Fair St. Louis

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I was not able to make it this year. Anyone have any comments on the Fair this year. How was it in Forest Park. I heard the fireworks seemed scaled back. How were the crowds? Did the Y2K-ish predictions for parking come to fruition. Any crime issues, car break-ins etc? I heard Chief Dotson say they only made like 1 arrest.
Overall, was it worth going? I think we have one more year at Forest Park. I stayed away because I was not crazy about any of the bands.
I have to say that it was hands down the best Fair St. Louis I have ever been to. There were an estimated 250k people that showed up over the three days and it was apparently the biggest turnout in forest park since the origional world's fair. Art hill also made for an excellent concert venue and the weather was perfect. The parking lots were nowhere near capacity from what I could tell as most people walked or took metro. Fireworks were great but maybe not astounding. Looking forward to next year.
^That is great to here. I almost think that the media scared a lot of people away, with the parking situation.

I think I am going to make sure I go next year, since we may never see it in Forest Park again. It looked awesome on TV, but the fireworks seemed scaled back. Hopefully, they can get some good bands in town next year. I was glad to hear crime was not much of an issue.
It seemed odd that there was so much back lash early on that Forest Park would cause problems while it is best known for hosting hundred of thousands from around the world in grand fashion. Given the space for vendors, diversity of activities, and proximity of residents who can come and go as they please, it seems like a great venue for such an event. The Arch obviously provides an iconic backdrop for national and civic pride, but so does the Park with arguably even more punch.

We just moved back to town this week so didn't venture into the grounds directly, but I did drive my in laws and parents up to Marshall and Fairmount in Dogtown Friday night for a cool view of the city (well timed with fireworks over Busch) and a decent view of the fireworks to the north in Forest Park. It was super easy to get in from Clayton Rd and out on Manchester. That was plan B after the St. Mary's parking garage roof was nixed by a well placed security officer. My sister and husband in U City took Metrolink, and while they did get bogged down at the end, it only took about 40 min for them to get to the Clayton Station from the end of the fireworks.
^That is a great idea.(Parking in Dogtown). I was thinking about grabbing the kids and parking somewhere, but had no idea where the fireworks would be visible from, considering they seemed lower or less extravagant versus the displays under the Arch.

That brings up a good question for anyone who watched from places other than Forest Park. Where are some good places to watch, without being in the park? Where were some other places, with the best views? Obviously, Dogtown has several spots, but I was not home, so I missed seeing where they were visible from.
^^ welcome back to the City!
The Fair seemed to go off without a hitch. The fireworks were only scaled down for Thursday night. Friday and Saturday shows were great! Parking was a breeze and the weather made walking long distances a joy. We walked over from the Moorlands. It was also great to see so many cyclists. The parade looked good on TV.
I went Thursday night. The concert was good, the venue was good, and I would definitely go back to Forest Park for it in the future. We rode Metrolink from Brentwood, and the wait to get home was a long line but fast-moving. I was impressed by the planning and I think things went as well as they could. Judging by the fact that it took every person five minutes to buy tickets at the kiosk, I'm guessing a lot of infrequent riders were on the MetroLink, so I hope they enjoyed it. (There really does need to be a Confirm Quantity button in-between selecting what you're purchasing and paying for it; everyone naturally seems to look for one and gets confused.)

My friend who lives in the city cabbed it to and fro, and he was also happy with it.
My church had our 150th anniversary on Skinker across from the park Saturday night. We were told to expect a nightmare, but the city was prepared. It meant more work for us (sending out parking permits, etc), but we experienced few problems. And we enjoyed a fantastic view of the fireworks. Glad Fair St. Louis could pay for our 150th anniversary fireworks.
I had no idea that the weather is so much nicer in Forest Park than it is downtown. Art Hill makes a nice grass amphitheater. Will the new changes at the Arch allow for a raised stage on the riverfront that 50K or so people can view from the steps and grassy slopes above Leonore K. Sullivan? Or will the stage still be up under the Arch again the next time they hold it downtown.
I was riding MetroLink on Thursday evening, and it seemed like all the validation machines at both the Skinker Station and Shrewbury Station were off. It was rather confusing for someone who rides MetroLink fairly often.
Treasurer takes to Twitter to claim Fair St. Louis segregated black acts.

