The State of Downtown

New and changing stores, restaurants, and businesses in the City of St. Louis
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robertn42 wrote:
Fri Oct 20, 2017 10:47 am
Chalupas54 wrote:
Thu Oct 19, 2017 7:35 pm
I may get pounced on for this, but I really think Downtown St Louis is nice. I’ve not once heard someone say our downtown core is gross. I always find the CBD to be very clean compared to other downtowns. Yes, downtown lacks. But it’s certainly the “worst”. I’d say our downtown is very similar to Cleveland.

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I completely agree. It could definitely be better, but speaking in hyperbole about how "it's the worst in the US" is crazy and wrong.
Better than Buffalo! (But worse than Cleveland!) Seriously, it's not the worst in the nation and we are still a major downtown imo but not nearly where we should be and lagging almost all our peers. It really isn't that controversial a statement. Take Cleveland... Again, it has a higher residential and office worker base and it shows.... sure it isn't Manhattan and not even Minneapolis but they actually have shops in their Arcades. A couple CVSs, a furniture store, multiple clothing shops. And a not nearly what-it-used-to-be-but-still-there-regional mall. The market is speaking and telling us that there is not yet confidence retailers can make money. I just can't take claims that we're middle of the pack seriously.until we see retailers coming in, and somehow more have been closing in recent years than opening despite our having so few remaining. Gotta up our daytime population.
St.Louis needs a significant positive movement! Reasoning i say this i feel theres so much negative energy here despite all the reasonably good developments happening here the negatives far outweigh anything good happening here we need to change badly.
Need to put a positive vision into motion.
St.Louis is better than this!
Not sure how long these projects will take to complete, but it sure is nice to see multiple projects in the heart of the CBD in full swing... LaSalle Building, Mercantile Library, Union Trust, 900 block Locust conversions. With a couple of upcoming retail openings slated and the re-opening of the Arch Grounds access finally in sight in Spring, I think we'll have made some real progress in terms of re-activating a couple of stretches that were pretty much dead zones and finally being able to see what the Arch investments will bring in terms of access and enjoyment.

While I don't consider them being in the core CBD, things like BPV construction and Jefferson-Arms will be icing on the cake if they're underway next year. Who knows. maybe we'll even get a couple big jobs announcements and things will really be churning down there.
Hotel Hoedown

Under Construction
Hotel Indigo - LaSalle Building
Hotel Saint Louis (Marriott Autograph Collection)- Union Trust Building
Last Hotel - International Shoe Building
Live! By Loews - Ballpark Village New Construction

Incentives Approved
AC Hotel - Jefferson Arms Building
Hyatt Hotel - Municipal Courts Building
Fairfield Inn - Market Street New Construction
Downtown St. Louis has so many hotels already and that's a good thing.
matguy70 wrote:
Thu Jan 18, 2018 11:00 pm
Downtown St. Louis has so many hotels already and that's a good thing.
Believe when you do the room count of the new rooms it pretty much equates to the number of rooms loss when the Millineum shuttered it doors or slightly more

But as you note Matguy, definitely a good thing that is happening as the range of offerings, brands and independent boutique hotels is making it only better experience and should keep a lot more interested in staying downtown. Now if Drury would pull the landing trigger and go all in on a hotel/residential tower on its property.
How many rooms will be removed from the market when the City Center Hotel (formerly Sheraton) closes? ... souri.html
^ looks like 288 rooms. is it closing?
STLrainbow wrote:
Fri Jan 19, 2018 8:25 am
^ looks like 288 rooms. is it closing?
It's certainly in decline.
bprop wrote:
Fri Jan 19, 2018 7:17 am
How many rooms will be removed from the market when the City Center Hotel (formerly Sheraton) closes? ... souri.html
I don't know, but those will be some cool apartments when it closes. Great Views!
People I've talked to personally really liked the Sheraton/City Center. But perhaps it's been a steep decline. Always strikes me as crazy that in this hotel boom downtown, no major developer/chain has tried to pick up that building and make it grand again.
So with all the boatload of projects going on, what's the State of Downtown? Is it a State of Optimism? Anxiety? State of Please, Please Don't Let a Recession Hit?
Downtown badly needs an identity and more people.
^ let's steal from the Metro campaign and use the slogan "Downtown, Not All of Use It But All of Us Need It!"

