Metrolink so its not completely alien to the city.
One thing I'll mention about UMSL; while I do hope they open a city campus, it is only 3.5 miles and a few minutes from the Delmar Loop Metrolink so its not completely alien to the city.
UMSL is not going anywhere and they have some big plans for Natural Bridge. I'm very bullish on this part of North County, with Northpark, the Airport and Express Scripts nearby and think this could be a happening district with the right plan. I've heard a lot of talks about TOD and making Natural Bridge a mixed use corridor from Lucas and Hunt to Hanley. The people I was talking too specifically mentioned the relationship between Wash U and the Delmar Loop. Could we see student oriented housing on Natural Bridge with ground floor retail? Stay Tuned!roger wyoming II wrote:^ I recall cybertech will be one of the flagship programs Webster will be offering at the Gateway campus, which would be good. I believe it will have a capacity of about 1,000 students once its up and running. As you say it is a start and hopefully Webster's campus will be a success and encourage other colleges to move in the downtown or midtown area.
One thing I'll mention about UMSL; while I do hope they open a city campus, it is only 3.5 miles and a few minutes from the Delmar Loop Metrolink so its not completely alien to the city.
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^ yeah, I'm hopeful some good developments can happen for the Natural Bridge effort. And I agree they aren't going anywhere, but it would be nice to add a city "campus" like Webster for some select programs.
CBRE joins downtown migration with move to LaSalle Plaza
http://www.bizjournals.com/twincities/b ... salle.html
Real estate firm CBRE Group is moving its Twin Cities office from Bloomington to downtown Minneapolis, becoming the latest in a string of suburban office tenants choosing to be in downtown...
Education firm to move 500 workers from the suburbs to downtown Minneapolis
Education Credit Management Corp. is moving its headquarters and about 500 workers to downtown Minneapolis from Oakdale, a suburb of St. Paul.
http://www.bizjournals.com/twincities/b ... m-the.html
The education company has signed a lease for 125,000 square feet at the 111 Washington building, according to an email obtained by the Business Journal from the building's leasing brokerage, Transwestern.
What annoys the hell out of me is not that so many of our big companies aren't relocating their headquarters to downtown, its that they aren't even setting up a decent presence. Hopefully someone steps up and leads they way soon.
http://www.bizjournals.com/twincities/b ... salle.html
Real estate firm CBRE Group is moving its Twin Cities office from Bloomington to downtown Minneapolis, becoming the latest in a string of suburban office tenants choosing to be in downtown...
Education firm to move 500 workers from the suburbs to downtown Minneapolis
Education Credit Management Corp. is moving its headquarters and about 500 workers to downtown Minneapolis from Oakdale, a suburb of St. Paul.
http://www.bizjournals.com/twincities/b ... m-the.html
The education company has signed a lease for 125,000 square feet at the 111 Washington building, according to an email obtained by the Business Journal from the building's leasing brokerage, Transwestern.
What annoys the hell out of me is not that so many of our big companies aren't relocating their headquarters to downtown, its that they aren't even setting up a decent presence. Hopefully someone steps up and leads they way soon.
perhaps, after having read this, it would be interesting to compile a list of mid-size suburban office tenants that would be better served (regionally) in some of the available space in downtown st. louis. not that this list could or should be comprehensive of ALL possible tenants, but still a compilation of businesses and such that some of us might be aware of that could be better served or could better serve downtown STL.
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An omen of things to come for Downtown St. Louis 
I really like the pace that Downtowns across the Midwest are transforming.
http://www.rejournals.com/2016/11/15/th ... nsforming/
I really like the pace that Downtowns across the Midwest are transforming.
http://www.rejournals.com/2016/11/15/th ... nsforming/
Really nice new Government Service building in Downtown Minneapolis. They've even tried to connect the infamous skywalk system with the street. Sure hope the forthcoming St. Louis County government center is as well thought-out. Really good article here:
https://www.archpaper.com/2023/03/minne ... ity+center
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https://www.archpaper.com/2023/03/minne ... ity+center
Star Tribune - Campaign aims to persuade Minneapolis drivers to leave the car at home
https://m.startribune.com/campaign-aims ... 600285082/In seven years, Minneapolis transportation planners want 60% of trips in the city taken on public transit, or made by biking, walking or rolling.
Totally anecdotal, but when I was in MLPS last month talking to the leaders at our companies there, the absolute consensus is that DT MLPS is turning to sh"t and "everyone is moving out". That crime is rampant downtown. Yadda. Yadda. Yadda. I don't think that's actually the case, but it does go to show that that attitude is not limited to STL.
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I was in Minneapolis last week and downtown is definitely not "turning to sh*t." Maybe it's just because the downtown I am used to in STL, but downtown Minny is something we should be striving to replicate (not including the skywalk system)
People walking everywhere, going to shows or just enjoying the long summer evening. Downtown shopping is getting crushed (Nordstrom Rack and Marshall's just left in the past six months) and the office apocalypse is no doubt happening there like it is everywhere.
Downtown Minneapolis is still so far ahead of downtown Saint Louis. Why? Connectivity to its surrounding neighborhoods and a much higher residential downtown population. Downtown STL is an island with a much lower population than it should have. Add 20,000 new residents to the greater downtown area and suddenly things look different.
People walking everywhere, going to shows or just enjoying the long summer evening. Downtown shopping is getting crushed (Nordstrom Rack and Marshall's just left in the past six months) and the office apocalypse is no doubt happening there like it is everywhere.
Downtown Minneapolis is still so far ahead of downtown Saint Louis. Why? Connectivity to its surrounding neighborhoods and a much higher residential downtown population. Downtown STL is an island with a much lower population than it should have. Add 20,000 new residents to the greater downtown area and suddenly things look different.
Oh just to be clear, I don't agree with that view of MPLS, but I am just reporting what I heard. We tend to think naysaying is limited to us. In reality, DT STL is way behind DT MLPS. I stayed in a hotel downtown even though our facilities are in the burbs. I stayed by the Depot area near the river but walked to dinner every night and walked to the Fine Line to see Sunset Rubdown one night and First Avenue to see Hot Chip another night (incidentally, bands that will never play St. Louis).
https://kstp.com/kstp-news/top-news/may ... t-address/
According to the Mayor of Minneapolis, they have a whopping 614 police officers. Population of Minneapolis is about 430k and their murder crime rate is 17.76 per 100,000.
For reference, STL's 2024 estimate is 279k and our murder rate is 53.4 per 100k as of 2024. But we have 200+ more officers, something like 890 last I read.
According to the Mayor of Minneapolis, they have a whopping 614 police officers. Population of Minneapolis is about 430k and their murder crime rate is 17.76 per 100,000.
For reference, STL's 2024 estimate is 279k and our murder rate is 53.4 per 100k as of 2024. But we have 200+ more officers, something like 890 last I read.
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It’s crazy what being hegemonic white community descendant from Sandinavian immigrants can do for your city.
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You live in a genocidal slave republic turned apartheid state
MSP's economy is much better than here, they didnt lose as many corporate HQs to mergers as we did. And being a (light) blue state, they get a lot more investment than we do.
Being a state capital (or in the same metro in this case) with the flagship state university (55,000 enrollment) always helps.