Tishurra, En Vogue is a washed act from 20 years ago. Washed up acts from 20 years ago end up on the second (or third) stage always and forever. What don't you understand about that or maybe you just couldn't enjoy a day at the park without playing the race card and annoying everyone?

http://www.stltoday.com/entertainment/m ... 83f0c.html

But at least she taught 800 city employees how to use a bank recently. Thanks for that.

http://www.bizjournals.com/stlouis/prin ... nking.html
When I went there Saturday evening, it was very much segregated. Black people at one stage. White people at the other. When I was there, Musiq Soulchild was playing at the back stage and that area was packed. Hard to even walk around. That act could have definitely been at the main stage based on the amount of people.

I think her point is somewhat valid. They could have definitely had some of the black acts on the main stage. I think it would have been great to mix the different music types - indie, with R&B, etc. I think it was a lost opportunity to mix STL cultures.
It's one thing to point out attendance flows, bounce ideas for how to go about it next year, examine attendance figures, etc. But to play the race card right off the bat is weak and keeps St. Louis weak. Just more weak leadership stuck in the past. That's just my opinion.
leeharveyawesome wrote:
It's one thing to point out attendance flows, bounce ideas for how to go about it next year, examine attendance figures, etc. But to play the race card right off the bat is weak and keeps St. Louis weak. Just more weak leadership stuck in the past. That's just my opinion.

Just as you have had your opinions and have expressed your "race card" observations and opinions over the years, Tishaura Jones expressed her personal observations as a fair-goer who happens to be a City politician/office holder.

Apparently, she was not playing a "race card" because it's obvious what happened was validated by Fair St. Louis. Ms. Jones made an observation, tweeted about it, Fair St. Louis addressed it with a seemingly plausible explanation and has agreed to work with Ms. Jones in the future if she desires.

Case closed, end of story, the end.
I also noticed how segregated the crowds were when I was there. But, I guess it's hard to find musical acts for the fair with a lot of cross-genre support. The main vs side stage issue is fair though, I think.
I believe the black acts should be moved to the main stage actually when I think about it. You are much more likely to get whites to go see black acts than you are to get blacks to go see white acts. Nowadays, whites are generally a little more open-minded when it comes to checking out different music genres. Black acts can have cross racial appeal where white acts generally do not appeal to blacks unless they are working in a strict black genre of music. So in that sense, you can fill a crowd better with a black act even if it is County Fair material.

Case closed.
leeharveyawesome wrote:
I believe the black acts should be moved to the main stage actually when I think about it. You are much more likely to get whites to go see black acts than you are to get blacks to go see white acts. Nowadays, whites are generally a little more open-minded when it comes to checking out different music genres. Black acts can have cross racial appeal where white acts generally do not appeal to blacks unless they are working in a strict black genre of music. So in that sense, you can fill a crowd better with a black act even if it is County Fair material.

Case closed.

LOL! You really don't care how bad you make yourself seem. Wow. Just Wow. I'm entertained.
I think leeharvey has a point. This is evidenced, I believe, by the relative lack of Black acts in the rock and country genres while there are a plethora of White acts performing Black music, particularly under the heading of Pop. Furthermore, you just don't see the scads of Black people lining up to see the rock and country acts like you do White people lining up for many of the big name contemporary Black acts. I think it has been this way for a while now. There are of course, numerous great examples of the contrary, but in general, this seems to be the trend.

In regard to how this played out at the fair, I am somewhat in the dark as I did not attend. Musiq Soulchild and En Vogue are not the big name contemporary Black acts that are likely to draw a largely mixed audience, regardless of their immense talents (Hold On was a fantastic single), and shade is nice, but I can also understand how some or even many might feel slighted to be relegated to a side stage, while the main stage sat empty, as I understand was the case.
^ Yeah you said it. I think maybe it set off some red flags for Arch City to see a minority potentially referred to as "closed-minded". It struck him as some sort of injustice.