anyway, it's gonna take more companies wanting to be downtown to get significantly more people... it can be done but we need some leaders to step up. Hopefully this Amazon result will have more corporate honchos have that sink into their heads.
STLrainbow wrote:
Fri Jan 19, 2018 10:26 am
^ let's steal from the Metro campaign and use the slogan "Downtown, Not All of Use It But All of Us Need It!"
Let's steal from the great John F. Kennedy and use the slogan:

"Ask not what your sh*thole can do for you, ask what you can do for your sh*thole".
^^Anxious optimism.

Optimism: The multiple hotel redevelopment projects, Arch grounds completion and significant Stadium area residential developments are going to be a solid late-cycle shot in the arm for Downtown.

Anxiety: Downtown has been late to the party this economic cycle. One hopes/worries that some of these key projects that can move the needle and make up for some lost time get completed or at least financed and underway before another slow down. The recent fiscal stimulus out of Washington should help keep things going though - just as DT investment seems to be picking back up.
Change downtown streets all to two way. Raise the taxes on parking lots a lot. Use that money to greatly enhance the pedestrian experience in downtown (better crosswalks, better lighting, art, etc.)
I recently stayed at the City Center for a night on the town and wow it was a sad affair. First of all parking was like $18 which is understandable but damn. Then we had to use the stairs to get up to our room on an upper floor because all of the elevators were broken. The room was clean but very worn, the atrium was extremely dated. Plus the pool was extremely nasty and looked like it hadn't been cleaned in days.

With all these new hotels moving into the market I wouldn't be surprised to see this one fail. Just the sheer difference in quality between the time I went when it was a Sheraton, and after the name was dropped was astounding.

Hopefully somebody can rescue this hotel/building and we don't have another Millennium Hotel scenario on our hands.
Here's a summary of the region's office market (not just downwtown): ... ce-market/
The state of downtown is dire. From needing new retail options to needing streets completely rebuilt to needing new residential construction from all sizes. To ever change perceptions billions need to go in from all over downtown to N Tucker and the Stan Musial Bridge, Downtown west.
Downtown has come a long long ways from being left for dead however whats being done isn't enough our local companies really need to make investments in downtown theres no excuse's
Its the simple truth downtown St.Louis looks very stale compared to most other downtowns.
Dire may be going a bit too far but there's no doubt it has a long ways to go. I guess the question is how much will the projects the underway move the needle and generate even more redevelopment in its wake. But unfortunately while a lot will be under construction this year not a whole lot actually will be coming online.
I believe three will be finished:
--80+ apartments Level on Locust
--12+ apartments above Hotel STL
--Monogram units

Plus continued expansion in Laclede Bldg. Possibly Laclede's Landing apartments...?
If you visited the Downtown Multimodal and North-South MetroLink open house you saw the incredible vision and possibility. Miles and miles of protected bike lanes, pedestrian improvements, traffic improvements, light rail stations, etc.

If anyone from Downtown STL Inc, SLDC, or the City is reading this... PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE propose a new sales or property tax and bond this infrastructure out! If you can build what I saw today by 2023, Downtown St. Louis could very well be the most accessible neighborhood in the Midwest. Don't let the multimodal plan sit!
Isn't the point of the expansion (metrolink) that we have already approved tax increases that are being collected to fund the N/S line?
newstl2020 wrote:
Fri Jan 19, 2018 11:05 pm
Isn't the point of the expansion (metrolink) that we have already approved tax increases that are being collected to fund the N/S line?
Yep. But I wouldn't be annoyed if Downtown wanted to get a head start. More specifically, I'd want them to bond out the bike and pedestrian improvements first.