What I mean is black people, in any real numbers other than accidentally wandering by, aren't going to show up for rock, punk, metal, indie rock, country, bluegrass, new wave, industrial, Fishbone, Mumford and Sons, Vampire Weekend, anything on Pitchfork except the hip-hop, lounge, black metal, sea shanties, Cannibal Corpse, noise rock, no wave, garage, Iggy Pop, even jazz and blues for anyone under 40 is questionable.

They want Urban Rnb pop music and hip-hop. And plenty of white people can help fill out those crowds. This is obvious.

Sometimes I don't have the time to make all my posts palatable for Generation Wussy! Sorry! :D
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Some days, I tire of playing the game, but today, I have some energy to do it.

Leeharvey is a bigot. It's that simple. And just like bigots always do, they use obtuse distractions to confuse the real issues pertaining to race or religion. It’s never about their bigotry. It’s always about “those people” and how “they” need to acquiesce to other mainstream culture and interests. Never mind that people are different regardless of race, creed or color.

First, there are blacks who love rock and country. I have an African-American buddy with lots of country music in his collection (Garth, Blake etc.). I have plenty of rock - particularly soft rock and 80's rock music in my collection and on my playlists. I love Foreigner, Styx, Chicago, The Cars, Fleetwood Mac, Men at Work, Steely Dan, The Doobie Brothers (with St. Louis' own Michael McDonald), Ambrosia etc. I am not trying impress anyone by saying this because I don't give a damn. I'm simply trying to enlighten. I'm black and you don't know me, my buddy or the scores of other African-Americans who have musical interests outside of R&B and Hip-Hop. Not all people of Mexican descent like mariachi music. Not all black people like R&B. Not all white people like grunge, rock or country. However, music is the universal language.

Seriously......get a life.

And by the way, I have never been to a Fleetwood Mac or Doobie Brothers concert nor have I been to see Chaka Khan or Lil' Wayne featuring Nicki Minaj in concert. Hell, I haven't even seen Nelly in concert except on TV/cable. But I have seen Chicago and Earth, Wind and Fire live. Just because you don't see an overwhelming number of a certain group of people at a concert or event - it doesn't mean they are uninterested.

For the record, my favorite rock artist is PRINCE and the Minneapolis Sound pioneered by Prince/Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis happens to be my favorite rock sound next to soft rock. Cameo was another black rock/R&B band that was very popular. I think a lot of black (and white) people would feel me. I could educate you all day long on Rock N Roll, but here's something to nibble (See Black Rock Bands)

Further, I have attended hundreds of concerts and live music events featuring all kinds of musicians and artists from many backgrounds – including those at the VP Fair (now Fair St. Louis). I've been to concerts all over the country from New Orleans, Houston, Chicago, Philadelphia, Atlanta etc. I don’t recall seeing a lot of white people at many concerts I’ve attended with such acts like Maze Featuring Frankie Beverly, Ledisi, Erykah Badu, Jill Scott, Angie Stone, Maxwell, The Gap Band, SWV etc. etc. Should anyone surmise that white people are closed-minded and don't like to try different music just because they didn’t pack in the numbers? And by the way, how many white people – particularly in the Midwest - have ever been to a Go-Go or Zydeco music concert or even know what Go-Go or Zydeco music is? Have you ever attended a Go-Go or Zydeco live music event/concert? What does that say about "white" people? Absolutely nothing, but different strokes for different folks.

Anyway.........LeeHarvey shouldn't be so naive with his racial garbage and diatribes. That's the problem with St. Louis and America today. Leeharvey has attempted to distract from his racially loaded and coded comments and has attempted to make Tishaura Jones's honest observations about something else instead accepting the notion that Fair St. Louis mishandled (or misplaced) – although not deliberately according to Fair St. Louis - some black acts at the fair.

Regardless of people's music interests or preferred genres of music, at the end of the day, Fair St. Louis acknowledged that while on the surface it appeared they bungled the placement of some black acts at the fair, that clearly wasn't their intent. I'm sure it won't happen again.

You are what you are...... awesome. Keep up the good work. :D
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How embarrassing for the city. Can't wait for the New York Times/Huffington Post/MSNBC to pick this story up and run with it.

Ugh.
arch city wrote:
Some days, I tire of playing the game, but today, I have some energy to do it.

Leeharvey is a bigot. It's that simple. And just like bigots always do, they use obtuse distractions to confuse the real issues pertaining to race or religion. It’s never about their bigotry. It’s always about “those people” and how “they” need to acquiesce to other mainstream culture and interests. Never mind that people are different regardless of race, creed or color.

First, there are blacks who love rock and country. I have an African-American buddy with lots of country music in his collection (Garth, Blake etc.). I have plenty of rock - particularly soft rock and 80's rock music in my collection and on my playlists. I love Foreigner, Styx, Chicago, The Cars, Fleetwood Mac, Men at Work, Steely Dan, The Doobie Brothers (with St. Louis' own Michael McDonald), Ambrosia etc. I am not trying impress anyone by saying this because I don't give a damn. I'm simply trying to enlighten. I'm black and you don't know me, my buddy or the scores of other African-Americans who have musical interests outside of R&B and Hip-Hop. Not all people of Mexican descent like mariachi music. Not all black people like R&B. Not all white people like grunge, rock or country. However, music is the universal language.

Seriously......get a life.

And by the way, I have never been to a Fleetwood Mac or Doobie Brothers concert nor have I been to see Chaka Khan or Lil' Wayne featuring Nicki Minaj in concert. Hell, I haven't even seen Nelly in concert except on TV/cable. But I have seen Chicago and Earth, Wind and Fire live. Just because you don't see an overwhelming number of a certain group of people at a concert or event - it doesn't mean they are uninterested.

For the record, my favorite rock artist is PRINCE and the Minneapolis Sound pioneered by Prince/Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis happens to be my favorite rock sound next to soft rock. Cameo was another black rock/R&B band that was very popular. I think a lot of black (and white) people would feel me. I could educate you all day long on Rock N Roll, but here's something to nibble (See Black Rock Bands)

Further, I have attended hundreds of concerts and live music events featuring all kinds of musicians and artists from many backgrounds – including those at the VP Fair (now Fair St. Louis). I've been to concerts all over the country from New Orleans, Houston, Chicago, Philadelphia, Atlanta etc. I don’t recall seeing a lot of white people at many concerts I’ve attended with such acts like Maze Featuring Frankie Beverly, Ledisi, Erykah Badu, Jill Scott, Angie Stone, Maxwell, The Gap Band, SWV etc. etc. Should anyone surmise that white people are closed-minded and don't like to try different music just because they didn’t pack in the numbers? And by the way, how many white people – particularly in the Midwest - have ever been to a Go-Go or Zydeco music concert or even know what Go-Go or Zydeco music is? Have you ever attended a Go-Go or Zydeco live music event/concert? What does that say about "white" people? Absolutely nothing, but different strokes for different folks.

Anyway.........LeeHarvey shouldn't be so naive with his racial garbage and diatribes. That's the problem with St. Louis and America today. Leeharvey has attempted to distract from his racially loaded and coded comments and has attempted to make Tishaura Jones's honest observations about something else instead accepting the notion that Fair St. Louis mishandled (or misplaced) – although not deliberately according to Fair St. Louis - some black acts at the fair.

Regardless of people's music interests or preferred genres of music, at the end of the day, Fair St. Louis acknowledged that while on the surface it appeared they bungled the placement of some black acts at the fair, that clearly wasn't their intent. I'm sure it won't happen again.

You are what you are...... awesome. Keep up the good work. :D


While you were rocking that Foreigner cassette in the late 80s I was probably at a Public Enemy show. Prince is my favorite too! Well, the early stuff anyway.

I guess that makes us practically brothers.

Anyway, have a nice weekend.